"Emorgent": Can a Mormon Be an Emergent Christian?

[SedesDomi]

Where must a Mormon draw the line with Emergent theology? A few years ago when I was visiting Grand Rapids, Michigan, I was invited to attend a talk and book signing by Rob Bell. Rob Bell was clearly one of the rising stars of the emerging church conversation, so I was very interested to hear what he had to say. (For the record, it’s very much a live question whether Bell can be considered Emergent, since he pastors one of the largest megachurches in Michigan, sells out Madison Square Garden when he’s in New York, and is into church growth and some other issues that most Emergent folks just don’t care about. But if you only had his books to go on, it’s clear that his theology is heavily influenced by Emergent ideas.) This very earnest young man had people nodding and "mmm"ing as he discoursed on the many ways the evangelical church had failed him and other young people. For most of it, I was right there with him. When he began talking about the institutional Christian church, however, he made a casual statement that would give any Mormon pause: “After all,” he said, as though this were the most obvious thing in the world, “Jesus didn’t come to earth in order to found a church, now did he?”

Well, a huge part of the Mormon story is that he did. Our gospel is not just that he came, served, died, and was resurrected, but that he left us with apostles and prophets, as well as an institution that is itself a means of grace. Mormons cannot not sweep any of that aside.

Ah, so that’s why Mormons and Catholics like each other so much: both believe Jesus intended to establish a Church on Earth.

 

[Byzantine_Wolf]

Oye, the Emergent Church is about as Christian as Islam. They’re only Christian in the sense that their leaders write the word “Jesus” in their books on occasion. I recently read Doug Pagitt’s A Christianity Worth Believing and could not bring myself to believe that that man had sincerely spent any serious time studying scripture.

I got my differences with Mormons, but I would sympathize with them advising their members to avoid this movement.

 

[dianaiad]

Oye, the Emergent Church is about as Christian as Islam. They’re only Christian in the sense that their leaders write the word “Jesus” in their books on occasion. I recently read Doug Pagitt’s A Christianity Worth Believing and could not bring myself to believe that that man had sincerely spent any serious time studying scripture.

I got my differences with Mormons, but I would sympathize with them advising their members to avoid this movement.

Well, the problem with the Emergent Church…which is rapidly becoming confused with “Emerging Church,” is that it is pretty much squishy postmodernism. While attempting to decipher what their beliefs are, I felt very much as if I were reading an article by Derrida translated by Foucault.

Mormons…tend to be a little too practical.

 

[FaithJoy]

One of the most popular Mormons of today, Glenn Beck , sure said some great things about the Pope on Fox Sunday. I don’t know if anyone saw that. He gave credit to the Pope about his stance on liberation theology, against marxism. He also said some great things about the nation coming back to God on 8/28 rally.

 

[Byzantine_Wolf]

One of the most popular Mormons of today, Glenn Beck , sure said some great things about the Pope on Fox Sunday. I don’t know if anyone saw that. He gave credit to the Pope about his stance on liberation theology, against marxism. He also said some great things about the nation coming back to God on 8/28 rally.

I don’t know quite what this has to do with the OP topic. I will say, though, that someday Glenn Beck will have to settle between putting on the face of Evangelicalism and wearing the shirt of Mormonism.

 

[Javl]

I don’t know quite what this has to do with the OP topic. I will say, though, that someday Glenn Beck will have to settle between putting on the face of Evangelicalism and wearing the shirt of Mormonism.

FYI: Keep in mind that Glen Beck was a “Catholic” ( a poorly catechized one ) when he married a Mormon and then became a Mormon. I don’t think that he knows, or realizes anything about either Church.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[lax16]

One of the most popular Mormons of today, Glenn Beck , sure said some great things about the Pope on Fox Sunday. I don’t know if anyone saw that. He gave credit to the Pope about his stance on liberation theology, against marxism. He also said some great things about the nation coming back to God on 8/28 rally.

Isn’t he a former Catholic?

 

[dianaiad]

FYI: Keep in mind that Glen Beck was a “Catholic” ( a poorly catechized one ) when he married a Mormon and then became a Mormon. I don’t think that he knows, or realizes anything about either Church.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

I would not ask Bro. Beck about information about Catholicism. However, I can guarantee that he knows more about his own beliefs than you do.

 

[Todd520]

FYI: Keep in mind that Glen Beck was a “Catholic” ( a poorly catechized one ) when he married a Mormon and then became a Mormon. I don’t think that he knows, or realizes anything about either Church.

I don’t think his wife was Mormon. I heard Glen say they went church shopping, to find a fit for their family. He only visited an LDS service because a best friend twisted his arm into attending one service.

I’d bet he knows a great deal about his LDS faith and knew the minimum about his Catholic faith. As noted in other threads, the LDS have an effective bible study program for adults.

 

[Byzantine_Wolf]

Oh poo, missed one response.

Well, the problem with the Emergent Church…which is rapidly becoming confused with “Emerging Church,” is that it is pretty much squishy postmodernism. While attempting to decipher what their beliefs are, I felt very much as if I were reading an article by Derrida translated by Foucault.

My problem is they either do one of two things.

• Present a vague teaching that has to be deciphered to realize how heretical it is. What I mean is they keep going on and on about a concept that on the surface seems like orthodox Christianity, but when you really dive into what they’re saying and keep reading, you realize how unorthodox it really is. Brian McLaren does this a lot, dancing around the bush until finally ten pages into his diatribe drops a whopper or squeezes a whopper between the lines.
• They like to claim they don’t teach something, then go on to teach the exact thing they weren’t claiming to teach. In the book I was reading by Pagitt, he claimed he wasn’t teaching Jesus wasn’t just a good example of how to live, then explained…how Jesus was just a really good example of how to live.

Then there are the goofy, post-modern stuff like you mentioned. Brian McLaren, in A Generous Orthodoxy, spends like four pages or so apologizing for calling God “He.” In all the blood, sweat and tears of the Church Fathers, I don’t think they ever took time out to apologize to their readers for calling God “He” Call me crazy, but when Jesus Christ refers to God as “Father” and “He,” I’m OK with it.

 

[dianaiad]

Oh poo, missed one response.

My problem is they either do one of two things.

• Present a vague teaching that has to be deciphered to realize how heretical it is. What I mean is they keep going on and on about a concept that on the surface seems like orthodox Christianity, but when you really dive into what they’re saying and keep reading, you realize how unorthodox it really is. Brian McLaren does this a lot, dancing around the bush until finally ten pages into his diatribe drops a whopper or squeezes a whopper between the lines.
• They like to claim they don’t teach something, then go on to teach the exact thing they weren’t claiming to teach. In the book I was reading by Pagitt, he claimed he wasn’t teaching Jesus wasn’t just a good example of how to live, then explained…how Jesus was just a really good example of how to live.

Then there are the goofy, post-modern stuff like you mentioned. Brian McLaren, in A Generous Orthodoxy, spends like four pages or so apologizing for calling God “He.” In all the blood, sweat and tears of the Church Fathers, I don’t think they ever took time out to apologize to their readers for calling God “He” Call me crazy, but when Jesus Christ refers to God as “Father” and “He,” I’m OK with it.

Regarding calling our Father in Heaven 'He…"…you won’t find any Mormons disagreeing with you there.

 

[Byzantine_Wolf]

Regarding calling our Father in Heaven 'He…"…you won’t find any Mormons disagreeing with you there.

I know Hence why Brian McLaren’s theology would confound most orthodox Mormons, and why I can understand if some Mormon leaders or apologists want to distance their church from this movement.

 

[dianaiad]

I know Hence why Brian McLaren’s theology would confound most orthodox Mormons, and why I can understand if some Mormon leaders or apologists want to distance their church from this movement.

To be honest, I don’t think Mormons, or the LDS church, even think about ‘this movement,’ long enough to worry about ‘distancing’ themselves from it. It’s not as if we have ever had any connection in the first place!

 

[Javl]

I would not ask Bro. Beck about information about Catholicism. However, I can guarantee that he knows more about his own beliefs than you do.

That’s possible, but then not what I’ve heard him say on the radio.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Javl]

I don’t think his wife was Mormon. I heard Glen say they went church shopping, to find a fit for their family. He only visited an LDS service because a best friend twisted his arm into attending one service.

I’d bet he knows a great deal about his LDS faith and knew the minimum about his Catholic faith. As noted in other threads, the LDS have an effective bible study program for adults.

He had mentioned on the radio that his wife was Mormon before he married her. As for the study program, that’s fine. The Catholic Church also has one, but unlike most Protestant ones, it is strictly voluntary. All are asked and no one is forced to attend.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[dianaiad]

That’s possible, but then not what I’ve heard him say on the radio.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

You’ve heard him say that you know more about Mormonism than he does on the radio?

 

[dianaiad]

He had mentioned on the radio that his wife was Mormon before he married her. As for the study program, that’s fine. The Catholic Church also has one, but unlike most Protestant ones, it is strictly voluntary. All are asked and no one is forced to attend.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

…and would you care to tell me how any religious school (absent, perhaps, a Madrassah school in Palestine or somewhere…) is anything BUT voluntary?

Do you see big black helicopters hovering around Baptist homes, training automatic weapons on people, forcing plastic restraints on them and frog-marching them to Sunday School?

How about them Mormons, now…do you see the Bishop sending wake up squads around the ward with whips in their hands, forcing teenagers to go to Seminary classes?

In other words, are you flippin’ SERIOUS?

 

[Byzantine_Wolf]

(absent, perhaps, a Madrassah school in Palestine or somewhere…)

Pfft. We’re talking about Glenn Beck, not Ergun Caner.

 

[dianaiad]

Pfft. We’re talking about Glenn Beck, not Ergun Caner.

No, actually (and I had to look Ergum Caner up, and I still don’t quite know what his connection would be to this), I was refering to Javi’s inference that Protestant religious education was not voluntary.

At least in the USA, all religious attendance is voluntary…in fact, it’s becoming a lot harder to worship as you wish than it is NOT to do so.

 

[Byzantine_Wolf]

No, actually (and I had to look Ergum Caner up, and I still don’t quite know what his connection would be to this)

Ergun Caner was a president of apologetics at Liberty University who claimed to have been raised by Muslim radicals to perform a suicide bombing. One of his claims was he grew up in a Turkish madrassa. It later turned out he had a Turkish dad and Swedish mom, moved to Ohio when he was four, grew up in America with no real religion, and pretty much lived the life of your average American teen. When all the realities of his lifestory came out he was removed from his president’s position and now he’s just a professor there.