Equal Authority To All Scripture?

[lucille5]

My niece is a fallen away Catholic. She recently told me that one point of confusion that led her out of the Church was why we stand when the gospel is read. She says we think the Gospels have more authority than the Old Testament and we are wrong. I have never heard this before. I thought all Christians gave greater authority to the words of Christ. Anyone have some help for me in answering her?

 

[DebChris]

You are right. The gospel is the good news of Jesus Christ. It is the story of the life and teachings of our Lord and Savior. Should we not honor Him whom we claim to worship more than any other?
This does not distract from the importance of any other scripture that is read during Mass or that we read during our private devotions. Of course, when we are reading the Bible privately we sit. During Mass the Word is proclaimed. The OT prepares the setting. Acts tells how the early Christians lived. The epistles were letters written by the Apostles to the early Church. With the Psalms, we praise God.

 

[phoenix3212]

My niece is a fallen away Catholic. She recently told me that one point of confusion that led her out of the Church was why we stand when the gospel is read. She says we think the Gospels have more authority than the Old Testament and we are wrong. I have never heard this before. I thought all Christians gave greater authority to the words of Christ. Anyone have some help for me in answering her?

Rather, the gospels are the fulfillment over the entire Old Testament. Yes, the OT is inspired and authoritative, but the Gospels represent the manifestation of its promises. It’s logical, then, to stand while hearing about the most important thirty-three years in human history–the period God himself walked among us as a man.

Also tell her, the Catholic Church compiled the bible around 400AD. We know what we’re doing when we read it.

 

[Peter_Dawson]

My niece is a fallen away Catholic. She recently told me that one point of confusion that led her out of the Church was why we stand when the gospel is read. She says we think the Gospels have more authority than the Old Testament and we are wrong. I have never heard this before. I thought all Christians gave greater authority to the words of Christ. Anyone have some help for me in answering her?

Pray to St. Monica about your niece. Prayers are always answered.

I have to say that there is a tendency within the Church to prioritize Scripture. Very frequently, Catholic analyses of daily and Sunday readings omit a discussion of the day’s Psalm, as though the Psalm were a quaint interlude between readings rather than an inspired, shockingly-insightful Scripture.

Also, there is a strong tendency to partially agree with Protestant disregard for the 7 excluded books, the Deuterocanonicals. How often does one see the Deuteros quoted in scholarly pieces on theology? Rarely.

Yet, careful examination of the chain reference notes in one’s Bible verifies that Wisdom and Sirach were very, very frequently employed by Jesus – He seems to have had them memorized.

 

[DebChris]

I definitely do not see the Psalms as a “quaint interlude” between readings. The psalms are included in every Mass and are used as the prayer that they were written to be.
The psalms are also a major part of the Liturgy of the Hours prayed by lay and religious alike to mark the hours of the day in response to St Paul’s call to "pray always.

It is fitting that the homily focus on the lessons contained in the readings and gospel for the day. Yes, the psalm selected for the day likewise supports the gospel as do the readings that also proceed the gospel.
If the psalms are not analyzed and studied during Mass, then when are they studied? Many stop religious formation with childhood catechism. It is poor catechesis that led to Cursillo. It is also why many parishes are now focusing on providing adult formation classes such as Why Catholic? Many non-Catholic denominations already have adult Sunday School.

Prayers and their meaning are learned during faith formation. This is the time to look specifically at the psalms. The Our Father is part of the gospel. I was surprised when I learned all that was contained in that outwardly “simplistic” prayer during catechist training. The hour devoted to the Our Father was less than was needed. It is unrealistic to expect this in depth analysis to be part of the homily although elements of the Our Father are surely mentioned when it is part of the gospel reading for the day.
I remember a retreat focusing on different types of prayer that placed a great emphasis on the Psalms. One of the exercises in which we engaged was writing our own Psalm. This is where the study of the psalms is most effective and practical.

Was what your niece learned about scripture before leaving the Church limited to childhood religious formation and going to Mass? As important as these are, there is more to being a Catholic. She has yet to taste its richness.

 

[lucille5]

Thanks to all for your replys. My niece has not “tasted the richness of the faith” as one of you put it. She has much to learn. What baffles me so, is that any Christian thinks the OT is as important as the Gospels. Has anyone delt with a Christian that thinks this? Can anyone explain to me why a Christian would not place more importance on the words and teachings of Christ?

 

[patrick457]

My niece is a fallen away Catholic. She recently told me that one point of confusion that led her out of the Church was why we stand when the gospel is read. She says we think the Gospels have more authority than the Old Testament and we are wrong. I have never heard this before. I thought all Christians gave greater authority to the words of Christ. Anyone have some help for me in answering her?

I think your niece has got it backwards - standing up for the reading of the Gospel is an act of reverence, a form of greeting to Christ, who comes in the Gospel (it is comparable to the Jewish custom of standing during the public reading of the Torah, while the Torah scroll is present, in synagogue). It is also basically a symbol of Christ’s resurrection and a lifting up of the heart to heaven (man’s spiritual resurrection realized in prayer). For example, in the Divine Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom (used by some Eastern Catholic Churches and the Eastern Orthodox), at the reading of the Gospel the Deacon announces, “Wisdom! Stand up; let us hear the holy Gospel. Peace be to all!”

In the earliest days of Christianity, there was a lot of “standing up” during the Liturgy; indeed before pews were invented during the Middle Ages it was the default position of the congregation. There are no seats available for the congregation; they would just stand through the whole Mass, which required the Deacon to remind the people, “Stomen kalos!” (Let us stand well!) during key points of the Liturgy.

 

[Baloo]

Maybe your niece thinks that the OT books are more important because of age? It’s quite possible she’s putting the “respect your elders” rule in here for the OT vs. Gospels.

What I would suggest is definitely pray, I will pray for your niece, but show her different points where the Gospel fulfills the New Testament. Isaiah compared to the Gospels is good, I especially like this one from John 4:18

"For thou hast had five husbands: and he whom thou now hast, is not thy husband. This thou hast said truly. "

And then show her all of the kingdoms that ruled Israel. When I was taught this explanation, my jaw literally dropped open.

Egypt
Assyrian
Babylonian
Persian
Macedonian (Alexander the Great)
Roman

The first five are the five husbands where the Jews adopted and mixed their false gods and beliefs with the Jewish religion, and then the Romans came along and the Jews finally decided “Hey, we’re going to stick to our own beliefs here and not adopt your religious beliefs into ours”. It’s very awe-filling when you first hear it.

 

[patrick457]

Thanks to all for your replys. My niece has not “tasted the richness of the faith” as one of you put it. She has much to learn. What baffles me so, is that any Christian thinks the OT is as important as the Gospels. Has anyone delt with a Christian that thinks this? Can anyone explain to me why a Christian would not place more importance on the words and teachings of Christ?

I think that the New Testament is as important as the Old; they go hand-in-hand. St. Augustine wrote about the relationship of the Old and New Testaments thus:

“You speak to us, and do not let God speak to us, lest perhaps we may die” (Exodus 20:19). This passage signifies a great and lasting truth: that fear pertains to the Old Testament just as love does to the New - yet nevertheless in the Old the New is hidden, and in the New the Old is made manifest.

-Questions on the Heptateuch, 2.73

The New Testament completes and fulfills the Old, while the Old Testament lays the foundation for the New. Without one, you will have some difficulty understanding the other. So, personally I think that they are BOTH important: a “both-and” - which is technically the “proper” Catholic answer to any theological question, as some put it - as opposed to an “either-or”.

 

[DebChris]

I think your niece has got it backwards - standing up for the reading of the Gospel is an act of reverence, a form of greeting to Christ, who comes in the Gospel (it is comparable to the Jewish custom of standing during the public reading of the Torah, while the Torah scroll is present, in synagogue). It is also basically a symbol of Christ’s resurrection and a lifting up of the heart to heaven (man’s spiritual resurrection realized in prayer). For example, in the Divine Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom (used by some Eastern Catholic Churches and the Eastern Orthodox), at the reading of the Gospel the Deacon announces, “Wisdom! Stand up; let us hear the holy Gospel. Peace be to all!”

In the earliest days of Christianity, there was a lot of “standing up” during the Liturgy; indeed before pews were invented during the Middle Ages it was the default position of the congregation. There are no seats available for the congregation; they would just stand through the whole Mass, which required the Deacon to remind the people, “Stomen kalos!” (Let us stand well!) during key points of the Liturgy.

This is an excellent reference to our Judeo-Christian heritage and the hereditary reason for our standing.

I think that the New Testament is as important as the Old; they go hand-in-hand. St. Augustine wrote about the relationship of the Old and New Testaments thus:

“You speak to us, and do not let God speak to us, lest perhaps we may die” (Exodus 20:19). This passage signifies a great and lasting truth: that fear pertains to the Old Testament just as love does to the New - yet nevertheless in the Old the New is hidden, and in the New the Old is made manifest.

-Questions on the Heptateuch, 2.73

The New Testament completes and fulfills the Old, while the Old Testament lays the foundation for the New. Without one, you will have some difficulty understanding the other. So, personally I think that they are BOTH important: a “both-and” - which is technically the “proper” Catholic answer to any theological question, as some put it - as opposed to an “either-or”.

I have heard some “sola scriptura” denominations who only read the NT, as if the OT no longer has any importance. Nothing could be further from the truth.
As you rightly point out the NT completes and fulfills the OT, while the OT lays the foundation for the NT.
As Catholics, we read the OT in light of the NT and the NT in light of the OT. Jesus often quoted and referred to the OT. On the road to Emmaus, He used the scriptures (the OT) to explain the events in Jerusalem and the disciples recognized Him in the breaking of the bread.

 

[PJM]

=lucille5;5320445]My niece is a fallen away Catholic. She recently told me that one point of confusion that led her out of the Church was why we stand when the gospel is read. She says we think the Gospels have more authority than the Old Testament and we are wrong. I have never heard this before. I thought all Christians gave greater authority to the words of Christ. Anyone have some help for me in answering her?

I suspect she is not being COMPLETLY candid in her response

Standing is a sign of reverence. it also a posture that is “more open” than sitting, and less distracting for many than kneeling [old age pains.]

The OT has primarily two purposes:

1. Historical accounts of the Jewish community
2. Prophetic application introducing the Messiah to come

Her belief in the signifiance of the OT by itself is good, however to hold this belief in preference to the NT, which fulfills and Perfects the Old Testament [Mt. chapter 5 for example.] is done through a complete rejection of Jesus Christ, which leads me to believe that perhaps the JW’s or Mormons have gotten to her?

Prayer and sacrifice are certainly called for!

 

[Peter_Dawson]

Thanks to all for your replys. My niece has not “tasted the richness of the faith” as one of you put it. She has much to learn. What baffles me so, is that any Christian thinks the OT is as important as the Gospels. Has anyone delt with a Christian that thinks this? Can anyone explain to me why a Christian would not place more importance on the words and teachings of Christ?

It depends on what one is looking for.

Much of the Old Testament is a successful prophecy of Christ, not at the literal level, but at the typological, or symbolic level. Believe me, when one understands precisely how, and with what success, the Old Testament does this, it is innately amazing, and very faith-affirming.