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japhy said:
I’m not trying to start a fight here, I’m just still trying to reconcile your “Religion:” status with your statements. Does your statement here mean that you don’t believe the Church can make infallible pronouncements on doctrine, as she purports to have done at many ecumenical councils and on some occasions through the Pope himself?
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Then don’t start one. That is what I believe
 
Sailor_Kenshin said:
Holy Mother Church does pre-date the Bible.
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Thats great Sailor and I love you with the love of the Lord Oh and this thread is about something besides me, so if you all have nothing better to do than pick me apart :sad_bye:
 
it is so sad to me that it is news to so many folks that the following is true:

Being Catholic = accepting, believing in, and doing your best to follow Church Teaching
 
tweetymom said:
Then don’t start one. That is what I believe
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So, then, you do not believe in the infallibility of the Church and the authority of the Holy Father in matters of Faith and morals and his governance of the sacred liturgies of the Church?

It is a fair question to ask, especially of someone who claims to be involved in the Church’s liturgical ministry as an EMHC.

With all due respect, you are the one who opened herself to this question based on the statements that you have made in this thread.

Just slightly off-topic, but, I am going to temporarily retire from this thread. Granted, I have much to say, but, while the spirit is willing, my flesh, or, in this case, my head, is not. I have been writing with an excrutiating migraine and cannot type for much longer. I need enough energy to get home. Once I am feeling better, I will check back into the thread, assuming that it is not closed.

Tweetymom, please reconsider what you have written and read the documents. With all due respect, such statements that you are making are discouraging to hear and pain me a lot more than this migraine.
 
FromTheAshes777 said:
um, maybe I’m really missing something here, but did the CDWDS not state pretty explicitely in the documents posted that EMHC’s giving blessings is not to be done? I think they did, or did I really really drastically misread what was posted?:confused:

I think that if they state this, then all Catholics should obey this correct? We all know that no bishop, priest or anyone else has the authority to differ on this matter from the Magisterium. So what exactly is the argument? :confused:

They are supposed to be THE authority when it comes to this matter.

Let’s go with what these documents say and respect their authority. 👍
Praise God that He has given us His Church to speak to us infallibly on faith and morals. 🙂
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The argument is about everything other than what the OP, Lepanto (moved thread) asked. 🙂
 
Brendan said:
Well TR, here is what the CDWDS DID say on the matter

And

So where exactly do they say that a Bishop has the authority to allow either of the two items issued above?
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Brendan said:
And, I would also bring to everyone’s attention, the teachings of Vatican I

Pastor Aeternus Sec 3, para 2

In other words, we are bound by obedience to the instructions of the Holy See, both in matters of Faith, and also in Church governance. That would include determining who, and who is not, entitled to give Blessings and when.
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Hi Brendan
Your post which unfortunately chopped out in this manner are correct, except to cut only a partial from the CDWDS letter. The primary issue is not whether to obey, the issue is the CDWDS chose to “limit itself to the following observations” it did not call on the laity to rise up against the Bishops. The issue concerning extraordinary ministries could certainly use clarification. It is clear the plan was to limit the use of extraordinaries to the minimum amount necessary, but that is a long way from stopping blessing during communion. The CDWDS is the right place and they specifically avoid a definite ruling, in fact they avoided a definite opinion, they wrote 5 current teachings affect the issue.
 
If I were an EMHC and someone approached me for a blessing I would simply give them a nod and then make eye contact with the next person coming forward to recieve Communion. If the person remained standing in front of me I would quickly whisper to them that, I can only distribute Holy Communion, please see Father **** or Deacon **** if you would like to recieve a blessing after Mass.
 
tweetymom said:
I and my husband do it every Mass that we serve in. In fact I was a lecture at our Deacons funeral and the Bishop was there and yes we did give a blessing to those who wanted it in full view of the Bishop.

Yeah, well my bishop willingly gives Communion to non-Catholics so they ain’t all perfect.

Oh and one more thing I am looking at our schedule as to when we serve and it is called Ministers of the Eucharist.

And my former pastor instructed me to use that term too, but someone else interceded and he conceded that that term was only for the priests and bishops. We now have a new pastor and I use the proper term. Unfortunately, the term ‘extraordinary’ needs to be explained since most people associate it more with “super-duper special” than with “not the normal person who should be doing this”.
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Texas_Roofer said:
That is not what the CDWDS said. No matter how much you mislead the people of these threads by making such claims. Those claims are yours. CDWDS looked directly at this practice and you know what they said, so why hide it? The CDWDS did change the Bishop’s authority on this subject, again that is a claim you make, not a claim the CDWDS makes
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We know what they said and we know what you are getting at. They said they were studying the matter. But they also said that for the time being they wanted to point out the rules that are in force: those rules that benedictgal posted. Some day they may decide to change the rules but at the moment, while they study the issue, the rules they quoted stand. You are the only one who has tried to interpret their letter differently.
 
Non-communicants coming up in the Holy Communion line is VERY common in the USA. I attend Holy Mass at up to 40 parishes in a year, from Colorado to Florida, and I see this practice in nearly every parish.

The problem for the EMHC is that person has come up for something (the blessing) and the Communion Line is not a very practical spot for detailed catechesis. In our parish the EMHC are trained to: smile, look them in the eye, say something nice like: “Jesus loves you”. NO sign of the cross, NO touching on the forehead…nothing that makes the minister appear to be playing at giving a blessing. (and ABSOLUTELY NO crossing with the Blessed Sacrament–which I beleive would constitute Sacrilege because that Benediction is so clearly reserved to clergy).

In the past I have seen a situation where there were critically bad hurt feelings (a teen-age catechumen) when the EMHC actively denied–nodded head no and looked to the next Communicant.

Thanks to Benedictgal for sharing the letter. I have been using a letter of Archbishop Chaput in Denver, but we are not in his Archdiocese and our Archdiocese has not addressed this issue.
 
tweetymom said:
Thats great Sailor and I love you with the love of the Lord Oh and this thread is about something besides me, so if you all have nothing better to do than pick me apart :sad_bye:
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Beloved, this is not about you, but about the infallibility of Holy Mother Church.
 
benedictgal said:
Nice try at wanting to derail me, but, it does not work that way, Newbie. If the priest does not comply, then, after explaining it to him, you go up the chain to the bishop and the CDWDS.

I used the word blessing in quotation marks, Newbie. In any case, I stand by what I have writen.
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I’m not trying to derail you, thank you. I’d like to know one instance of, with this particular problem, where going up the chain of command has resulted in the priest being “forced” to change his procedures i.e. ceasing to give “blessings”.

I know you used the word blessing in your postings, I made mention of it. Apparently you didn’t read my post closely enough to see that I was giving you credit for doing so, rather knee-jerking that I was critisizing you for it.

In any case, the problem is not that a blessing is given in the wrong place in the mass (if done so by EMHCs) because it is really not a blessing, right? The problem is that only those who are actually receiving the Eucharist should bet getting up and doing so, correct? That is my point.
 
Phemie said:
We know what they said and we know what you are getting at. They said they were studying the matter. But they also said that for the time being they wanted to point out the rules that are in force: those rules that benedictgal posted. Some day they may decide to change the rules but at the moment, while they study the issue, the rules they quoted stand. You are the only one who has tried to interpret their letter differently.
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So did the CDWDS say what the priest, deacon or EMHC should do when they are approached by a non-communicant for a “blessing”?
 
tweetymom said:
Because I am Catholic doen’t mean I have to agree to be brainwashed. I believe in the Bilble first.
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OK then, where in the Bible does it say that EMHC’s may give blessings at Communion time?

Or are you relying on extra-Biblical authority such as a priest?
 
Brendan said:
OK then, where in the Bible does it say that EMHC’s may give blessings at Communion time?

Or are you relying on extra-Biblical authority such as a priest?
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Ok then were does it say they can’t?
 
I do not think that this argument is going to go anywhere.

This thread is about blessings in the communion line. It has been clearly established where the official documents of the Church stand on these matters. Like it or not, the Church has a say in the rubrics of its liturgy and they are final.

Tweetymom, if you would like to argue sola scriptura you should start a thread in the Apologetics forum.
 
mwscott said:
I do not think that this argument is going to go anywhere.

This thread is about blessings in the communion line. It has been clearly established where the official documents of the Church stand on these matters. Like it or not, the Church has a say in the rubrics of its liturgy and they are final.

Tweetymom, if you would like to argue sola scriptura you should start a thread in the Apologetics forum.
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Look I do not intend to argue with you or anyone else. The Church is not the Bible. so see ya:wave:
 
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