Entitled to Confession? Someone was angrily shouting in Church, before Mass

[JimG]

In hospitals and nursing homes, these ministers seemed to be always around. I know that from visiting my dad last year at those places. Visitors can get communion there too.

As for confession, there may be a little more to the OP story. I’m not saying this is what happened to him, but I (and perhaps all of us here) have been in confession lines where there was someone taking up considerable amount of time in confession. Let’s face it, one or two people taking up ten to fifteen minutes of a priest’s time can very well cause those at the end of the confession lines a lot of grief and anger because those at the end miss out on the sacrament completely. It’s not justified I know, but we are human and we do get angry.

I have to agree with this as well. When one is in the confession line, and it’s apparent that the line is long and the time is short, it behooves us to keep the confession short! It’s not that hard to do.

 

[JReducation]

In hospitals and nursing homes, these ministers seemed to be always around. I know that from visiting my dad last year at those places. Visitors can get communion there too.

A hospital situation or a nursing home qualifies as one of those normal situations where the sacraments are available on demand or as needed. It either a communion service outside of mass, such as when the cleric or the EMHC brings you communion or it can be the Viaticum.

As for confession, there may be a little more to the OP story. I’m not saying this is what happened to him, but I (and perhaps all of us here) have been in confession lines where there was someone taking up considerable amount of time in confession. Let’s face it, one or two people taking up ten to fifteen minutes of a priest’s time can very well cause those at the end of the confession lines a lot of grief and anger because those at the end miss out on the sacrament completely. And, here we were, wasting all that time making a good examination of conscience in preparation for the sacrament. It’s not justified I know, but we are human and we do get angry.

I can certainly understand the frustration in this situation. It has happened to me. I’ve been at the end of the line when the priest walks out of the confessional and says that he has to leave. But we must never be rude about it.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[ProVobis]

I can certainly understand the frustration in this situation. It has happened to me.

Confessions are supposed to be stress-relieving not stress-causing. I guess we shouldn’t put ourselves into the latter position.

 

[navywendy00]

now don’t get me wrong, as i am new to this forums.catholic-questions.org/images/smilies/redface.gif but wouldn’t this whole problem have been null and void if the man had simply arrived on time?

everyone’s time is valuable…but to throw a hissy fit in the middle of church and DEMAND something like that, is just disrespectful. he should be ashamed of himself!

overall, i feel sorry for him…he has such anger in his heart. but no, by all means you did nothing wrong. if it was me there, i just might have given him a piece of my mind!

 

[JimG]

now don’t get me wrong, as i am new to this forums.catholic-questions.org/images/smilies/redface.gif but wouldn’t this whole problem have been null and void if the man had simply arrived on time?

everyone’s time is valuable…but to throw a hissy fit in the middle of church and DEMAND something like that, is just disrespectful. he should be ashamed of himself!

overall, i feel sorry for him…he has such anger in his heart. but no, by all means you did nothing wrong. if it was me there, i just might have given him a piece of my mind!

Being on time might have solved it, yes. On days when I know there’s going to be a line for confession I try to get there early enough to be among the first five people in line. That means getting there earlier than on time.

 

[navywendy00]

Being on time might have solved it, yes. On days when I know there’s going to be a line for confession I try to get there early enough to be among the first five people in line. That means getting there earlier than on time.

i learned in the military that early is on time, on time is late, and late is unacceptable so yes, i would probably try to be early next time. still, shouting will get you no where

 

[rick43235]

There’s no need to behave like that in Our Lord’s house!!! For goodness’ sake, he was in CHURCH, not the supermarket!!!

That’s not proper behavior for the supermarket either.

 

[acadian]

This whole situation is just ugly - including the man demanding confession for his wife. Let’s just storm into the church and yell to everyone that your wife NEEDS to have her confession heard before she can go to communion. Hey, everyone, my wife has a mortal sin to confess and she is gonna do it NOW (where I can make sure…)

That poor woman! The man obviously has some “control issues”. I would have just died of embarrassment had I been in her shoes.

 

[aspirant]

Where is this “right to confession” written?

Among other places, the Code of Canon Law:

Can. 986 §1. All to whom the care of souls has been entrusted in virtue of some function are obliged to make provision so that the confessions of the faithful entrusted to them are heard when they reasonably seek to be heard and that they have the opportunity to approach individual confession on days and at times established for their convenience.
§2. In urgent necessity, any confessor is obliged to hear the confessions of the Christian faithful, and in danger of death, any priest is so obliged.

The problem with the obnoxious layman making a scene is not that he doesn’t have a right to confession, because he does; the problem was that he was making unreasonable demands and behaving in a completely inappropriate and hostile manner.

 

[CatholicZ09]

Was it stupid to smile & greet the guy? He was in my path. Should I have ignored him? Do you think my greeting made him feel worse, rather than better?

More importantly, if the man complains, which is likely, will Father A or Father B get in some kind of trouble? Were he & his wife, as he said,* entitled* to Confession (& absolution) by Father B today, no matter the date or time?

No, it definately wasn’t wrong to smile and greet the guy. You were just being the kind Catholic woman you are. He was probably still frustrated, so don’t take it personally. I don’t think it made him feel worse, he probably was still mad at Father B.

I really doubt that Father A or Father B will get into trouble. It sounds harsh, but if the man and wife needed confession so bad, they should’ve gotten there earlier. Father B had to say Mass at 4 PM, he couldn’t leave the people waiting for Mass. The man also has to consider how disrespectiful and disruptive he was being in the Lord’s house, first of all, he was disrespecting the people in the church by yelling at the volunteer, which causes noise, and it interrupts/bothers people who are praying. Secondly, it is very disrespectful to our Lord. That’s like going into someones house and starting a fight - very disrespectful. The man went in (and went in late), and he expected to get confession, even by being late. He knew that Father had to say Mass at 4 PM, he should’ve known he should’ve came earlier, or knew he was out of luck.

Also, it’s very disrespectful to the person giving their confession in the confessional. It’s very hard to do that (think of all your sins) whilst someone is screaming right out the door.

The man also should give an apology to the volunteer, Father B, and the person in the confessional. He should also apologize to you and whoever else was in the church for being disruptive, but, I doubt that will happen. Maybe it will, maybe it won’t.

 

[JimG]

Among other places, the Code of Canon Law:

The problem with the obnoxious layman making a scene is not that he doesn’t have a right to confession, because he does; the problem was that he was making unreasonable demands and behaving in a completely inappropriate and hostile manner.

Yes, and nearly every parish does make provision to meet the requirements of the canon by establishing regular confession times. I have seen a few parishes where confessions are heard by appointment only; to me, that does not seem to meet the requirements of the canon. But around here there are a dozen parishes within driving distance where confessions are heard daily.

 

[JReducation]

Yes, and nearly every parish does make provision to meet the requirements of the canon by establishing regular confession times. I have seen a few parishes where confessions are heard by appointment only; to me, that does not seem to meet the requirements of the canon. But around here there are a dozen parishes within driving distance where confessions are heard daily.

Confession by appointment does meet the demands of the canon. The canon says that the sacrament must be made available at reasonable times, meaning reasonable for both the priest and the penitent. When you make an appointment, you are agreeing on a reasonable day and time for you and the priest.

The only problem that I see with confession by appointment is that the anonymity is lost. Obviously, the priest sees your face when you walk into his office, unless he agrees to meet you in the confessional at a certain time and you do not give your name. Those arrangements can be made. I’ve made them. I’ve called a parish and asked the priest, “Father, if I come by at 3:00 can you meet me in the confessional for the sacrament?” They have not asked any questions. They have said yes or can you come at 4:00 instead?

But many people don’t like to make an anonymous appointment. If you make an anonymous appointment, you had better be there on time. The priest is not going to sit in the confessional more than 10 or 15 minutes. Then he leaves. That’s your fault, not his.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[aspirant]

I have seen a few parishes where confessions are heard by appointment only; to me, that does not seem to meet the requirements of the canon.

I think confession by appointment only can meet the requirements of the canon. Whether it does, I think, depends a lot on the circumstances.

The canon says that the sacrament must be made available at reasonable times, meaning reasonable for both the priest and the penitent. When you make an appointment, you are agreeing on a reasonable day and time for you and the priest.

Yes!

The only problem that I see with confession by appointment is that the anonymity is lost. Obviously, the priest sees your face when you walk into his office, unless he agrees to meet you in the confessional at a certain time and you do not give your name. Those arrangements can be made.

Yes, I think arrangements can be made to preserve anonymity, even when confession is done by appointment.

 

[Like]

Yes, I think arrangements can be made to preserve anonymity, even when confession is done by appointment.

Brother JR & Aspirant, How would it be possible in a parish that has NO Confessional booth, such as mine?

Mahalo!

 

[JReducation]

Brother JR & Aspirant, How would it be possible in a parish that has NO Confessional booth, such as mine?

Mahalo!

That IS interesting. I don’t know the answer. I have never seen a parish that does not have a confessional room with the option to go behind the screen or face to face. What do regularly use? Is it that you don’t have a permanent church yet?

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

 

[Like]

That IS interesting. I don’t know the answer. I have never seen a parish that does not have a confessional room with the option to go behind the screen or face to face. What do regularly use? Is it that you don’t have a permanent church yet?

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF

Br. JR, Our parish’s Church is quite old & up until 2003 there were 2 booths with 2 to 4 hours of scheduled confession on Saturday afternoon & well attended. Then it seemed to change overnight with the booths removed. Confessions are in one of the rear offices on Sat. @ 4:15PM to 4:45PM before the 5PM Vigil Mass & the priest sits on a sofa or his desk chair waiting for the next penitent. Or if the Priest is not there you have to ask for one:shrug: Or make an appointment but it is still in one of the offices & no matter what you choose the anonymity is lost.

Basically, we have two times a year for Confessions & that being 1 in Lent & the other during Advent. And is called “Parish Wide Reconciliation”. Meaning the whole Island where all priests (6 to 8) come to our Church to hear confessions. Believe me, these two times is the only time you will see lines, we must have the holiest people in Hawaii.

Oh! you do have a choice of face to face or behind a screen, but before you go behind the screen, the priest has already seen you.

 

[Bluegoat]

Do people feel that anonymity is very important? Since confession is usually always by appointment in Anglican parishes, it is rarely anonymous, and I believe it is not usually anonymous at Orthodox churches. I suppose people are more likely to go if it is anonymous, but it must be harder for the priest to put the confession in context, and give advice?

 

[Alex2008]

As both a new poster and a former Priest there is something that I would like to share that most people are not aware of…and that is energy (mental, spiritual, and physical)

When one is hearing confessions, there is a great amount of mental and prayerful energy involved in celebrating this Sacrament. One has to be present and very aware mentally of what the other person is saying while at the same time being open to the guidance of the Holy Spirit so that you can help the other person reconcile with God. This takes a ton of mental/spiritual energy and just one hour of confessions can wear a person down.

When one is celebrating the Eucharist, that some amount of mental/spiritual energy is used as well as physical energy. I was often covered in sweat when finished with Mass…in my mind it was like trying to run a 4 minute mile with God as your partner. When I went back to the rectory after finishing Mass/es, I was exhausted.

I personally think it’s physically impossible to run from confession right to mass without even a 5 minute break to get ready. And add to that the possibility of earlier Funerals/Weddings/Sick Calls and the amount of energy spent in a day could be overwhelming.

For those who have not walked in a Priest’s shoes, it is hard to explain (and I’ve probably done a poor job here), but this energy thing does exist and news flash: we’re only human and can only do so much!

 

[baltobetsy]

Do people feel that anonymity is very important? Since confession is usually always by appointment in Anglican parishes, it is rarely anonymous, and I believe it is not usually anonymous at Orthodox churches. I suppose people are more likely to go if it is anonymous, but it must be harder for the priest to put the confession in context, and give advice?

It’s not that the people have a strong preference for anonymity. It’s a requirement of Canon Law that it be available. I’m sure someone with the reference will post it.

Betsy

 

[ProVobis]

I suppose people are more likely to go if it is anonymous, but it must be harder for the priest to put the confession in context, and give advice?

Perhaps but the behind the screen may give the priest advantage in that he wouldn’t be distracted by what the penitent wears or how she looks. Didn’t he use a handkerchief sometimes to keep focused on what is being said in confession?