Eucharistic Minister and blessing

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Well, agreed. But how about the whiny pew crew that demands a “quick” Mass? In my Parish they complain to the Priests so much that it is even mentioned in our bulletins how the priests are being berated so much to keep it brief! Amazing the lack of respect! A few more minutes and we would not need the “extra”!
The sick, one thing. The pleasing of the “masses” is quite another.
I would gladly stay longer to avoid the whole abuse.
What is worse is Priests sitting in the back pews WATCHING the mass only to rush out to greet people as they leave! And they could be distributing instead!
I think the parishioners have to shoulder some blame here too, at least in my parish. McEucharist will be next. Drive up.:eek:
Blessing? I think not. Its fine after Mass or before Mass for ANYONE to give their blessings to who they wish, but I dont want them to attempt it when I am receiving communion!
Wow. I’ve been Catholic for over half a century and I can honestly say that I have never heard anyone complain Mass was too long. Maybe it’s your parish, is it crowded or something?
 
Wow. I’ve been Catholic for over half a century and I can honestly say that I have never heard anyone complain Mass was too long. Maybe it’s your parish, is it crowded or something?
We have about 2,500 in ours. 4 Mass times on Sunday.

And since day one I noted the grumps complaining. They actually confront the Priest afterward!!! Taking 5 minutes to whine when it goes a minute or 2 over an hour.
They could suck it up and spare us the “extra”
The priests in my parish get chastised in public! Right after the Mass. ESPECIALLY in the summer!

We have far too many “extra” . Four to Five! at any given Mass.
Never see a deacon get up there!
 
Okay so now you are just being condescending… You are obviously not reading what i write (and that may be fault), but whatever the case, I think we should part ways… have a great night and God Bless
I am sorry you are offended. I did not realize that your post and subsequent 3 questions were merely rhetorical. I will refrain from response in the future. Peace.
 
I am sorry you are offended. I did not realize that your post and subsequent 3 questions were merely rhetorical. I will refrain from response in the future. Peace.
Please stop playing the victim… i have told you that i do enjoy your posts, but i dont feel the need to hang around and be condescended upon… pretty simple. have a wonderful day!
 

We the laity are members of the common priesthood—but in no way —come close to the ministerial priesthood.
The universal priesthood and the ministerial priesthood are equal in dignity. One is not set above the other. They both share in the priesthood of Christ, but are configured for different areas of service.

When it comes to fulfilling the Church’s mission to the world, laity have an authority, jurisdiction, and power that is unique to the secular character of their office–and equal to that of the ministerial priesthood.

It is not a case of one being better than the other.

Keith
 
One way of looking at the difference in the “priestly blessings” is in the Eucharistic Sacrifice itself. This excerpt is Ineastimabile Donum prepared by the Sacred Congregation for the Sacraments and Divine Worship and approved by the Holy Father.

"But one must not forget the primary office of priests, who have been consecrated by their ordination to represent Christ the Priest: for this reason their hands, like their words and their will, have become the direct instruments of Christ."

The key word here is direct.
While this section concerned primarily the role differentiation between EMHC and priests, it also applies to the difference between lay and priestly (sacramental) blessings.
Tequilamac,

That does help in the context of the Eucharistic celebration, but it is not as helpful in other areas. For example, when a layperson blesses their family, are they not a direct instrument of Christ.

If a layperson has a gift of healing and through that gift someone is healed, is he not then a direct instrument of Christ?

I’m not trying to make a case for laypeople confecting the Eucharist. There are real differences between the lay and ordained–but these differences primarily revolve around arenas of service. The ministerial priesthood primarily exists to serve the People of God through teaching, sanctifying, and governing the community, while the universal priesthood exists for the sake of service to the world.

But the priesthood of the laity is every bit as “important” or dignified as that of the ordained. And saying so shouldn’t take away from the importance and dignity of the ordained at all. It should recognize the fullness of the way in which God has organized the Church.

Unfortunately, too many people have tried to erode the differences between the lay and ordained in an attempt to promote the “advancement” of the laity, and so any discussion about the authentic role of the laity is frought with the landmines that decades of dissent has planted within the grounds of discussion.

Keith
 
In neither case would I ask for a blessing from a lay person. They can pray for me all they want… Lord knows it could really help.

But the grace of a blessing is different. It is more “powerful” for want of a word. We laity don"t have a priest’s power to dispense that kind of blessing.
But the catechism says differently–at least with certain kinds of blessings. It would seem that laypeople do have that power–at least in particulr kinds of situations.
The only way a lay person can do more… is for the priest to do less.
Within the context of the liturgy and the community I am inclined to agree. However, outside of those confines (in the secular sphere, for example) laity have actual jursidiction, power, and authority to authentically stand in the place of Christ for the sake of another person

Keith
 
But the catechism says differently–at least with certain kinds of blessings. It would seem that laypeople do have that power–at least in particulr kinds of situations.

Keith
If my co-worker sneezes and I say “bless you” or if we here the President say “may God Bless the United States of America”, they may be blessings, but they are not the type of blessing that is given out by a priest or bishop.

I wish Benedict would do some serious butt kicking. If he started with the bishops, then the priests maybe the EMHC would be more receptive when it came type to tell them what they can and cannot do.

Fred
 
But the catechism says differently–at least with certain kinds of blessings. It would seem that laypeople do have that power–at least in particulr kinds of situations.

Within the context of the liturgy and the community I am inclined to agree. However, outside of those confines (in the secular sphere, for example) laity have actual jursidiction, power, and authority to authentically stand in the place of Christ for the sake of another person

Keith

I grew up being “blessed” by my mother–just as she by hers. This blessing are nothing more than asking our Lord to watch over us.

We can in emergency situations —baptise another–but it is an action of our Lord with the Trinitarian formula and the water that baptise. We are not standing in place of Christ–only a priest can do that. We provide the words and the water --our Lord Christ does the rest. Only a priest can authentically stand in place of our Lord.
 

I grew up being “blessed” by my mother–just as she by hers. This blessing are nothing more than asking our Lord to watch over us.

We can in emergency situations —baptise another–but it is an action of our Lord with the Trinitarian formula and the water that baptise. We are not standing in place of Christ–only a priest can do that. We provide the words and the water --our Lord Christ does the rest. Only a priest can authentically stand in place of our Lord.
But we are priests in a very real way–just not ministerial priests. We can baptize because we are priests–but the Church asks us to do so only in emergencies.

In the world, a layperson can stand authentically in persona christi . . .indeed Christ himself asks us to.

Again, the catechism does say that laypeople can bless in certain situations, and it does not say that these blessings are any less ‘powerful’ or authentic than the blessings of an ordained priest.

I’m not trying to knock down the ordained priesthood in any way shape or form, or advance the laity in any way that dissents from Tradition. Check out Christifidelis Laici by JPII, the work of Yves Congar, and the VII document Apostolicam Actuositatem for more.

And by the way, I do agree that EHMC’s shouldn’t give out blessings during the liturgy, because the Church, using her authority, has decreed that they shouldn’t.

Keith
 
Our former pastor, (who at one time was Vicar for Vocations for the diocese), upon his assignment to our parish as pastor, mandated that all priests in the parish who were available (barring sick calls and emergencies) would come over from the rectory on Sundays to help distribute Holy Communion at all the Masses (including Holy Days of Obligation and special Masses). They wore cassocks, albs and stolls. We are a big parish, and still had EMHC assistance, but usually it was only needed for the chalices. When seminarians were in town (they usually stayed at a house across the street) they were expected to serve at Mass as well.

Unfortunately, this all changed when the pastor was reassigned to be rector at the Cathedral.

Now, with the new pastor, we only have one priest (the celebrant) and a sacristan assisting. It’s sad. Our EHMC’s are very respectful of our priests and would prefer to defer to them.

It all depends on the direction of the individual parish/pastor.
 
The universal priesthood and the ministerial priesthood are equal in dignity. One is not set above the other. They both share in the priesthood of Christ, but are configured for different areas of service.

When it comes to fulfilling the Church’s mission to the world, laity have an authority, jurisdiction, and power that is unique to the secular character of their office–and equal to that of the ministerial priesthood.

It is not a case of one being better than the other.

Keith
Yeh, that is what the laity thought as recorded in Numbers. The followers of Korah thought they were the equal of the ministerial priesthood… and they even had lots of followers who agreed.

The Lord slew all 2500.

In the book of Jude, we are warned of thinking as you seem to be… that in doing so, we too will be subject to that wrath of Korah.

smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/28/28_2_1.gif so please don’t stand to close to me Keith.😉

%between%
 
But we are priests in a very real way–just not ministerial priests. We can baptize because we are priests–but the Church asks us to do so only in emergencies.

In the world, a layperson can stand authentically in persona christi . . .indeed Christ himself asks us to.
Again, the catechism does say that laypeople can bless in certain situations, and it does not say that these blessings are any less ‘powerful’ or authentic than the blessings of an ordained priest.
Code:
  Keith

In persona christi — is used only in reference to the ordained priesthood—they thru the sacrament of Holy Orders -authentically become persona christi.

The difference between the ordained and us is not only in degree–but in essense. That is why we the laity cannot bless in the same essence as a priest.

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/apost_exhortations/documents/hf_jp-ii_exh_30121988_christifideles-laici_en.html
  1. In a primary position in the Church are the ordained ministries, that is, the ministries that come from the Sacrament of Orders. …The ministries receive the charism of the Holy Spirit from the Risen Christ, in uninterrupted succession from the apostles, through the Sacrament of Orders: from him they receive the authority and sacred power to serve the Church, acting in persona Christi Capitis (in the person of Christ, the Head)(66) and to gather her in the Holy Spirit through the Gospel and the Sacraments.
…These ministries express and realize a participation in the priesthood of Jesus Christ that is different, not simply in degree but in essence, from the participation given to all the lay faithful through Baptism and Confirmation.

…The Code of Canon Law states: " When the necessity of the Church warrants it and when ministers are lacking, lay persons, even if they are not lectors or acolytes, can also supply for certain of their offices, namely, to exercise the ministry of the word, to preside over liturgical prayers, to confer Baptism, and to distribute Holy Communion in accord with the prescriptions of the law"(69). However, the exercise of such tasks does not make Pastors of the lay faithful: in fact, a person is not a minister simply in performing a task, but through sacramental ordination. Only the Sacrament of Orders gives the ordained minister a particular participation in the office of Christ, the Shepherd and Head, and in his Eternal Priesthood(70).
 

In persona christi — is used only in reference to the ordained priesthood—they thru the sacrament of Holy Orders -authentically become persona christi.
I understand the reference to in persona christi currently applies specifically to the priest…that it is Christ who officiates at the mass and forgives sin.

However, there has never been a fully realized theology of the laity within the Church; that is something that is currently developing (especially in the works of Congar and the 2nd Vatican Council.

There is a developing theology regarding the Lay Office within the Church that is consonant with the Tradition.

I withdraw my use of that term in relation to the laity’s standing in the place of Christ for the sake of the other. However, I do not deny that reality. If Christ uses a layperson to heal the illness of someone, that layperson is, indeed, standing in Christ’s place for another. It is Christ who heals–otherwise being the Body of Christ is reduced to a nice metaphor.
The difference between the ordained and us is not only in degree–but in essense. That is why we the laity cannot bless in the same essence as a priest.

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/apost_exhortations/documents/hf_jp-ii_exh_30121988_christifideles-laici_en.html
I don’t disagree with your first sentence, but again, the Church’s teaching does not agree with your second. The Catechism states:
Certain blessings have a lasting importance because they consecrate persons to God, or reserve objects and places for liturgical use. Among those blessings which are intended for persons - not to be confused with sacramental ordination - are the blessing of the abbot or abbess of a monastery, the consecration of virgins, the rite of religious profession and the blessing of certain ministries of the Church (readers, acolytes, catechists, etc.).
So, an abbot (or abbess) of the monastery can offer a lasting blessing by virtue of their office. Likewise, the Catechism also states that: *172 Hence lay people may preside at certain blessings. *By virtue of their participation in the lay office, which has as its foundation their baptismal participation in the priesthood of Christ, laypeople can indeed bless. It would seem that these blessings have actual efficacy, or else the Church wouldn’t see the need to regulate them when these blessings concerns ecclesial or sacramental life.

I am not suggesting that a layperson can take on the role of the ministerial priesthood because of their baptism. I am not suggesting that participation in the ordained role (like EMHCs) makes a layperson a priest.

I am not suggesting that there is no difference between a layperson and an ordained deacon, priest, or bishop.

I am suggesting that the lay office and the ordained office are complementary, with their own particular jurisdiction, power, and authority, and that one does not supercede the other. The ordained office exists for the sake of the lay office–to teach, sanctify, and govern the community.

I am suggesting that lay men and women authentically stand in the place of Christ when they use their charisms and orient their life toward the service of the world and take on their task of consecrating the world to God.

The sacrament of Holy Orders gives a man a particular participation in the ordained office–just as baptism gives a person a particular participation in the lay office.

The distinction between lay and ordained applies only within the community.

I’m not a radical, AmChurch, Call To Action groupie…and I don’t mean to give off that vibe at all.

Keith
 
We have about 2,500 in ours. 4 Mass times on Sunday.

And since day one I noted the grumps complaining. They actually confront the Priest afterward!!! Taking 5 minutes to whine when it goes a minute or 2 over an hour.
They could suck it up and spare us the “extra”
The priests in my parish get chastised in public! Right after the Mass. ESPECIALLY in the summer!

We have far too many “extra” . Four to Five! at any given Mass.
Never see a deacon get up there!
Damascus,

I hate to say it but many priests bring this upon themselves. When I have a spoiled child on my hands I don’t fold before his demands. If the child will not be dissuaded by reason then I either correct them with some quick and stern method or completely ignore them. When the priests buckled under to the whiners they got more whining and probably more whiners. At some point their capitulation will drive out all the faithful Catholics.

CDL
 
People keep saying over and over that the lay people cannot confer a blessing as the priest.

Forgive me if I am wrong, but I always thought the difference was that when a EM asked for a blessing, it was just that, a request to God to bless the person, done under the guidance and instructions of the priest.

Whereas the priest blessing was more than just a suggestion.

Anyone can be confused over an issue, but is it really a widespread issue that people think a blessing by a lay person is the same as a blessing by a priest?
 
Eliminate this category of pretend priest and much of the problem goes away.

CDL
 
People keep saying over and over that the lay people cannot confer a blessing as the priest.

Forgive me if I am wrong, but I always thought the difference was that when a EM asked for a blessing, it was just that, a request to God to bless the person, done under the guidance and instructions of the priest.

Whereas the priest blessing was more than just a suggestion.

Anyone can be confused over an issue, but is it really a widespread issue that people think a blessing by a lay person is the same as a blessing by a priest?
Yes they can. There have been many people posting on this forum who fail to see any difference in the Ordained Priesthood and the laity and in fact think that the laity should not give to much credence to the Priesthood… I’ve seen posts here that claim that since we are all priests all of our hands are consecrated and that we should all be able to perform all priestly functions.

Yes there is a lot of confusion on the issue, brought about mainly through poor catechisis and the generaly utter failure of the various CCD and RCIA programs to adequitely instruct in the basics of the faith.
 
Yes they can. There have been many people posting on this forum who fail to see any difference in the Ordained Priesthood and the laity and in fact think that the laity should not give to much credence to the Priesthood… I’ve seen posts here that claim that since we are all priests all of our hands are consecrated and that we should all be able to perform all priestly functions.

Yes there is a lot of confusion on the issue, brought about mainly through poor catechisis and the generaly utter failure of the various CCD and RCIA programs to adequitely instruct in the basics of the faith.
Too bad. I wish people could celebrate and embrace the differences instead of trying to knock down God. Because ultimately, by not seeing any difference between the ordained sacramental priesthood and the general priesthood we are all called to, one is making less of the Sacraments thereby making less of the visible miracles of God as seen through the Sacraments.

God Bless,
Maria
 
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