Embracing a difficult teaching

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Hello everyone, I have this question about faith I wanted to clarify. I find it a bit of a difficult to embrace. Basically from what I understand, this post states that when one is in mortal sin, they are devoid of sanctifying grace meaning their works and deeds are dead even if they go to confession afterwards (note we’re referring to works/deeds done without sanctifying grace). If it’s any consolation God hears their prayers (though he may not necessarily answer them) but other than that, anything and everything good they do doesn’t matter and is meaningless. I think I know the answer but I’m not liking it. Why must their efforts be in vain? (On another note, is this the Church’s struggle, a lack of grace, or more correctly, graces that are not being accpeted?)
 
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Here is the link from the post. I’ll have to chop it up, unfortunately, excuse the long read.
Praying in the state of mortal sin - #10 by Fr_Destoop
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Fr_Destoop
Apr '08
First of all, if there is any question as to whether or not God hears the prayers of a person in mortal sin, St Thomas Aquinas said that God certainly does. Quoting St Augustine who was referring to the Parable of the Pharisee and the Publican, St Thomas said, “If God were not to hear sinners, the publican would have vainly said, ‘Lord, be merciful to me a sinner’.” A person who is not in the state of grace can pray for the grace of conversion, and when asked for with humility, confidence and perseverance, he can indeed obtain it. St Thomas said, although he cannot merit anything (because merit is a right to a reward and is thereby related to divine justice), his prayer for conversion is nevertheless heard because it is addressed to God’s mercy. A person’s prayers for the grace of conversion would be more effective if he has the intention to go to Confession as soon as possible because it embodies the contrition necessary to receive God’s grace.

Can a person merit an increase of grace if he is not in the state of grace?

When a person is not in the state of grace he cannot merit an increase in grace by asking for it in prayer, for as St Alphonsus Liguori said, “In order to obtain God’s graces by prayer, it is necessary, first, to take away sin.” The reason for this, as St Thomas Aquinas said, is, “Neither prayer nor any other virtuous act is meritorious without sanctifying grace.”

Are prayers more efficacious when sanctifying grace is in a person’s soul?

St James considers that a person’s prayers do indeed bear more fruit when he is reconciled to God, for he said, “the heartfelt prayer of a good man works very powerfully.” Since it is understood within the context of St James’ words that a “good man” clearly refers to someone in the state of grace, then such a person’s heartfelt prayers, provided that he is not lacking in humility, are indeed more efficacious.

Does penance have any merit when a person is in mortal sin?

St Teresa said, “Nothing helps such a soul … all the good works it might do while in mortal sin are fruitless for the attainment of glory.” She explains:

Since these works do not proceed from that principle, which is of God … and are separated from Him, they cannot be pleasing in His sight.

Does the penance and good works a person offers to God while he is in mortal sin become meritorious after he goes to Confession?
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St Thomas Aquinas said that this is not possible because without God’s grace we cannot merit anything: “Works generically good done without charity are said to be dead on account of the lack of grace and charity.” He verifies this by quoting St Paul: “If I give away all I have, and if I deliver my body to be burned, but have not love, I gain nothing.” Since God is love, St Thomas understands not having love in this context as not being in union with God. He concludes, “Therefore, it is impossible for dead works [works done in mortal sin] to be quickened [become meritorious] by Penance.”

In summary, there are numerous reasons to suggest that if a person has seriously neglected to go to Confession, he may be missing out on a number of benefits identified in the last two chapters because:

1 if he is in mortal sin all the penance and good works he did in the past when he was in the state of grace are “deadened,” that is, they no longer have merit;

2 for as long as he is not in the state of grace (i) the penance and good works he does in that state are “dead,” that is, they make no reparation for his sins, neither are they effective to win eternal life; and (ii) a good Confession does not render these dead works to have any merit;

3 the longer he is not in the state of grace, the less time and opportunity he has to gain merit for himself and others and to grow in the supernatural virtues.

However, when he makes a good Confession, the good works he did in the state of grace in the past are restored and given back. He is also able to gain graces for himself and others once more through prayer and good works, provided that he performs them with love for God and with a good intention.

These words are taken from chapter 11 of a book entitled, “The Gift of Confession: A Positive Approach to the Sacrament of Reconciliation” by Fr Michael de Stoop published by Connor Court. It consits of 24 other chapters, each describing a particular benefit this sacrament affords.
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As I said before, I’m bothered by this teaching yet it does seem like a necessary one.
 
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Only God can really say with certainty whether we are in Mortal sin; men can err in judging. If you are trying to get onto the right path and really seek to change then you are already on the way to salvation. Once you have grasped this reality and gone to confession and been absolved, make a stations of the cross which will give you a plenary indulgence. After that live in Christ and love your neighbour

Caritate non ficta
 
This teaching is a very legalistic approach to sin and merit and I think the point of it was to emphasize that if you are in mortal sin, you need to go to confession. You can’t somehow do a bunch of good works or penance and “compensate” for your sin.

As you said, this teaching seems necessary because otherwise people would run around in mortal sin for life and just figure they could do enough good works to “buy” their way out of the sinful condition.

However, as the previous poster said, only God can determine if somebody is truly in a state of mortal sin. There are a million reasons why somebody might be confused about their sin-state or just not be sure. If someone does not truly have the desire to separate themself from God but through some weakness, bad choice, circumstances falls into a grave sin, they might not truly be in a state of mortal sin. If they are still interested in sincerely doing penance and good works, that doesn’t sound like somebody likely to be in mortal sin, to me, but I’m not God and He is the judge.

Now, let’s assume that the person was in mortal sin and that all the good works and penance they did while in mortal sin were no good. The person confesses and proceeds to live a good life going forward. Would not a loving God restore so much grace to the person it would be like 10 times whatever he would have had on his own through penance and works? God’s not stingy with grace and He would rejoice like the father of the Prodigal Son, giving all kinds of wonderful gifts. So it doesn’t matter if the person lost out on some merits while they were sinning. God will give you everything you need and more when you just go to confession and come back.

And finally, the whole idea that you have to rack up a bunch of penance and good works and have a big list of merits when you go up to Heaven is pretty Jansenistic. St. Therese of Lisieux basically said that no matter what we manage to do down here, no matter how long our “list” of meritorious penance and works is, it’s not going to be enough to atone for our sins. So we must do those things for others, not to gain merit for ourselves, and then at the end trust in God’s Mercy to save us.

If you were doing meritorious things like praying for others, donating to charity etc while you were in mortal sin (or even when you weren’t), then people were benefiting from your prayers and poor people were getting food and shelter and so forth, even if you weren’t getting anything for yourself. So it should be all good in the end. As long as you go to Confession and come back at some point.
 
RCIAGraduate said:
As I said before, I’m bothered by this teaching yet it does seem like a necessary one.
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All this is more of a theological hypothesis than what I would call a teaching of the Church. It’s a secondary hypothesis that tries to support the truth of the importance of confession.

But as other posters have said, and IMO, it’s an overly legalistic interpretation of theological speculation that has since been challenged, if not invalidated, by Pope Francis.
 
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I am going to go with the “theological hypothesis” thought on this. According to the above quote, if in a state of mortal sin, one prays for others, it will not be heard. That doesn’t seem like anything I have ever heard…
 
RCIAGraduate said:
this post states that when one is in mortal sin, they are devoid of sanctifying grace meaning their works and deeds are dead even if they go to confession afterwards
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Merit can be simply defined as “Divine reward for the practice of virtue.” When a person does a meritorious work, it means that work produces in them an increase of grace and counts towards their obtaining the reward of heaven. But when a person is in a state of mortal sin, they are devoid of sanctifying grace, and cannot enter heaven. By the very fact that they are devoid of grace, they are incapable of increasing in it and meriting any kind of supernatural reward. But once a person is restored to a state of sanctifying grace, all their previous merits that they gained at times when they were in a state of grace are restored to them, and they are again able to perform actions that are meritorious of heaven.

“Merit” itself is Church teaching, but as it can be difficult to understand, here are some resources I hope would be helpful in clarifying its meaning:
A quick dictionary definition: Dictionary : MERIT | Catholic Culture
A Catholic Answers article: What the Early Church Believed: Reward and Merit | Catholic Answers

People in a state of mortal sin can still pray, and their prayers can be effective. Their prayers won’t merit them an increase in sanctifying grace (because they have none to begin with), but their prayers could help other people or help them receive the actual graces they need in order to repent and return to a state of sanctifying grace.
 
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Blessedwithfive said:
According to the above quote, if in a state of mortal sin, one prays for others, it will not be heard.
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I’m sure the prayer for others would be heard in terms of granting benefits to them.
It just wouldn’t accrue any merit for the person doing the praying. Usually when we pray for others, we get some kind of grace ourselves…in this case the person wouldn’t get any grace for themself.
 
TheLittleLady said:
I do not know who this is, is he your pastor?
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Fr. Michael de Stoop is a Catholic apologist who has written books on the subject of confession. I presumed that’s who Fr. Destoop was. Also, most of what he is saying is quoting from Doctors of the Church, who are not infalliible of course, but this is not just “one priest’s opinion”.
 
Ah, the name does not ring a bell with me. Some googling shows me he is a priest in Sydney. Maybe more well known down under?

Preaching to the choir, even doctors of the Church had some very odd opinions about things, they are not infallible. The Treasury of Merit is a complex teaching, it is not something that can be grasped by one article.

@RCIAGraduate, mortal sin does sever our relationship with God. Confession brings us back into that friendship.

I can speak from life experience, when I am in mortal sin, I’m not inclined to do works of mercy or to pray. As I just read from someone last night, sin is to our soul like leprosy is to the body. It makes us numb so we are more apt to sin and damage ourselves over and over.

It can be difficult to imagine when we love God with all of our heart how we could intentionally sever that relationship. In the same way, when a couple is newlywed and so in love they cannot imagine having an extramarital affair that would sever their relationship, but, sometimes it happens.

The best part is to remember there is mercy and healing waiting in the Confessional.

Maybe Dr Hahn’s “Lord, Have Mercy” would be a good book?
 
I think it would help if RCIA_Graduate could explain a little more what was troubling about the teaching on “merit”. Maybe that would help to get better answers.

Also, I tried to read that Jimmy Akin reference and the other one you posted, Little Lady. My head exploded about three paragraphs in.
I fear I will never understand Protestants. Seem to take a simple thing and make it more complicated than the tax code for no good reason. I am a bear of little brain.
 
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