Evangelical blames Pedophile Crisis on celibacy

[Shellina1]

I’m not reading all these comments…because some of this are just downright off topic…

As for the topic

Evangelical blames Pedophile Crisis on celibacy

Well I guess I am considered an Evangelical and anyone that says that hasn’t read the bible.

How many men were celibate prophets, pastors, priests, apostles, and never once molested children???

I think the problem is simple…a pedophile is a SINNER…big fat sinner that loves his sin more than God…or is lost all together…anyone that commits a crime against a child has to answer to God…and the only way you stop people from sinning is to have them live out the faith they teach every Sunday.

I think that God is helping ALL churches because molestation is not isolated to Catholics only…it’s in ALL churches…it’s in the schools…it’s everywhere…this is a crisis all over the world and is not a respector of race, sex or religion…

People that draw such conclusions speak from ignorance and in my opinion probably with an agenda to get Catholics to change the policy on priest being allowed to marry rather than actually attempting to help correct the crisis.

 

[Publisher]

I’m not reading all these comments…because some of this are just downright off topic…

As for the topic

Evangelical blames Pedophile Crisis on celibacy

Well I guess I am considered an Evangelical and anyone that says that hasn’t read the bible.

How many men were celibate prophets, pastors, priests, apostles, and never once molested children???

I think the problem is simple…a pedophile is a SINNER…big fat sinner that loves his sin more than God…or is lost all together…anyone that commits a crime against a child has to answer to God…and the only way you stop people from sinning is to have them live out the faith they teach every Sunday.

I think that God is helping ALL churches because molestation is not isolated to Catholics only…it’s in ALL churches…it’s in the schools…it’s everywhere…this is a crisis all over the world and is not a respector of race, sex or religion…

People that draw such conclusions speak from ignorance and in my opinion probably with an agenda to get Catholics to change the policy on priest being allowed to marry rather than actually attempting to help correct the crisis.

Agreed!!! This is about living the faith we profess. It has nothing to do with sexual orientation or that the “scandal” was done solely by pedophile priests or homosexual priests…it was the fact that vows were broken and even when it was brought to the attention of he hierarchy…they were moved not REMOVED.

The CC stance on celibacy has nothing to do with a priest who breaks their vows…it has to do with the priest breaking his vows.

While pedophiles who chose to become priests and gay men who chose to become priest and married Eastern priests and Protestant married ministers who break their vows and marriage vows also cause scandal…it is compounded that the offending priests WERE NOT REMOVED…they were simply moved to a different location…Ted Haggard, the once president of Assoc. of Evangelicals was removed from his office for breaking his marriage vows and his homosexual activity including drug abuse.

Temptation to break one’s vows is only a sin when one gives into it…a celibate, chaste homosexual priest is no more likely to commit sexual sins than a chaste, celibate heterosexual priest…they both are chase and celibate…it is when vows are broken…while the number of incedents involving gay men or pedophiles is greater than those involving heterosexual incidents the tradgedy is the same…vows were broken and children, both male and female were abused and the institution that should have been the first to protect them, failed.

To claim it is a “homosexual issue” is to minimize the crimes done to these children…“straight” “heterosexual” non chaste, non celibate men broke their vows by preying on children…pre-pubescent and post-pubescent…and it occurs in every religious persuasion…HOW it is dealt with in those institutions is another matter…in the Catholic Church it was handled scandalously!!!

 

[ibkc]

Publisher, you can perhaps be forgiven here because something hasn’t been made clear. In the 1970’s at the height of the push to “reform” the Church, many gay men who had no intention of keeping their vows of celibacy were allowed into the seminaries. The book Goodbye, Good Men was referenced earlier - it may give you some insight as to why Catholics seem stuck on homosexuals the way they are. From a review of the book:

In “Goodbye, Good Men” Michael Rose says that men who entered the priesthood before the 1970s, and the newest priests today generally accept celibacy as crucial to their service and are devoted to the orthodox teachings, sacraments and traditions of the church. But that in-between generation, now ensconced in the church’s leadership (except for some few who courageously resisted the corruption) are determined to “change the structure and mission of the Catholic Church”; their goal is a secularized and desacralized institution led perhaps by priestesses, or perhaps by a priestless, organized laity giving the sacraments.
“In the face of this ‘determined effort,’” in the words of Archbishop Curtiss, “on the part of these entrenched dissenters to discourage orthodox vocations, the U.S. hierarchy has for the most part shown a singular lack of resolution, preferring to tolerate manifest injustices rather than wrest back control of the process of priestly formation from those who have used their power over it to the Church’s detriment.”
I agree with you that if the system is working as it is supposed to, the sexuality of priests isn’t an issue at all. Unfortunately, the situation is just not as black and white as that.

 

[estesbob]

To claim it is a “homosexual issue” is to minimize the crimes done to these children…“straight” “heterosexual” non chaste, non celibate men broke their vows by preying on children…pre-pubescent and post-pubescent…and it occurs in every religious persuasion…HOW it is dealt with in those institutions is another matter…in the Catholic Church it was handled scandalously!!!

If we refuse to adress the homosexual nature of the abuse then we will never solve the problem. I am amazed on how much time and energy is spent trying to deny the obvious-the genus of this scandal was allowing homosexuals into the Priesthood.

 

[Publisher]

Publisher, you can perhaps be forgiven here because something hasn’t been made clear. In the 1970’s at the height of the push to “reform” the Church, many gay men who had no intention of keeping their vows of celibacy were allowed into the seminaries. The book Goodbye, Good Men was referenced earlier - it may give you some insight as to why Catholics seem stuck on homosexuals the way they are. From a review of the book:

In “Goodbye, Good Men” Michael Rose says that men who entered the priesthood before the 1970s, and the newest priests today generally accept celibacy as crucial to their service and are devoted to the orthodox teachings, sacraments and traditions of the church. But that in-between generation, now ensconced in the church’s leadership (except for some few who courageously resisted the corruption) are determined to “change the structure and mission of the Catholic Church”; their goal is a secularized and desacralized institution led perhaps by priestesses, or perhaps by a priestless, organized laity giving the sacraments.
“In the face of this ‘determined effort,’” in the words of Archbishop Curtiss, “on the part of these entrenched dissenters to discourage orthodox vocations, the U.S. hierarchy has for the most part shown a singular lack of resolution, preferring to tolerate manifest injustices rather than wrest back control of the process of priestly formation from those who have used their power over it to the Church’s detriment.”
I agree with you that if the system is working as it is supposed to, the sexuality of priests isn’t an issue at all. Unfortunately, the situation is just not as black and white as that.

Thank you for at least the consideration of forgiveness for my ignorance.

 

[heisenburg]

To ALL:

Pedophilia has NOTHING to do with gender… It has to do with an Adult that has control issues and using Children in disgusting ways to exert that control. It has more in common with megalomania than it does with just being a perv

Thats it…

Homosexuality doesn’t cause it any more than drink Cokes will make you regrow lost hair… It is a mental disorder all unto itself, like necrophilia, and bestiality…

It is something that must be dealt with through therapy and if a crime is committed, jail time…

the issue of the Pedophile scandal has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with Gay/Strait… It has to do with a disturbed individual doing disturbed things…

I personally don’t buy that people are born gay… but you know what, if they are… and they become Priests… then they are beholden to their vows just a strict as strait men…

IF you are born gay… that is not the sin… it is the action whether by thought or carrying through that is a sin…

In Christ

 

[estesbob]

the issue of the Pedophile scandal has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with Gay/Strait… It has to do with a disturbed individual doing disturbed things…

I

There was no pedophilia scandal. Over 90% of the molestations were homosexual rapes of post pubescent boys.

 

[heisenburg]

There was no pedophilia scandal. Over 90% of the molestations were homosexual rapes of post pubescent boys.

agreed, but regardless… point stands…

 

[Publisher]

There was no pedophilia scandal. Over 90% of the molestations were homosexual rapes of post pubescent boys.

I’m sure your distinction is lost on the boys that were molested and had their lives and faith all but destroyed.

 

[estesbob]

I’m sure your distinction is lost on the boys that were molested and had their lives and faith all but destroyed.

If the distinction is not made it will reslut in another generation of boys that are molested and have their lives and faith all but destroyed.

You cant solve a problem unless you correctly identify what the problem is.

 

[Publisher]

If the distinction is not made it will reslut in another generation of boys that are molested and have their lives and faith all but destroyed.

You cant solve a problem unless you correctly identify what the problem is.

Ary you implying that should it occur again that the offending priest will simply be moved to another location? The problem must be dealt with to be sure, those in positions of authority MUST take responsiblility for nothing being done in the first place…if action would have been taken when it was brought to the attention of the hierarchy instead of being swept under the carpet it could have been stopped. As I understand it none of those in authority who ignored the charges were homosexual or pedophiles, so in my humble opinion the responsibility rests partially with those who turned a blind eye to the plights of children and ignored the broken vows of the priests.

 

[ibkc]

Ary you implying that should it occur again that the offending priest will simply be moved to another location? The problem must be dealt with to be sure, those in positions of authority MUST take responsiblility for nothing being done in the first place…

He is saying that the problem needs to be stopped at the source to keep it from happening at all.

 

[Publisher]

He is saying that the problem needs to be stopped at the source to keep it from happening at all.

Ahh, that is more clear. Next question. The 10% of molestations between priests and girls…how should that be handled? The removal of heterosexual priests?

 

[estesbob]

Ary you implying that should it occur again that the offending priest will simply be moved to another location? The problem must be dealt with to be sure, those in positions of authority MUST take responsiblility for nothing being done in the first place…if action would have been taken when it was brought to the attention of the hierarchy instead of being swept under the carpet it could have been stopped. As I understand it none of those in authority who ignored the charges were homosexual or pedophiles, so in my humble opinion the responsibility rests partially with those who turned a blind eye to the plights of children and ignored the broken vows of the priests.

It will occur again if the Church beleives all they have to do is keep those with pediophilic tenedcies out of the Priesthood. I think the majortiy of the responsibility lies with those who turned a blind eye-which is why I dont want them to now turn a blind eye to the nature of the molestations.

 

[ibkc]

Ahh, that is more clear. Next question. The 10% of molestations between priests and girls…how should that be handled? The removal of heterosexual priests?

Since you obviously don’t care that there was an orchestrated idealogical attack on the Catholic priesthood which led to many of these molestation cases, and are refusing to see the connection at all, I’ll simply offer up my own opinion on the matter.

A) The seminaries need to screen rigorously to exclude any applicant who is not 100% committed to a celibate lifestyle and to the orthodox teachings of the Church.
B) Any priest who molests anyone should be immediately removed and turned over to law enforcement.

 

[Publisher]

Since you obviously don’t care that there was an orchestrated idealogical attack on the Catholic priesthood which led to many of these molestation cases, and are refusing to see the connection at all, I’ll simply offer up my own opinion on the matter.

A) The seminaries need to screen rigorously to exclude any applicant who is not 100% committed to a celibate lifestyle and to the orthodox teachings of the Church.
B) Any priest who molests anyone should be immediately removed and turned over to law enforcement.

Your first statement is completey inaccurate…I do care…if I didnt’ I wouldn’t have continued to make my opinion known. To protect our children is one of the most important issues I believe we face today. What I “heard” were excuses as to what the problem was and is…

That is one of the most strong statements I’ve seen on this subject. Thank you…I agree. I hope you will be as vocal in your parish as you are on this board. I also hope those who “protect” those who prey on children also will be subject to disipline…that seems to not be as forcefully addressed.

Do you care to do so now?

 

[ibkc]

That is one of the most strong statements I’ve seen on this subject. Thank you…I agree. I hope you will be as vocal in your parish as you are on this board.

I would rather that the issue never come up in any parish I attend, frankly.
But if it ever does, I am not the type to keep my mouth shut.

I also hope those who “protect” those who prey on children also will be subject to disipline…that seems to not be as forcefully addressed.

Do you care to do so now?

I am a new Catholic, and I have spent some time reading about this issue and trying to figure out why the superiors of these priests acted the way they did. I have some theories, and those theories are charitable to the motives of the bishops. But I don’t think that their good intentions excuse their actions, which caused more harm to individuals and to the Church as a whole. I believe they should face justice, too.

 

[valient_Lucy]

As someone with a close friend who was molested by her father, I find this line of reasoning (that celibacy leads to pedophilia) very troubling. By this logic I would have to conclude either 1 my friend is lying, since married men aren’t pedophiles 2 the abuse was her mother’s fault, since her mother wasn’t able to satisfy her husband sexually so he had no choice but to molest his daughter.

I find both of those ideas repugnant, and I’m sure she would as well.

 

[Publisher]

I would rather that the issue never come up in any parish I attend, frankly.
But if it ever does, I am not the type to keep my mouth shut.

I am a new Catholic, and I have spent some time reading about this issue and trying to figure out why the superiors of these priests acted the way they did. I have some theories, and those theories are charitable to the motives of the bishops. But I don’t think that their good intentions excuse their actions, which caused more harm to individuals and to the Church as a whole. I believe they should face justice, too.

Again, thank you…that is one of the strongest and best stands on this issue I have read.

This was a difficult situation for all when the news broke. The enormity of it drew attention to a problem all faith traditions face…the fact that it was the Catholic Church that brought it to the forefront is due larely to it’s size and how widespread the instances soon came to light.

Because of what the Catholic Church has faced, other faith traditions cannot remain silent either. This hopefully will become something to be used “redemptively” to protect all children.

Thank you again…your stand on this matter is greatly appreciated.

 

[inthecloud]

Ahh, that is more clear. Next question. The 10% of molestations between priests and girls…how should that be handled? The removal of heterosexual priests?

Publisher, you are a reasonble man. There are new studies that show that homosexual teachers are most likely to molest students that heterosexual teachers in proportion to the size of population. So I guess that while removing homosexuals will not solve the problem of heterosexual molestation it will certaily diminish the fact that a small number of priest were able to do so much damage (most cases of molestation happened in boarding houses and schools). And celibate heterosexuals are less likey to molest children that married heterosexual who oftem molest their own children and step children.

Sadly this is the more common scenario:

As someone with a close friend who was molested by her father, I find this line of reasoning (that celibacy leads to pedophilia) very troubling. By this logic I would have to conclude either 1 my friend is lying, since married men aren’t pedophiles 2 the abuse was her mother’s fault, since her mother wasn’t able to satisfy her husband sexually so he had no choice but to molest his daughter.

I find both of those ideas repugnant, and I’m sure she would as well.

And the molesters can be pastors (I know two cases), cops (I know one case), politicians (I know three cases), business people (two cases).