Episcopal Church / the flipside of the things / Rochester, NY

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Closed All Saints holds rites

(November 21, 2005) — IRONDEQUOIT — With the bishop who helped sanction the church sitting quietly in a rear pew, members of All Saints Episcopal Church held services Sunday, a day after the local diocese dissolved the Irondequoit parish.

“This has been a terrible but rewarding time, for we learned how to stand up for our Lord Jesus Christ,” said All Saints’ rector, the Rev. David Harnish.

On Saturday, leaders of the Episcopal Diocese in Rochester voted to declare the church “extinct” for failing to pay about $16,000 in fees and to seize its assets. The Irondequoit church withheld the money in protest of a 2003 decision by national church leaders to allow same-sex marriages and ordain a gay priest in New Hampshire. Read more

I’d hate to be in the same boat these Episcopals are in. Talk about the flipside of things. I have a strong feeling that those with the gay agenda want ALL faithful Christians to say this
He said All Saints members find the events disheartening.
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“The parish is deeply disappointed at what the diocese did,” he said.

“It’s very sad when your own tell you they no longer want you.”
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another article on this story

Church Locks Out Diocese

Patrice Walsh (Irondequoit, NY) 11/21/05 – On Monday, All Saints Episcopal Church in Irondequoit locked out the Episcopal diocese by refusing to turn over the keys to the building. Read more
“We believe what they’ve called us to do is illegal…We believe there’s a higher authority, we’re obeying the Lord,” he said
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This is not the church that Jesus established. It was not to have one man or in the case of the Whiskey-palians women determining what the bride of Christ should do. But then the Pope should also not be the determiner of Christ’s doctrine. One needs only look at the bad Popes that have been inflicted uponChristendom such as Alexander VI, Julius II, Leo X, etc. Only God’s miraculous work in creating the Reformation on Oct 31, 1517 gave the church a cleaning and purification. God save us from the popes and bishops who hold your holy bride in vassalage yet.
 
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Lehrer:
This is not the church that Jesus established. It was not to have one man or in the case of the Whiskey-palians women determining what the bride of Christ should do. But then the Pope should also not be the determiner of Christ’s doctrine. One needs only look at the bad Popes that have been inflicted uponChristendom such as Alexander VI, Julius II, Leo X, etc. Only God’s miraculous work in creating the Reformation on Oct 31, 1517 gave the church a cleaning and purification. God save us from the popes and bishops who hold your holy bride in vassalage yet.
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You are a bit off here. The pope does not bind the Church, the pope teaches exactly what the Church has always taught.

Please do not vent your anti-catholic veiws at this Catholic website.
 
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contemplative:
another article on this story

Church Locks Out Diocese

Patrice Walsh (Irondequoit, NY) 11/21/05 – On Monday, All Saints Episcopal Church in Irondequoit locked out the Episcopal diocese by refusing to turn over the keys to the building. Read more
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I notice that this newest article leaves out the other part of why this local Church is defing its Diocese. It is not only over the installation of a practicing gay (and divorced) bishop but it is also over the fact that the Episcopal Church as a body has decided to create a rite to bless same sex unions.

Both of which go against the constant Teachings of the Church and Christianity. Next they will want to rewrite the Bible.
 
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Lehrer:
This is not the church that Jesus established. It was not to have one man or in the case of the Whiskey-palians women determining what the bride of Christ should do. But then the Pope should also not be the determiner of Christ’s doctrine. One needs only look at the bad Popes that have been inflicted uponChristendom such as Alexander VI, Julius II, Leo X, etc. Only God’s miraculous work in creating the Reformation on Oct 31, 1517 gave the church a cleaning and purification. God save us from the popes and bishops who hold your holy bride in vassalage yet.
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So for 1517 years, the Church was in error and preached error?!?!?
How long after the Apostle’s died did it take for the whole thing to go off the rails? Or did they themselves get it wrong?:rotfl:
 
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ByzCath:
Next they will want to rewrite the Bible.
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This whole situation is heart-wrenching for me. I could hardly believe my ears when I heard this news story yesterday. These poor people must feel homeless. I can’t even say they have a strong Catholic diocese to join…if you know what I mean. How can our Bishop Clark ever support these people? This would be an ideal time to welcome them back into the fold. Who in our diocese is strong and representive enough to welcome them?
 
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contemplative:
This whole situation is heart-wrenching for me. I could hardly believe my ears when I heard this news story yesterday. These poor people must feel homeless. I can’t even say they have a strong Catholic diocese to join…if you know what I mean. How can our Bishop Clark ever support these people? This would be an ideal time to welcome them back into the fold. Who in our diocese is strong and representive enough to welcome them?
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I am not so sure that the Catholic Church would be the right place for these people even if they were in the confines of a strong orthodox Catholic Diocese. After all they don’t seem to have any issues with priestesses or bishopettes.
 
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ByzCath:
I am not so sure that the Catholic Church would be the right place for these people even if they were in the confines of a strong orthodox Catholic Diocese. After all they don’t seem to have any issues with priestesses or bishopettes.
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I was thinking in terms of just offering a place to worship. It is not uncommon for Catholic parishes in my area to offer protestants use of a church hall or building for awhile…not unlike how your own parish used St. Jude for a brief time.
 
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contemplative:
I was thinking in terms of just offering a place to worship. It is not uncommon for Catholic parishes in my area to offer protestants use of a church hall or building for awhile…not unlike how your own parish used St. Jude for a brief time.
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Who knows? Maybe another religious denomination already offered All Saints parish a place to worship. I imagine this is what has already happened. I just don’t see Bishop Clark doing this in light of everything lately.
 
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contemplative:
I was thinking in terms of just offering a place to worship. It is not uncommon for Catholic parishes in my area to offer protestants use of a church hall or building for awhile…not unlike how your own parish used St. Jude for a brief time.
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Well I know one thing that is different. The Melkite Greek Catholic Church is a Catholic Church.

I am not for giving over of Catholic sanctuaries to the use of protestants.
 
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ByzCath:
Well I know one thing that is different. The Melkite Greek Catholic Church is a Catholic Church.

I am not for giving over of Catholic sanctuaries to the use of protestants.
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I understand.
The two Catholic parishes I know of gave use of the basement church hall and school of religion. There is nothing wrong with that. There would be something wrong if a Catholic church gave use of their sanctuary to a Protestant denomination.
 
contemplative said:
Gay priest speaks out about Episcopal Church controversy story and video
What a switch. This kinda gives me the creeps.
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That’s an interesting quote from the homosexual priest:
“To do that is to hold the diocese hostage, to say you have to agree with us or we’re not going to be a part of you is to hold us hostage, and that’s not fair,” said Rev. Michael Hopkins.
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Which is preceded by the explanation:
All Saints was kicked out of the diocese because it refused to make its annual payment to the Diocese after the national Episcopal Church supported the ordaining of an openly gay bishop in New Hampshire in 2003.
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Now in my experience, most parish churches have been smaller, collectively, than an entire diocese, so unless All Saints is the largest (or, I suppose I should say, accounts for over 50% of the membership and.or collections of all the churches in the diocese), I can’t quite see where the “diocese” is being held “hostage”…

…seems quite the reverse to me.

It’s odd to have read the Instruction coming from Rome last week and then reading about this schism within an American Episcopal diocese - I wonder what we’ll see when the Instruction is officially made available in English? Announcements from our pastors that they are gay but celibate? (“Thanks, Father Matt, we had that figured out years ago! But stay celibate and were 100% with you!”) The anticipated ‘strike’ of gay priests? Catholic churches hoarding monies that are specifically to go to the diocese?

While we Catholics have nothing to worry about in this respect, I truly feel a great deal of empathy for our separated Episcopal brethren - what are they to do? They obey a hierarchy with some similarities to our own and we rebel when the politically correct doesn’t make it to the Vatican while our Episcopal brethren can’t keep the politically correct from being shoved under the front church doors attached to a “PAST DUE” bill.

Although I do not like to see converts come home over a single issue I certainly hope Bishop Clark has some spare seating available…
 
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contemplative:
You must have been in hermitage the past couple of weeks. Understood. Read this.

Rochester,NY City paper/Bishop supports gay priests in writing
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I didn’t think even he - now - would go that far. When I read something like that I just have to wonder how long some bishops think they can continue in dissent. I thought that he had ‘cleaned up’ his act somewhat but it appears that is not the case. I don’t have my AP handy but it seems as if he’s been in Rochester forever - is he nearing retirement?

This could prove to be an interesting Advent…
 
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ben_dy:
I don’t have my AP handy but it seems as if he’s been in Rochester forever
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:yup: does seem that way…I am not sure exactly when he started. I was a girl…so I guess that was a long time ago
is he nearing retirement?
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:nope: He is a young 'un
This could prove to be an interesting Advent.
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:gopray2: pray for peace
 
contemplative said:
Gay priest speaks out about Episcopal Church controversy story and video
What a switch. This kinda gives me the creeps.
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You are traveling through another dimension
a dimension not only of sight and sound but of mind.
a journey into a wonderous lands whose boundaries are that of imagination.
You next stop?
The Twilight-Zone.
Now, I think the Holy Spirit teaches the church about the evils of homophobia, discrimination of gay and lesbian people," Bradley said.
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