Eucharist of Heretics

[romawarrior]

Hi,

On another note, I am studying Theology and what have you. I attend a nice Latin Mass now and then.

I was once good old Orthodox but now a Roman Catholic. I just finished reading a book on Theology called: Communicatio in Sacris?

It says that people like Fr. Gruner are deceivers and their Sacraments “outside” the bonds of peace and unity of the Roman Church.

I am shocked how many citations there are and all backed up from Popes and Saints on this matter.

It simply states that non-Catholics Sacraments, like the Eucharist of Heretics is sinful to receive from non-Catholics.

St. Bonaveture is quoted:

“Once these conditions [intention of Orders] are present, the sacraments may be conferred by either the good or the wicked, the faithful or the heretical, within the Church or outside it: but within the Church, they are conferred both in fact and in effect, while outside it, although conferred in fact, they are not effective.”

(The Breviloquium [II], Part VI, Chapter 5, Article 1; See also: The Works of Bonaventure, translated by José de Vinck Docteur en Droit of Louvian University, Published by St. Anthony Guild Press, New Jersey, 1962, pp. 237-238).

The book also quotes from Bishop Metallinos (Greek) whom I know, and was very strong against non-Orthodox. He wrote a book that says that all Roman Catholic Sacraments are Invalid and without any merit.

Any thoughts?

Yours,

RomaWarrior

 

[Nicholas82]

“good old Orthodox”? I’ve never heard of that jurisdiction.

 

[Sailka]

Hi,

On another note, I am studying Theology and what have you. I attend a nice Latin Mass now and then.

I was once good old Orthodox but now a Roman Catholic. I just finished reading a book on Theology called: Communicatio in Sacris?

It says that people like Fr. Gruner are deceivers and their Sacraments “outside” the bonds of peace and unity of the Roman Church.

I am shocked how many citations there are and all backed up from Popes and Saints on this matter.

It simply states that non-Catholics Sacraments, like the Eucharist of Heretics is sinful to receive from non-Catholics.

St. Bonaveture is quoted:

“Once these conditions [intention of Orders] are present, the sacraments may be conferred by either the good or the wicked, the faithful or the heretical, within the Church or outside it: but within the Church, they are conferred both in fact and in effect, while outside it, although conferred in fact, they are not effective.”

(The Breviloquium [II], Part VI, Chapter 5, Article 1; See also: The Works of Bonaventure, translated by José de Vinck Docteur en Droit of Louvian University, Published by St. Anthony Guild Press, New Jersey, 1962, pp. 237-238).

The book also quotes from Bishop Metallinos (Greek) whom I know, and was very strong against non-Orthodox. He wrote a book that says that all Roman Catholic Sacraments are Invalid and without any merit.

Any thoughts?

Yours,

RomaWarrior

• Hello, Roma! welcome to this wonderful website, very worldwide. That Orthodox metropolitan is small minoity in Orthodoxy today. I attended the USA Ravenna Conference on Reunion with Orthodox, within the last year, which is very close. Previous Conferences have even agreed that The Pope is first among all Bishops, and All Sacraments of Each Church are recognized as Valid. You may have read an old book with old ideas by their form of traditionalists.
• Indeed, we have always been forbidden to receive Communion from other Faiths, except Eastern
  And the Catholic Church is very reserved in calling anything heretical, unless obviously, grieviously so. The Vatican has only held that the Anglicanm and Lutheran blessing of Communion are not apostolic, therefore inadequate. And our Faith and Orthodox each old that we can not Intercomunion, unless the the Church Authority of each says we can. The same for ELCA and Missouri Synod Lutherans, and several others.

Of course, we recognize fully the Sacraments and validty of Liturgy of our Eastern Orthodox brothers, who are in Union with the Vatican.

 

[ASimpleSinner]

I have seen this post before. Under a different poster.

It is essentially (self-?) promotion of the book that has been linked.

The poster is advertising, not looking for a discussion.

Don’t bother.

 

[EddieArent]

The very fact hat he would call Fr. Gruner a heretic when the priest doesn’t deny any dogma makes his post certainly suspect.

 

[thistle]

The very fact hat he would call Fr. Gruner a heretic when the priest doesn’t deny any dogma makes his post certainly suspect.

Father Gruner is not suspended for heresy. He is suspended for disobedience to Rome.

 

[alih]

yesterday at the current “synod of bishops” at the vatican, the head of the eastern church gave an address. the first time in centuries. the chasm of schism may be closing. have a good year. (alih)