European disillusion

[joeybaggz]

I wonder if the European nations that were historically Catholic by culture, such as Ireland, now that the hammer has been brought down on that illusion of superiority and universal influence within the country is shattered, will the realization of the new reality, winnow the “lukewarm” Catholics and bring about a reinvigoration of the beauty of the truth of the Catholic religion in their churches and in the truly faithful? Here’s hoping. After all, it is Catholic teaching that one has to be broken down to self in order for the Lord to build you up to the best version of yourself in union with his call to us.

 

[CRM_Brother]

I am not European, but I have lived in a couple of different places in Europe and have found that, while Poland and Hungary seem to be the last national hold-outs for Catholicism, the national model does not seem to count for pockets in many countries which have retained devotion and adherence to Catholic values. Bavaria, Rhineland-Pfalz, and Saarland in Germany still retain a vibrant Catholicism. So too do areas of Italy and Spain. Anecdotally, from a French friend, I know that there are also small pockets of devout Catholicism in rural France. I do agree, however, that National governments, and even most large cities have drifted away from the Catholic values which formed them.

I do, however, find the tide to be turning, somewhat. I have heard and seen more and more vibrant Catholic movements being started by the Youth. We seem to be slowly rejecting the nihilism of the generations of our forebears (ethnically, I am primarily Irish and German) and have begun to search for meaning again. In that search, there seems to be a slow but steady increase in the participation of the Youth in the Church.

 

[MaryEstelle2]

So…the pendulum is slowly swinging back, you think? Hopefully so.

 

[AlNg]

Christian-Europe is finished .

That is true of western Europe, but it is not true of Russia. Thousands of Orthodox churches have been built or renovated in the last twenty-five years.

 

[Axsenex]

You can chop down a tree & immediately they convert to Catholicism… oh wait it don’t work like that anymore. It’s much harder now but nothing is impossible until you think it is! We were once a very privileged religion but now? One of many religions… imagine that back in the days of chopping down trees to impress the ignorant pagans!

 

[0Scarlett_nidiyilii]

I think OP meant: count on to stand firm in the Catholic faith

 

[Annie]

To maintain natural law, perhaps?

But since natural law is seen as Christian and as restrictive of the individual’s freedom, many want to reject it.

Which ultimately leaves nothing but Might Makes Right. So far, that has sorta kinda worked, but only because of the residual effects of Christianity which (mostly) prevent the many from killing the few.

 

[Bradskii]

To maintain natural law, perhaps?

But since natural law is seen as Christian and as restrictive of the individual’s freedom, many want to reject it.

Which ultimately leaves nothing but Might Makes Right. So far, that has sorta kinda worked, but only because of the residual effects of Christianity which (mostly) prevent the many from killing the few.

For ‘might makes right’ read democracy. You couldn’t have had a more democratic process than the one they just went through in Ireland. Nobody is forcing these referendums through at the point of a gun. There is no mob rule.

What’s happening in Ireland is that a significant majority of Catholics are saying that they consider the church to be wrong. On ssm, on contraception, on divorce and now on abortion. And the church was relatively silent on this last matter. Possibly because they feel that they had already lost any influence they might have had and didn’t want to stand up just to be knocked down again. I don’t think they wanted this to be seen as an anti Catholic vote. Although I fail to see how else it can be interpreted.

 

[joeybaggz]

I don’t think they wanted this to be seen as an anti Catholic vote. Although I fail to see how else it can be interpreted.

Anti Catholic or pro secular humanist? Am not Irish so no first hand understanding, only what I read in the obviously biased reports of the liberal media. But I didn’t hear anyone celebrating that “we beat those da** Catholics” kind of rhetoric.

What is going on in the developed “western” nations has happened before. Widespread immoral, or maybe amoral, behavior usually leads to a “correction” down the road. As Ireland continues to see its birth rate and population dwindle to where there are not enough people to sustain the economy, the nation, or its inherent culture, something is bound to happen. It already is in countries being overrun by Muslims who don’t give a hoot about Irish history or culture. I won’t be around to see it, but take it to the bank, it will happen.

 

[Rob2]

As a young European, yesterday’s referendum in Ireland confirmed my what I had long suspected, that Europe is pretty much finished. When I was growing up, there were always two countries you could count on: Malta (my mother’s country) and Ireland (my neighour) but, in my own lifetime, both have fallen as Great Britain, France, Germany and pretty much every other country in Western Europe had before them. The last outposts appear to be Poland and Hungary. I am not posting this to bash Europe or any country in Europe. Europe is my home and I love her, but for what she was, not what she has become. Most people I come across are very self-centred and apathetic towards the world around them. It is like living in a nihilist bubble. Do any of you who are Europeans feel this way as well?

Aren’t we always in a state of disillusionment ?

When Jehovah’s Witnesses come to my door and ask me what I think of the state of affairs I usually give them a little history lesson…

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[Glark]

This could be part of the fulfillment of prophesy - the Great Apostasy that must occur before the coming of the Antichrist and a little later, the Second Coming of Jesus Christ (2Thess 2).

 

[AlNg]

What’s happening in Ireland is that a significant majority of Catholics are saying that they consider the church to be wrong. On ssm, on contraception, on divorce and now on abortion.

The scandals in Ireland were horrific and it is possible that these horrible scandals weakened the influence of the Catholic Church.

 

[AlNg]

When Jehovah’s Witnesses come to my door and ask me what I think of the state of affairs I usually give them a little history lesson…

Jehovah’s Witnesses were put in Nazi concentration camps. None of them would perform Nazi military service, none of them would join Nazi organizations, and none of them would give allegiance to the Hitler regime. How does this compare with Catholics in Nazi Germany?
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[TheNoseKnows]

Jehovah’s Witnesses were put in Nazi concentration camps. None of them would perform Nazi military service, none of them would join Nazi organizations, and none of them would give allegiance to the Hitler regime. How does this compare with Catholics in Nazi Germany?

AIlNg I don’t think Rob2 meant that Jehovah’s Witnesses were nazi sympathizers rather he was saying that the world is messed up. As for your jab at Catholics it should be noted that Hitler got the least amount of votes from Bavaria and the Rhineland both of which were/are very Catholic.