Eucharistic Ministers Approaching Tabernacle

[LVP]

I have a question. My husband, who is a Eucharistic Minister in our parish, brings communion to the local nursing home once a month. Today, when he was done, he had about a dozen hosts left over. He went back to our Church and placed the pyx with the hosts back into the tabernacle for the priests to use at the next Mass and for them to purify the pyx. He was dressed properly and was very reverent at the tabernacle.

A married couple in the parish went up to my husband and told him that the Vatican states that “he was not allowed to approach the tabernacle.” So, my question is this: if we, as lay people, can distribute Jesus to the congregation, can take Him in our cars and travel on the roads and bring Him to the infirm, why are we not allowed to put the consecrated hosts back into the tabernacle after coming back from a nursing home? This was not done in the context of Mass but in between Masses. Any comments?

 

[FrDavid96]

I have a question. My husband, who is a Eucharistic Minister in our parish, brings communion to the local nursing home once a month. Today, when he was done, he had about a dozen hosts left over. He went back to our Church and placed the pyx with the hosts back into the tabernacle for the priests to use at the next Mass and for them to purify the pyx. He was dressed properly and was very reverent at the tabernacle.

A married couple in the parish went up to my husband and told him that the Vatican states that “he was not allowed to approach the tabernacle.” So, my question is this: if we, as lay people, can distribute Jesus to the congregation, can take Him in our cars and travel on the roads and bring Him to the infirm, why are we not allowed to put the consecrated hosts back into the tabernacle after coming back from a nursing home? This was not done in the context of Mass but in between Masses. Any comments?

What the couple said is not completely accurate. A priest (or deacon) should always be the one to remove/replace the Eucharist in the tabernacle, but that’s not the same as saying that it’s never permitted for laypersons to replace the Eucharist back into the tabernacle. If what happened was necessary, then there’s nothing wrong with it. If the priest were standing there, or nearby (and I gather that’s NOT the case), then he should have done it. But if the priest was available, he should have been the one to return the Hosts.

 

[twf]

I can’t answer your question, but I have a couple comments.

1. The laity do not have a “right” to distribute the sacred body and precious blood of Our Lord. It is allowed as a pastoral concession when NECESSITY, and shortage of priests/deacons, arises. Ideally, no lay person would ever distribute Holy Communion.
2. Only priests are eucharistic ministers. There is no such thing as a “lay eucharistic minister”. The Vatican has made it very clear that only priests, who confect and celebrate the most holy eucharist, are to be deemed “Eucharistic ministers”. (see Redemptoris Sacramentum). It is only out of ignorance, or a continued act of disobedience (to further some liberal agenda), that many North American parishes continue to employ the term. [edited] Deacons are not “eucharistic ministers”, as they can not celebrate the sacrament of the eucharist, but they are “ordinary ministers of the Holy Communion”; that is, it is ordinary and proper for deacons, with priests, to distribute Our Lord to the people. The laity can be instituted as **extraordinary ** ministers of the Holy Communion (commonly known as EMHCs). According to the Vatican, this is the only acceptable term to be used when describing those lay persons who are requested to assist the priest(s) and/or deacons in distributing holy communion as grave necessity arises.

 

[puzzleannie]

I
A married couple in the parish went up to my husband and told him that the Vatican states that “he was not allowed to approach the tabernacle.” ?

If that happened to me and I was able to think fast, I would have asked, “Has the pastor delegated you to give instructions to the Extraordinary ministers of holy communion? because I am one of them, and if you feel I am not following proper procedure, please report it to him at once. good day to you.”

 

[PhilotheaZ]

Lay persons are not permitted to approach the tabernacle during Mass. Among other reasons, this helps avoid confusion about the different roles of ordained (priests and deacons) vs. laity.

There are certain occasions when it is permitted for a lay person to approach the tabernacle outside Mass time. What your husband was doing as Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion seems to be one of those situations, assuming he has the permission of the pastor to do so.

 

[LVP]

TWF - where did I say “the laity has the right?” Also, in my hurry to ask the question, PLEASE forgive me, TWF, for using the words “Eucharistic Minister” instead of “Extraordinary.” [edited] All I want to know is - can an EXTRAORDINARY minister of the Eucharist approach the tabernacle in these circumstances??? We know what we are…[edited]

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

I have a question. My husband, who is a Eucharistic Minister in our parish, brings communion to the local nursing home once a month. Today, when he was done, he had about a dozen hosts left over. He went back to our Church and placed the pyx with the hosts back into the tabernacle for the priests to use at the next Mass and for them to purify the pyx. He was dressed properly and was very reverent at the tabernacle.

A married couple in the parish went up to my husband and told him that the Vatican states that “he was not allowed to approach the tabernacle.” So, my question is this: if we, as lay people, can distribute Jesus to the congregation, can take Him in our cars and travel on the roads and bring Him to the infirm, why are we not allowed to put the consecrated hosts back into the tabernacle after coming back from a nursing home? This was not done in the context of Mass but in between Masses. Any comments?

She would be wrong as long as he has the permission of the Pastor and it’s not during the celebration of the Liturgy.

 

[FrDavid96]

…
So, my question is this: if we, as lay people, can distribute Jesus to the congregation, can take Him in our cars and travel on the roads and bring Him to the infirm, why are we not allowed to put the consecrated hosts back into the tabernacle after coming back from a nursing home? This was not done in the context of Mass but in between Masses. Any comments?

LVP,
You bring up a very good point. That’s why I’ve selected that particular paragraph from your original post. Your question is a good one and deserves an answer. The reason is something that people don’t always readily see. We have to start with the understanding that only a priest or deacon is a minister of Holy Communion (no, that’s not a vocabulary statement, it’s a way of saying that we have to start there.) In cases of true necessity a priest is permitted to make an exception to the rule; he is permitted to make a temporary appointment to “deputise” a layperson to act in place of a priest/deacon by administering communion if the priest is unable to do so personally. The legitimacy of that appointment depends entirely on its necessity. If there’s no necessity, then there’s no legitimate appointment. That may sound obvious but bear with me here. To put that another way, a priest can only appoint a layperson to perform that function when he’s truly unable to do so himself. Let’s say that a priest realizes that it’s not possible for him to visit that nursing home, and so he makes a temporary apointment of a layperson to act in his stead. Fine, that’s what this extraordinary function is all about. The priest cannot be the one to “take Him in our cars and travel on the roads and bring Him to the infirm” (the first half of your question) so when a layperson does this that’s fine.

But the second half of your question “why are we not allowed to put the consecrated hosts back into the tabernacle after coming back from a nursing home?” has a different answer. If the priest (or any priest or deacon) is available to do this, then there is no longer any necessity for him to appoint a layperson to do so. Since the necessity is no longer there, then neither is the legitimacy of the appointment (it was perfectly legitimate but when a cleric is present, the temporary function ceases). If the priest is not available, well then the necessity is still there and that temporary appointment still stands. So that second half of your question really has 2 answers depending upon the circumstances.

The person who made that comment to your husband was out of line, and wasn’t completely accurate, but I feel that you should understand the reason why there’s a difference between actually distributing the Eucharist to patients in a nursing home on the one hand, and returning the Eucharist to the tabernacle on the other hand. It was a good question, and I hope I’ve explained the answer.

 

[LVP]

Thank you very much, Father, for your wonderful explanation. God bless you for being so kind.

 

[benedictgal]

[edited]

Now, my father is an EMHC to the sick and homebound. He visits roughly 30 elderly people every Sunday. He arrives at the Cathedral at 7AM and the administrator (priest) or the deacon fill up his pyx for him. He manages to get back just before the 11:30AM Mass to have either the priest or the deacon replace whatever hosts are left over.

 

[Joannm]

[edited]

Now, my father is an EMHC to the sick and homebound. He visits roughly 30 elderly people every Sunday. He arrives at the Cathedral at 7AM and the administrator (priest) or the deacon fill up his pyx for him. He manages to get back just before the 11:30AM Mass to have either the priest or the deacon replace whatever hosts are left over.

I am trying to figure out the timing on this…are all these people in one location, like a nursing home? Anyway it is wonderful that he is available to bring the Eucharist to this sick.

 

[T700]

TWF - where did I say “the laity has the right?” Also, in my hurry to ask the question, PLEASE forgive me, TWF, for using the words “Eucharistic Minister” instead of “Extraordinary.” Oh my gosh! Maybe I should run into the confessional! All I want to know is - can an EXTRAORDINARY minister of the Eucharist approach the tabernacle in these circumstances??? We know what we are…I don’t need you to tear apart every line in my question. And, how dare you call me ignorant?! Did you ever hear of a “Christ-like approach” in talking with someone? Or, are you above that?

LVP, I see that you have nine posts under your belt, when you wrote this. First, welcome to the forum. It is a very good place to learn and ask questions, but you absolutely have to grow some thicker skin or you won’t survive here.

You happened to have stepped right into one of the most heated topics on the board and while you may not think so now, you received a very gentle and very accurate answer. Your response of rage and sarcasm doesn’t really accomplish anything.

Paul

 

[benedictgal]

I am trying to figure out the timing on this…are all these people in one location, like a nursing home? Anyway it is wonderful that he is available to bring the Eucharist to this sick.

He visits a nursing home and a senior residential facility (where the elderly live in their own efficiecy apartments). The latter is a federal housing complex so he has to abide by the guidelines established by the government (no candles) and he also has to be brief because the Jehova Witnesses watch him like a hawk and time him (evidently there is some sort of an equal time provision). But, he spends as much time as he can with them. He goes room by room, beginning with the seventh floor and working his way down. If his communicants are in the hospital, then he goes and sees them.

At least the nursing home is a one-story facility.

The two facilities are not near each other, but clear across town. On top of the two locations, he also visits five elderly in their private homes. So, his Sunday mornings are pretty busy. He is the only EMHC to visit the senior residential facility so he is their sole contact with the Church.

 

[Joannm]

He visits a nursing home and a senior residential facility (where the elderly live in their own efficiecy apartments). The latter is a federal housing complex so he has to abide by the guidelines established by the government (no candles) and he also has to be brief because the Jehova Witnesses watch him like a hawk and time him (evidently there is some sort of an equal time provision). But, he spends as much time as he can with them. He goes room by room, beginning with the seventh floor and working his way down. If his communicants are in the hospital, then he goes and sees them.

At least the nursing home is a one-story facility.

The two facilities are not near each other, but clear across town. On top of the two locations, he also visits five elderly in their private homes. So, his Sunday mornings are pretty busy. He is the only EMHC to visit the senior residential facility so he is their sole contact with the Church.

Would he be allowed to do a communal service with distribution of Holy Communion? We have two such facilities in our parish and EMHC’s do a service in the common room that all those residents who are not bedridden go to. It is just a communion service as outlined in the Pastoral Care of the Sick booklet. The EMHCs also bring a recording of old hymns to play before the service and during distribution of communion that the residents like singing. Sometimes the wil lead the rosary with them after the service. It is a good way to get the residents out of their rooms or efficiencies, and the two EMHCs only have to go visit the bedridden residents in their rooms. But, it may not be allowed where your father goes to visit. We are fortunate that we are allowed to do this in the facility.

 

[Seatuck]

Where is the instruction limiting the EMOHC to approach the tabernacle outside of Mass? It is my understanding that this has not been defined and so we have different interpretations on this by the Bishop’s. Anyone? We definitely have EMOHC reposing the unused hosts into the tabernacle during Mass.

 

[Ockham]

This is another clear example of what is wrong with EMHCs. Someone asks a valid and innocent question, a couple answers are perceived as harsh, feelings get hurt, animosity breaks out, etc. The root cause of this unrest is the logical inconsistency of lay persons handling consecrated hosts. A priest’s hands are consecrated, he consecrates the host during the Mass, then during the Agnus Dei a number of average folk come out of the audience, storm the sanctuary and hand out our Lord to get Holy Communion over with as quickly as possible. It’s no wonder the belief in the Real Presence is declining and why we experience so much debate amongst ourselves. If a lay person is allowed to touch the consecrated host then touching the tabernacle shouldn’t be a problem. That doesn’t make it right, but at least it is logically consistent.

 

[FrDavid96]

Where is the instruction limiting the EMOHC to approach the tabernacle outside of Mass? It is my understanding that this has not been defined and so we have different interpretations on this by the Bishop’s. Anyone? We definitely have EMOHC reposing the unused hosts into the tabernacle during Mass.

Seatuck,
See my post #8. Does that explain it? I tried to outline the reasons. This often comes down to more a matter of “exactly what is happening?” rather than a general statement one way or the other of saying that EMHCs are or are not permitted to open the tabernacle.

 

[tinalewis]

HI - I"m a new EMOHC and I just began to administer to hospital patients at one of the local hospitals. There is no resident priest available to approach the tabernacle in the hospital chapel. But also, there aren’t enough priests in our diocese to visit all the Catholic patients and their families daily to administer Holy Communion and to pray with them and to comfort them and to celebrate their good news (good outcome of surgery, favorable test results, finally going home, etc.) with them. Sometimes it takes hours to see everyone in just one hospital.

We EMOHC do an amazing service and we see it in the eyes of those we serve. Everyone I work with takes great care to follow all our rules from our diocesan training, but the main issue is that we are doing what God has called us to do: Bring Jesus to the sick. This should be the focus, in my opinion. Rules are to be followed, but God alone is to be loved. If the couple who approached you and your husband could only see the peace and comfort in the faces of the patients in the nursing home after they receive our Lord, they would only rejoice with you.

Your husband and all EMOHC are always in my prayers.

 

[regression]

What the couple said is not completely accurate. A priest (or deacon) should always be the one to remove/replace the Eucharist in the tabernacle, but that’s not the same as saying that it’s never permitted for laypersons to replace the Eucharist back into the tabernacle. If what happened was necessary, then there’s nothing wrong with it. If the priest were standing there, or nearby (and I gather that’s NOT the case), then he should have done it. But if the priest was available, he should have been the one to return the Hosts.

At my parish, after Communion, the priest stands next to his chair while one of the EMHC takes the hosts and places them in the tabernacle. The same thing happened in the parish I attended when I lived elsewhere. I had no idea this was not allowed??

I love coming to these forums. Almost everyday I learn something new.

 

[FrDavid96]

At my parish, after Communion, the priest stands next to his chair while one of the EMHC takes the hosts and places them in the tabernacle. The same thing happened in the parish I attended when I lived elsewhere. I had no idea this was not allowed??

I love coming to these forums. Almost everyday I learn something new.

The way the current GIRM is written, it’s presuming that the tabernacle isn’t even being used during Mass. There’s very little reference to it, and nothing direct about who may or may not place the consecrated Hosts in the tabernacle. However (this is important) the only role of an EMHC is to assist the priest/deacon in distributing Holy Communion, anything beyond this is not permitted. Since the priest (or maybe a deacon) is available to place the Hosts in the tabernacle, there’s no reason at all why a former EMHC should be doing this. I say former EMHC because once the distribution of Communion is over, so too is the role of EMHC.