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Deacon_Joseph
Guest
Elijah going into heaven on a chariot of fire; is that to be interpreted completely in the literal form, or is it only symbolic, or is it some other type of literature interpretation? Thanks for any help.
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Mels
Guest
I did some research into this recently (more specifically it was on Enoch but Elijah was mentioned) - you can interpret it literally as a sort of prefiguring of the ascension of Christ/assumption of Mary. I’m not quite sure, though.
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NHInsider
Guest
I think it means that Elisha saw Elijah caught up in what appeared to be a chariot of fire. Does that mean there was a literal chariot?? Not necessarily. Is it a symbolic chariot? Not necessarily.
The Apostles saw Jesus ascending on the clouds - does that mean that somehow He could ride a cloud to heaven, or that heaven is literally “up in the sky?” No, it means that that is how He chose to show it to the Apostles - something they could understand. Just like when angels appear to humans, they take on human form (like the ones at the Tomb on Easter morning. Doesn’t mean they actually have bodies, we know the don’t. But we’re finite and God makes accommodations for us. Which is not exactly saying it’s symbolic nor that it is “literal” in a hard physical sense.
Not sure I’m articulating this well . . .
The Apostles saw Jesus ascending on the clouds - does that mean that somehow He could ride a cloud to heaven, or that heaven is literally “up in the sky?” No, it means that that is how He chose to show it to the Apostles - something they could understand. Just like when angels appear to humans, they take on human form (like the ones at the Tomb on Easter morning. Doesn’t mean they actually have bodies, we know the don’t. But we’re finite and God makes accommodations for us. Which is not exactly saying it’s symbolic nor that it is “literal” in a hard physical sense.
Not sure I’m articulating this well . . .
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NotWorthy
Guest
My vote is for literal. Do we have a clue why it should be considered symbolic? Or what the symbolism might mean?
I mean, it may be true that one doesn’t often see a flaming chariot come down from the clouds and return, but one also doesn’t often see someone being caught up into heaven. Should that be questioned, then?
I mean, it may be true that one doesn’t often see a flaming chariot come down from the clouds and return, but one also doesn’t often see someone being caught up into heaven. Should that be questioned, then?
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catholic1seeks
Guest
If it was literal, where would he GO in the chariot? Heaven’s not in the sky…
Would the chariot blink away?
I also don’t understand Jesus’ ascension. He went up with clouds around him? Wouldn’t that leave an impression on the apostles of a pagan heaven (heaven in the sky…)?
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NotWorthy
Guest
Couldn’t it be a real life incident, taking part in the prevailing beliefs, to teach us what really happened.
The ancient Jews thought there were 3 heavens (as Paul spoke about in 2nd Corinthians, chapter 10 or 11). The first heaven is the sky and clouds. The second heaven is the blue canopy above the clouds. The third heaven is where God and the angels dwell. Jesus ascending into the clouds and seated at the right hand of the Father would have been something our feeble minds could grasp.
To me, it would be like the story of creation. The ancient Hebrews could grasp the 6 day creation story, but not a creation that took place over millions and billions of years. But it teaches the bottom line truth - that God created the world.
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Steven_John
Guest
I don’t think the need is important to discern for us all if it is literal or metaphoric, the result of the teaching will be the same.
Jesus (pbwh) teaches our faith bring results, if you believe it literal than it can be, if you believe it metaphoric it can be but both have the same end result.
For me the chariot is a vehicle to get us where we are going, example is the prayer over the blessed sacrament is the chariot that brings the living presence of Jesus (pbwh) into the physical dimension. Sincerely look with faith and you will see the chariot.
A rabbi who’s instruction to me told me in ancient times Jewish mystical practitioners were called (yoreedei merkevah) those who descend in the chariot. There were and are teachings only shared with few considered worthy, over 40 and married etc. because of the implications of heavy doctrine they are not given to all for fear of abuse.
Dont get hung up on descend in the chariot as i did in latter years it became ascend, to rise in the higher realms.
If one reflects on the deepness of the rosary mystery of Jesus (pbwh) being found in the temple they may see that the elders were impressed by this boy who spake from the cradle and would have fed him real bread (revealed chariots).
Much needed food for his mission to come.
When we “ride the chariots” God increases our awareness. Awareness plus the expansion in knowledge of who the Deity of Jesus (pbwh) is, was and will be. (His / Her / Its infiniteness in truth only) is what makes miracles. In the world of science, spiritism, and fantasy today they go uncollected or better put unrealised, as they are ever present existing b4 the creation of now.
I may seem to have strayed from the chariot but like the posted b4 me i am very interested in the interpretation of the scripture by the people of its time, not disregarding its value to our time.
I pray God brings blessing to your life from this post, sorry i am so bad at English writing
Jesus (pbwh) teaches our faith bring results, if you believe it literal than it can be, if you believe it metaphoric it can be but both have the same end result.
For me the chariot is a vehicle to get us where we are going, example is the prayer over the blessed sacrament is the chariot that brings the living presence of Jesus (pbwh) into the physical dimension. Sincerely look with faith and you will see the chariot.
A rabbi who’s instruction to me told me in ancient times Jewish mystical practitioners were called (yoreedei merkevah) those who descend in the chariot. There were and are teachings only shared with few considered worthy, over 40 and married etc. because of the implications of heavy doctrine they are not given to all for fear of abuse.
Dont get hung up on descend in the chariot as i did in latter years it became ascend, to rise in the higher realms.
If one reflects on the deepness of the rosary mystery of Jesus (pbwh) being found in the temple they may see that the elders were impressed by this boy who spake from the cradle and would have fed him real bread (revealed chariots).
Much needed food for his mission to come.
When we “ride the chariots” God increases our awareness. Awareness plus the expansion in knowledge of who the Deity of Jesus (pbwh) is, was and will be. (His / Her / Its infiniteness in truth only) is what makes miracles. In the world of science, spiritism, and fantasy today they go uncollected or better put unrealised, as they are ever present existing b4 the creation of now.
I may seem to have strayed from the chariot but like the posted b4 me i am very interested in the interpretation of the scripture by the people of its time, not disregarding its value to our time.
I pray God brings blessing to your life from this post, sorry i am so bad at English writing
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