Evangelical Lutherans vote too...

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washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/21/AR2009082103343_pf.html

Leaders of the nation’s biggest Lutheran denomination voted Friday to allow gays in committed relationships to serve as clergy in the church – making it one of the largest Christian denominations in the country to significantly open the pulpit to gays.

According to my Lutheran friend. This should be good for a few converts.

I see there is a similiar thread in non-catholic religions. You can post any comments there if you would.
Thanks.
 
Personally I don’t understand the comment, “If it leads to converts”.
Why would going against Bible teaching lead to converts. There is going to be a big split & lots of broken hearts. There are those who love this church but will leave as a matter of conscience in pain feeling betrayed.
I know this for a fact. I’m one of them who saw this coming & left several years ago sick of all the arguing & tension.
I came home to Rome though & that was a good thing for me & my family but we miss our friends. I have many friends who left the ELCA in the last about four years one after another. Some went to more fundamental churches. Some have been discontented & moved on once again. Not happy. These are people who were leaders in our congregation.
Believe me when I say once more; It is a Sad Day for the members of the ELCA today.
 
This kind of thing has been going on from the beginning. The bible is quite clear on its description of “Blind Guides”. Still it always amazes me when these things occur, it is so blatantly against the will of God. I guess these people just must feel they are wiser than our Creator:shrug:
 
Agatina said:
Personally I don’t understand the comment, “If it leads to converts”.
Why would going against Bible teaching lead to converts. There is going to be a big split & lots of broken hearts. There are those who love this church but will leave as a matter of conscience in pain feeling betrayed.
I know this for a fact. I’m one of them who saw this coming & left several years ago sick of all the arguing & tension.
I came home to Rome though & that was a good thing for me & my family but we miss our friends. I have many friends who left the ELCA in the last about four years one after another. Some went to more fundamental churches. Some have been discontented & moved on once again. Not happy. These are people who were leaders in our congregation.
Believe me when I say once more; It is a Sad Day for the members of the ELCA today.
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Agatina, Thanks for your post. I would say that there is a similiar thread running at this time. Comments could go there.

But, to answer your question. Trouble and dissatisfaction in the ELCA could lead folks to abandon that sect. Returning hopefully to the true Church. You did!🙂
ATB
 
Agatina said:
Personally I don’t understand the comment, “If it leads to converts”.
Why would going against Bible teaching lead to converts.
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Making things easier than they really are, going directly against Scripture to make their message more attractive and molding themselves to political correctness… the easier it is to ‘follow’ Jesus the more people will ‘follow’ Him. Of course, you can’t follow Him at all if you don’t follow Him all the way.
 
Yes I did return to the One Holy & Apostolic Church! But I was a cradle Catholic who had six years of Catholic school back when the nuns were the teachers.
I became Lutheran because I thought it was just like the Catholic but in English which my late husband would go to. He just couldn’t understand why anyone would go to a church & listen to “all that mumbo jumbo”.
We settled into the Lutheran and we found our dear Lord there. Friends there. Then came the merger in I think 1988 & it began to creep to the Liberal side of things slowly but continuously.
But here is the difference between me and others; I had the Catholic Church to come back to. Many of the Lutherans are very anti-Catholic plus the Priest scandals just locked in their prejudices. One Mo. Synod Luth. told me in all seriousness that in the old days in Rome there were tunnels where the Priests could walk through at night & rape the nuns & then bury their baby’s in the catacombs. Others have less serious misconceptions about the RCC. Bad Popes. The selling of indulgences.
These type of people, good people living good lives, will never become Catholic.
I always give genrously to the Catholic Communication Council (they collected a few Sundays ago) in hopes that they can get out the word about how good our Church really is.
This is why I feel sad, though, about what is happening in the ELCA.
 
Mickey_Finn said:
If it leads to converts. Then atleast some good will come of it.
ATB
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What good is conversion if your church preaches that perversion, i.e., homosexuality is not a sin, and that it is OK for your pastor to live that life style? How many will be led astray?
 
“churches” like the Episcopal Church (TEC) and The liberal Lutheran groups like ELCA (not LCMS mind you) fascinate me because they are coming from one of two modes of thinking. They either think that, by ‘ordaining’ gays to the ministry they’ll get more followers, or they think that it’s truly the right thing to do. In either case it’s a terrifying prospect!

Empirical data shows that these liberal, feel-good, rules-free, modern hippie communes with steeples do NOT recruit more parishoners or build numbers. Case in point was TEC even before the sane conservatives left it like a cold habit. Their numbers had been on the decline for the better part of twenty years. It was an aging, crusty, dying entity parishoner-wise. And as they became more “progressive,” their numbers only declined. And of course the departure of the more conscience-minded Anglicans that created the ACNA only exacerbated their horrible attendance numbers. No doubt the same will be true with the ELCA. As I stated in other posts, a large portion of folks, probably on the order of 30%, will go to evangelical conservative churches like the Southern Baptists or LCMS Lutheran churches or to ACNA or conservative presbyterians and some Catholic, etc. Their recruitment will stagnate and they’ll die on the vine drifting into irrelevence.

The second option, as I stated, is that these liberal Lutherans actually BELIEVE this line of bull that they’re peddling. That’s just as scary as the first option of using it to “open up and recruit by being hip and cool” maneuver. To actually believe God sanctions non-celibate homosexuals has strayed so far from the Scriptures into never-never land.

In either case, this church is hammering the nails in its coffin quickly…The Episcopal Church, essentially, with the 95 Theses…
 
Deacon_Ed_B said:
What good is conversion if your church preaches that perversion, i.e., homosexuality is not a sin, and that it is OK for your pastor to live that life style? How many will be led astray?
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Deacon, I was referring to conversions to the catholic church.😉
ATB
 
Reformation broke away from mother church because it thought that it would not condone abuse and wanted to stick to the true teaching of God. But instead it looks like it has deviated miles away from the teaching that it wanted to uphold. Ironically, it is the Catholic Church that’s unwavered and steadfast in adhering to the truth of God; that she does not sway by the wind of change like grass does. Despite all the adversities and the onslaught of opposition against her position regarding the sins of birth control and homosexual act, she never wavers. If you are built on the rock no amount of storm and wind will uproot your foundation. This is what the Catholic Church is - she will never change in the matter of faith and moral.

God bless.
 
Luther: All we need is the Bible.
ELCA: All we need to toss away is the Bible.:hmmm:
 
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