Enforced tithing

[BnR808]

My in-laws belong to a Pentecostal church that strongly emphasizes, if not mandates, tithing. Every month, there is a church meeting to discuss the church report/finances, and included in the report is a report of each person’s tithe. If someone isn’t giving their tithe, they are called out on it in front of everyone, causing those people to feel embarrassed and guilty. My husband, who is still going to his family’s church (but God-willing, he’s starting to see the errors and is contemplating coming to Mass regularly with me )
has his name called out all the time.

Anyways, the last straw I had with my in-laws church was when we had a phone call saying the kids (my husband’s nieces and nephews) were hungry.

My husband asked where his sister and brother in law were and why they didn’t buy food for the kids. FYI: My sister in law and her husband and their 4 kids all live with my mom/dad in law. They were at the church, we were told, and it wouldn’t have made a difference, because they all just gave their tithing and were broke.

So I’m sitting there, looking at 4 hungry kids, feeling so angry about this all. So we bought some groceries and brought it back to their house, and ordered pizza and sodas for the kids who literally inhaled the pizza. My husband and I aren’t well-off or anything, we have a kid of our own and are living on one income, but I hated to see these kids hungry.

The week after that incident, my mother-in-law started telling me how she feels so good after she does her tithing, that as long as she gives her tithing, she feels at ease and knows blessings will come her way.

okay, so I’m not sure if I want advice or just a space to vent lol, but should I have said anything? And if so, what? I’m well-grounded in the Church’s teaching on offering etc, but for some reason I just sat there nodding lol. I really wanted to say something, but I didn’t want to burst her bubble since she was near tears when she was talking about tithing. Mind you, there have been at least 2 occasions where the kids had to sleep over at my apartment since their electric bill money had gone to their church.

My mother in law frequently has these tithing conversations with me, I think, in hopes of getting me to convince her son to start tithing.

what to say, what to say.

 

[mercygate]

My in-laws belong to a Pentecostal church that strongly emphasizes, if not mandates, tithing. Every month, there is a church meeting to discuss the church report/finances, and included in the report is a report of each person’s tithe. If someone isn’t giving their tithe, they are called out on it in front of everyone, causing those people to feel embarrassed and guilty. My husband, who is still going to his family’s church (but God-willing, he’s starting to see the errors and is contemplating coming to Mass regularly with me )
has his name called out all the time.

Anyways, the last straw I had with my in-laws church was when we had a phone call saying the kids (my husband’s nieces and nephews) were hungry.

My husband asked where his sister and brother in law were and why they didn’t buy food for the kids. FYI: My sister in law and her husband and their 4 kids all live with my mom/dad in law. They were at the church, we were told, and it wouldn’t have made a difference, because they all just gave their tithing and were broke.

So I’m sitting there, looking at 4 hungry kids, feeling so angry about this all. So we bought some groceries and brought it back to their house, and ordered pizza and sodas for the kids who literally inhaled the pizza. My husband and I aren’t well-off or anything, we have a kid of our own and are living on one income, but I hated to see these kids hungry.

The week after that incident, my mother-in-law started telling me how she feels so good after she does her tithing, that as long as she gives her tithing, she feels at ease and knows blessings will come her way.

okay, so I’m not sure if I want advice or just a space to vent lol, but should I have said anything? And if so, what? I’m well-grounded in the Church’s teaching on offering etc, but for some reason I just sat there nodding lol. I really wanted to say something, but I didn’t want to burst her bubble since she was near tears when she was talking about tithing. Mind you, there have been at least 2 occasions where the kids had to sleep over at my apartment since their electric bill money had gone to their church.

My mother in law frequently has these tithing conversations with me, I think, in hopes of getting me to convince her son to start tithing.

what to say, what to say.

Nothing. Keep feeding the kids. Pray for your husband and for your in-laws. Anybody who can weep tears of joy over tithing, and who can affirm not feeding four children because of tithing needs a reality check.

 

[MarieVeronica]

Oh my goodness. My heart goes out to all of you.

The first thought that came to my mind was… would it make God happy… that parents are neglecting their children, to “tithe” to their church? I seriously doubt it. :nope:

Our Good Lord expects us to honor our responsibilities. If we have families, with children… or elderly parents, etc. He EXPECTS us to care for them first. He has entrusted them to our care! We are also expected to meet our own debts. In other words, pay our bills!

Of course, we should all give as much as we can… to help support our parish. And yes, that might mean… that we do not eat out… as often. Or go to the movies as often. And perhaps, the wide screen TV won’t “happen” until next year.

But it should NEVER mean… that kids go hungry! I’m very saddened to hear this. Prayers for them all

 

[BnR808]

Nothing. Keep feeding the kids. Pray for your husband and for your in-laws. Anybody who can weep tears of joy over tithing, and who can affirm not feeding four children because of tithing needs a reality check.

My husband says the same thing – just let them be and help out if needed. It’s just so frustrating!

 

[mercygate]

My husband says the same thing – just let them be and help out if needed. It’s just so frustrating!

Vent it here. Not to them.

(BTW, I was flippin’ furious when I read your post and felt like coming over there and taking out a few teeth.)

 

[mercygate]

Maybe this church they tithe to has a food pantry? If they’re already humiliated at being singled out on the monthly accounting, maybe it wouldn’t hurt so much to accept a little charity?

 

[Matrix_Refugee]

Enforced tithing is a Bad Idea to end all Bad Ideas, and it’s just more fodder for the people who accuse any and all religions of being a get-rich-quick scam. Any church/faith that does this should be avoided at all cost and the leaders who allow this should be ashamed of themselves, if not publicly exposed for forcing people’s kids to go hungry because the parents couldn’t afford to feed them, thanks to the “enforced tithe”. I put ten percent of my paycheck and my disability check aside to give to the Church, but I use that money for things like buying religious books, etc at the local Catholic bookstore connected to a shrine, paying for my counseling sessions at Catholic Charities, etc.

 

[nicolep]

My aunt belonged to a protestant church that required any registered members to provide W-2’s for all working persons in a household. Then, the church decided how much that family was required to tithe. She has since moved on to another protestant church. I’m glad she’s away from the first, but continue to pray she’ll join the Catholic Church!

Sorry…a little off topic. I was furious about this post, too. I’ve seen it happen more times than it should. It’s not only with tithing, but a lot of parents (more and more each day it seems) put many other things above their childrens’ needs. It’s sad and I will keep them all in my prayers.

 

[BnR808]

The first thought that came to my mind was… would it make God happy… that parents are neglecting their children, to “tithe” to their church? I seriously doubt it. :nope:

Our Good Lord expects us to honor our responsibilities. If we have families, with children… or elderly parents, etc. He EXPECTS us to care for them first. He has entrusted them to our care! We are also expected to meet our own debts. In other words, pay our bills!

Last year, the pastor had a month long series on the blessings of tithing. One of his major points was based on Luke 12: 22-23

"Then Jesus said to his disciples: “Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat; or about your body, what you will wear. Life is more than food, and the body more than clothes.”

The pastor stressed that if you worry about your car payment, or rent, or food, then you’d be placing your own concerns over God’s commandment, thus forfeiting any potential blessings. I was at the particular service and saw nearly every head nodding in agreement and a few Amen’s here and there.

mercygate – there isn’t a food pantry. The money goes to pay the mortgage on the church/land. They raise extra money buy having countless fundraisers, most often plate sales. But the money to buy the food, drinks, and supplies comes from the church members pockets so they go even more broke.

 

[mercygate]

Last year, the pastor had a month long series on the blessings of tithing. One of his major points was based on Luke 12: 22-23

"Then Jesus said to his disciples: “Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat; or about your body, what you will wear. Life is more than food, and the body more than clothes.”

The pastor stressed that if you worry about your car payment, or rent, or food, then you’d be placing your own concerns over God’s commandment, thus forfeiting any potential blessings. I was at the particular service and saw nearly every head nodding in agreement and a few Amen’s here and there.

mercygate – there isn’t a food pantry. The money goes to pay the mortgage on the church/land. They raise extra money buy having countless fundraisers, most often plate sales. But the money to buy the food, drinks, and supplies comes from the church members pockets so they go even more broke.

I believe that is what we, in the world, would call “living beyond our means.”

 

[Ramalama]

My husband says the same thing – just let them be and help out if needed. It’s just so frustrating!

Try not to be angry. They just gave you a wonderful opportunity to help someone. God may not be smiling at them, but I’m sure he’s smiling at what you did. God bless you and your family.

 

[1ke]

What I wouldn’t do is give in to their emotional blackmail.

It only reinforces the eroneous idea that God will provide if they sit there doing nothing. “God” is providing in their mind-- since **you **were suckered into buying a bunch of food for them. See, God provided.

Well, they may not be so gullible if they sit there on their duff and you do not give them money, groceries, etc.

You are enabling their delusion by giving them financial help.

 

[Lil_M]

What I wouldn’t do is give in to their emotional blackmail.

It only reinforces the eroneous idea that God will provide if they sit there doing nothing. “God” is providing in their mind-- since **you **were suckered into buying a bunch of food for them. See, God provided.

Well, they may not be so gullible if they sit there on their duff and you do not give them money, groceries, etc.

You are enabling their delusion by giving them financial help.

This would really hurt to do- and I’m not sure how I feel about it with respect to Christian charity (feed the hungry, etc) but it’s definitely a good point. I cannot imagine the thought process for the parents to hand over that money to the church when they need groceries. I’m sorry the OP is in the situation, I’m not sure what I would do It’s hard when it’s family.

 

[cheeto1]

I believe in tithing. I believe in Malachi, bring the whole tithe
into the church. It would be so interesting if you and your
husband were tithing. The reason is because the pentacostal
family is struggling so much. It would make such an impression on them if you could always afford to feed the other kids when
asked. They might think they were tithing to the wrong church.
What if they became Catholic because of that?

Now, about the problem at hand. They probably just love the
pizza, it is a treat. But you don’t want to feel like you’re forced
into it. Next time, why not bring a box of spagetti, some sauce
and a package of hamburger to your in-laws. And I would find
out about any nearby food pantries.

I do not blame their problem on tithing. Where is the other 90%
of their income? When you earn zero, you tithe zero.

 

[Norseman82]

Does anyone else see a possible case of child neglect here?

(BTW, I was flippin’ furious when I read your post and felt like coming over there and taking out a few teeth.)

From whom whom would you be taking out the teeth, the OP or the neglectful parents?

 

[Joan_M]

Tithing is, literally, giving 10%.

If any family gives so much to a church that they are broke when they give their money, then they are doing wrong. Their first responsibility is to their family.

According to the OP, the kids were home, hungry, while their parents were at church. Someone phoned the OP telling them that the children were hungry and that the parents were broke. Something here is drastically wrong!

If I were to help, it would be only food for the kids (nothing for their parents). And, then it would be only that once. I would also have a serious talk with the parents and, quite probably, promise to report them to Social Services if they allowed that foolishness to happen again. :takethat:

 

[Lil_M]

I do not blame their problem on tithing. Where is the other 90%
of their income? When you earn zero, you tithe zero.

some of us have to spend more than the recommended max. 40% of income on living expenses (rent, electricity, etc) which cuts into variable expenses like groceries. That 10% can make a big difference. My husband and I always give the our parish and to other charities but we just can’t do 10% and we aren’t going to go hungry to do so. Does God withhold blessings because we can’t meet a percentage point? No! Just my :twocents:

Sorry a bit off topic OP.

 

[Thorny]

“When you give alms,
do not blow a trumpet before you,
as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets
to win the praise of others.
Amen, I say to you,
they have received their reward.
But when you give alms,
do not let your left hand know what your right is doing,
so that your almsgiving may be secret.
And your Father who sees in secret will repay you.”
(MATT 6)

While I support giving to the Church generously, I seriously question the wisdom of calling out anyone in public on their tithing. The first reason is that it would require a parishioner to violate Jesus’ instruction above. The second reason is that it would open the Church for criticism along the lines of only interested in money.

Considering that the church in question requires a tithe, one has to wonder what the money is going toward. Already, we know that they do not support their own food pantry–do they support one run by multiple churches or the city? Are they paying off a large building debt, indicating they have overstepped their resources? Do they run a full time school? What is the salary of the pastor and staff? (Not to say that all pastors who are rich are wrong, but if they are getting rich without creating a support structure for their members, that is questionable.) Do they even know the financial duress they are putting their flock under?

Now sure, the church in question may not be big and may not have the resources to support all the things other churches do. But public embarrassment about tithing is clearly against Jesus’ teachings. If they are willing to be so blatant about ignoring a clear Biblical teaching, what other things are they violating? Perhaps this is the best way to convince your In-laws to challenge the pastor on the practice, or to leave that particular church.

I would change Churches the first time I ever heard a pastor call out someone in public like this for any type of personal failing. The fact that this pressure becomes a burden on feeding children would quicken my steps.

Blessings.

 

[StratusRose]

Once again, this is Sola Scriptura gone awry. My eyes literally popped out when I read that they call out names to publically embarrass members. How can that be viewed as Christ-like?

Feed the kids, and if the family continues to not feed them I would seriously consider calling CPS.

 

[manualman]

…So I’m sitting there, looking at 4 hungry kids, feeling so angry about this all. So we bought some groceries and brought it back to their house, and ordered pizza and sodas for the kids who literally inhaled the pizza. My husband and I aren’t well-off or anything, we have a kid of our own and are living on one income, but I hated to see these kids hungry.

The week after that incident, my mother-in-law started telling me how she feels so good after she does her tithing, that as long as she gives her tithing, she feels at ease and knows blessings will come her way.

I’m not sure I could have resisted at this point. I’d have had to say something like:
“Yeah, God will provide for you. He’ll probably send one of his faithful catholic families who properly prioritize their finances to rescue you from the consequences of the weird cult you belong to. Oh wait, He already has…”