Evangelize me! Help me be ok with having faith

[onegirlinchrist]

Hi All,

Was’t sure where to put this question, and I suppose this forum is more for “how to evangelize.” Well, you can practice on me lol.

I come originally from a Mormon background, and then tried various Protestant denominations. What turned me to Catholicism was my frustration with theological disagreements within Protestantism: surely, the Holy Spirit wouldn’t guide people to such different theological directions, or require us to become Bible Theology Ph.Ds before we could properly “identify” the true church!

Needless to say, I’m very “spiritually exhausted.” I’ve had the confusing experience of “feeling” that something is true…and then changing my mind and feeling something else is true, etc…and now the spiritual “feeling” part of me is totally worn down and I just don’t know how to trust my feelings anymore. It’s also hard for me to understand how my family can remain Mormon and appear to be having positive spiritual experiences.

What gives?

Are there any other converts who can relate to this experience (frustration with and suspicion of feelings)? Further, I know the Catholics are big on faith and reason working together. I really need to know that my belief in Christ is more than just a feeling, or instinct imprinted on me in childhood. Any books that people have found particularly helpful in beefing up the “reason” aspect of faith?

Thanks in advance to all who read and respond. It’s truly been so helpful and cathartic for me to participate in these forums!

 

[Della]

Hi All,

Was’t sure where to put this question, and I suppose this forum is more for “how to evangelize.” Well, you can practice on me lol.

Welcome to the discernment process. From what I’ve read from your comments below, you are already well on your way.

I come originally from a Mormon background, and then tried various Protestant denominations. What turned me to Catholicism was my frustration with theological disagreements within Protestantism: surely, the Holy Spirit wouldn’t guide people to such different theological directions, or require us to become Bible Theology Ph.Ds before we could properly “identify” the true church!

Not from a Mormon background, but I was a member of the Assemblies of God for a good part of my life. I can relate to being in an insular group with certain expectations of its members. And, having explored various Protestant ecclesial groups, I too came to understand that the claim that they were being guided by the Holy Spirit while disagreeing about essentials things had to be a delusion. And by some claiming that one needs to be able to discern the Bible for oneself in order to live in Christ left out those unable to do so, such as the very young, the mentally disabled, the illiterate, etc. I spent some time in the Episcopal Church, the one I had been brought up in but left for the AoG (not my choice at the time), and even though they were, like the Lutherans, not a “Bible-only” denomination, still, I saw how separating themselves from Rome had made them into their own Magisterium by committee. The break-down in moral certainty alone is proof that such a system doesn’t work nor is it guided by the Holy Spirit.

Needless to say, I’m very “spiritually exhausted.” I’ve had the confusing experience of “feeling” that something is true…and then changing my mind and feeling something else is true, etc…and now the spiritual “feeling” part of me is totally worn down and I just don’t know how to trust my feelings anymore. It’s also hard for me to understand how my family can remain Mormon and appear to be having positive spiritual experiences.

What gives?

A couple of things are at work here. Firstly, we moderns, while claiming reason as supreme, do, in reality, base what we believe on what we feel to be true. It’s a faulty way to determine truth because our feelings can deceive us. The other factor at work is that God works within the hearts and souls of all who are willing to open their hearts to him because he will not extinguish the smallest flicker of faith, even if that faith is based on flawed theology. He wishes all to come to the full knowledge of Christ, certainly, but he will not break anyone’s faith in order to do that. Rather he woos through the spiritual consolations he bestows. Besides this, when people feel comfortable where they are they don’t look elsewhere. We need to pray that complacent hearts be stirred to thirst for the truth.

Are there any other converts who can relate to this experience (frustration with and suspicion of feelings)? Further, I know the Catholics are big on faith and reason working together. I really need to know that my belief in Christ is more than just a feeling, or instinct imprinted on me in childhood. Any books that people have found particularly helpful in beefing up the “reason” aspect of faith?

I can so relate to your dilemma. I recommend the writings of G. K. Chesterton, Fulton Sheen, even C. S. Lewis, whose writings were instrumental in my returning to the Episcopal Church, which led to my searching farther into Catholicism. Long story there.

Thanks in advance to all who read and respond. It’s truly been so helpful and cathartic for me to participate in these forums!

You’re welcome. Ask all the questions you need to and express any concerns you have. We will do our best to answer you or get you the resources you needs.

 

[Joe_5859]

My experience is somewhat different being that I am a cradle Catholic, but I can empathize with some of what you are experiencing. When I was in college, I went through a period of spiritual doubt where I thought the Church was just some human institution, the Bible was just some book, and Jesus was just some man.

Once I started to become open to the possibility that I was wrong and the Church was right, this is the book that really set me on the path of understanding:

Yes or No?: Straight Answers to Tough Questions about Christianity by Peter Kreeft

While reading that book, for the first time in my life I realized that the Catholic faith was reasonable. People with intelligence really believe all this stuff and they’re not deluded! They actually have well thought out reasons that it’s all true!

I know different books can hit different people in different ways at different times. This is the one that spoke to me, so I toss it out there for your consideration.

 

[catholicscot]

There are some ‘classic’ books which describe conversion journeys where reason played a big part, the Confessions of St Augustine and Apologia pro Vita Sua of Cardinal Newman. I certainly found the first helpful in my own spiritual life. They might be a little daunting though. Newman also wrote a conversion novel Loss and Gain which covers a lot of similar ground but it is very Anglican centred and 19th Century.

People from non-Catholic backgrounds, such as your LDS family members, can enjoy genuine spiritual experiences because God has a relationship with everyone. However, these can be radically misunderstood or confused with false experiences unless a well grounded framework of discernment is applied to them. There needs to be an authoritative standard by which to judge these things and Catholicism has one that has worked pretty well for the past two thousand years.

Another book I would mention is Waiting on God by the French philosopher Simone Weil. Although she never formally joined the Church she had some great insights into faith and reason which are worth considering. Don’t be daunted by the word ‘philosopher’, most of the book consists of short articles or letters that she wrote for ordinary people. Again, I found this helpful in my own path towards Rome.

 

[MacQ]

Hi All,

Was’t sure where to put this question, and I suppose this forum is more for “how to evangelize.” Well, you can practice on me lol.

I come originally from a Mormon background, and then tried various Protestant denominations. What turned me to Catholicism was my frustration with theological disagreements within Protestantism: surely, the Holy Spirit wouldn’t guide people to such different theological directions, or require us to become Bible Theology Ph.Ds before we could properly “identify” the true church!

Needless to say, I’m very “spiritually exhausted.” I’ve had the confusing experience of “feeling” that something is true…and then changing my mind and feeling something else is true, etc…and now the spiritual “feeling” part of me is totally worn down and I just don’t know how to trust my feelings anymore. It’s also hard for me to understand how my family can remain Mormon and appear to be having positive spiritual experiences.

What gives?

Are there any other converts who can relate to this experience (frustration with and suspicion of feelings)? Further, I know the Catholics are big on faith and reason working together. I really need to know that my belief in Christ is more than just a feeling, or instinct imprinted on me in childhood. Any books that people have found particularly helpful in beefing up the “reason” aspect of faith?

Thanks in advance to all who read and respond. It’s truly been so helpful and cathartic for me to participate in these forums!

What comes to mind is the quote about “You would not be seeking me had you not already found Me.”

I’d suggest finding a parish with a very good RCIA program. (I’m told they can vary in quality) It’s specifically for “enquirers”, and no pressure is applied to actually commit to become Catholic. In a good one, you’ll get your questions answered, and it will greatly aid your discernment. No harm no foul if at the end of it you decide to seek elsewhere.

I have relatives who are Mormons…I don’t fear at all for their souls…it’s all about a relationship with Jesus for all of us, and their appears solid. It wouldn’t be a good fit for me…I rather like adhering to the source than something that sprang up more recently…and once I came to understand the theologic basis of catholicism, it became all to beautiful to me, and has indeed brought me closer to Him…
So seek it out…enquire…Go to Mass…keep an open mind and heart…invite the Holy Spirit in. See what happens…and don’t worry about your loved ones.
Godspeed!

 

[tawny]

I agree with MacQ; find yourself a well established & thrieving RCIA program in a Parish. It is the best place to start. Speak with the RCIA Director, ask questions about whether it is an ongoing program or not. Ask if the instructors are Certified Catechists with the Diocese, etc.

 

[Ad_Orientem]

onegirl,

I relate to your experience. Perhaps what you “felt” was the goodness that exists in various religions. The Catholic Church teaches:

ome and even very many of the significant elements and endowments which together go to build up and give life to the Church itself, can exist outside the visible boundaries of the Catholic Church: the written word of God; the life of grace; faith, hope and charity, with the other interior gifts of the Holy Spirit, and visible elements too. … Nevertheless, our separated brethren, whether considered as individuals or as Communities and Churches, are not blessed with that unity which Jesus Christ wished to bestow on all those who through Him were born again into one body…

You can read the whole document here: Unitatis Redintegratio (Restoration of Unity)

And our Catechism (manual of teachings):
CCC (with search box)

 

[EasterBeagle]

This will tell you everything you need to know:

lighthousecatholicmedia.org/store/title/from-mormon-missionary-to-the-catholic-faith#

 

[Truth_Faith13]

Hi All,

Was’t sure where to put this question, and I suppose this forum is more for “how to evangelize.” Well, you can practice on me lol.

I come originally from a Mormon background, and then tried various Protestant denominations. What turned me to Catholicism was my frustration with theological disagreements within Protestantism: surely, the Holy Spirit wouldn’t guide people to such different theological directions, or require us to become Bible Theology Ph.Ds before we could properly “identify” the true church!

Needless to say, I’m very “spiritually exhausted.” I’ve had the confusing experience of “feeling” that something is true…and then changing my mind and feeling something else is true, etc…and now the spiritual “feeling” part of me is totally worn down and I just don’t know how to trust my feelings anymore. It’s also hard for me to understand how my family can remain Mormon and appear to be having positive spiritual experiences.

What gives?

Are there any other converts who can relate to this experience (frustration with and suspicion of feelings)? Further, I know the Catholics are big on faith and reason working together. I really need to know that my belief in Christ is more than just a feeling, or instinct imprinted on me in childhood. Any books that people have found particularly helpful in beefing up the “reason” aspect of faith?

Thanks in advance to all who read and respond. It’s truly been so helpful and cathartic for me to participate in these forums!

I’ll post a better reply tomorrow but just wanted to say hi and I know exactly how you feel.

My family are secular, husband atheist, I went to a catholic primary, was Mormon for three years, have tried various Protestant churches (evangelical, Pentecostal, baptist, cultish, c of e etc) and I’ve attended a few masses. I’m at a stage where I feel completely cut off from God (I’m sure my doing), don’t know which feelings to trust or what to do.

Well done for leaving Mormonism

 

[onegirlinchrist]

The other factor at work is that God works within the hearts and souls of all who are willing to open their hearts to him because he will not extinguish the smallest flicker of faith, even if that faith is based on flawed theology. He wishes all to come to the full knowledge of Christ, certainly, but he will not break anyone’s faith in order to do that. Rather he woos through the spiritual consolations he bestows.

Thank you so much for your intelligent and gracious response, and your quote above has been ringing in my ears. The book recommendations sound on point. I would be interested in knowing if there was a defining doctrine or concept that made you commit fully to Catholicism. If I had to pick one at this point for myself, it would be an awareness of how much harm is done by the great diversity of Christian doctrines. Homes are divided, people wander for years looking for the truth. Somehow, I just know that’s not what Christ intended.

For years, I thought Martin Luther was a hero I see things so differently now. The chaos of Protestantism paved the way for the Mormon Church, too. How sad that these divisions and hostilities exist within Christendom.

 

[onegirlinchrist]

My experience is somewhat different being that I am a cradle Catholic, but I can empathize with some of what you are experiencing. When I was in college, I went through a period of spiritual doubt where I thought the Church was just some human institution, the Bible was just some book, and Jesus was just some man.

Once I started to become open to the possibility that I was wrong and the Church was right, this is the book that really set me on the path of understanding:

Yes or No?: Straight Answers to Tough Questions about Christianity by Peter Kreeft

While reading that book, for the first time in my life I realized that the Catholic faith was reasonable. People with intelligence really believe all this stuff and they’re not deluded! They actually have well thought out reasons that it’s all true!

I know different books can hit different people in different ways at different times. This is the one that spoke to me, so I toss it out there for your consideration.

That sounds EXACTLY like the book I need right now, put it on my amazon wishlist for my next order. Thank you!!!

 

[onegirlinchrist]

There are some ‘classic’ books which describe conversion journeys where reason played a big part, the Confessions of St Augustine and Apologia pro Vita Sua of Cardinal Newman. I certainly found the first helpful in my own spiritual life. They might be a little daunting though. Newman also wrote a conversion novel Loss and Gain which covers a lot of similar ground but it is very Anglican centred and 19th Century.

People from non-Catholic backgrounds, such as your LDS family members, can enjoy genuine spiritual experiences because God has a relationship with everyone. However, these can be radically misunderstood or confused with false experiences unless a well grounded framework of discernment is applied to them. There needs to be an authoritative standard by which to judge these things and Catholicism has one that has worked pretty well for the past two thousand years.

Another book I would mention is Waiting on God by the French philosopher Simone Weil. Although she never formally joined the Church she had some great insights into faith and reason which are worth considering. Don’t be daunted by the word ‘philosopher’, most of the book consists of short articles or letters that she wrote for ordinary people. Again, I found this helpful in my own path towards Rome.

Thank you so much. My Dad has actually been attending Mass with me, (he kindly wants to spend time together, and he’s also something of a religious tourist, interested in how others worship). He said the other day that he would be open to reading some Catholic literature (he loves philosophy and intellectual history). Some of those books sound like books he and I could read together. Thanks.

 

[onegirlinchrist]

What comes to mind is the quote about “You would not be seeking me had you not already found Me.”

And there’s another quote from this thread that’s been ringing in my ears. Thanks. Helps me have some clarity. I appreciate the encouragement!

 

[onegirlinchrist]

I agree with MacQ; find yourself a well established & thrieving RCIA program in a Parish. It is the best place to start. Speak with the RCIA Director, ask questions about whether it is an ongoing program or not. Ask if the instructors are Certified Catechists with the Diocese, etc.

Thanks for your (name removed by moderator)ut. My local parish said their program runs from Sep-May. That wouldn’t be ongoing…Come to think of it, I do believe I heard the term “ongoing” to describe the RCIA program of different parish. I’m assuming that an ongoing one allows you to spend as much time in RCIA as possible, you don’t have to convert on the Sep-May timeline.

Perhaps more than anything, I’m just interested in getting started! Thanks for clarifying that RCIA programs run on different time schedules and that there are indeed some that go year round.

 

[onegirlinchrist]

onegirl,

I relate to your experience. Perhaps what you “felt” was the goodness that exists in various religions. The Catholic Church teaches:

ome and even very many of the significant elements and endowments which together go to build up and give life to the Church itself, can exist outside the visible boundaries of the Catholic Church: the written word of God; the life of grace; faith, hope and charity, with the other interior gifts of the Holy Spirit, and visible elements too. … Nevertheless, our separated brethren, whether considered as individuals or as Communities and Churches, are not blessed with that unity which Jesus Christ wished to bestow on all those who through Him were born again into one body…

You can read the whole document here: Unitatis Redintegratio (Restoration of Unity)

And our Catechism (manual of teachings):
CCC (with search box)

Perfect. I am so reading that from start to finish later. Happy that the Church has addressed this phenomenon.

 

[onegirlinchrist]

This will tell you everything you need to know:

lighthousecatholicmedia.org/store/title/from-mormon-missionary-to-the-catholic-faith#

Oh just wow. That’s exactly my path. Thanks a bunch, never saw this one before!

 

[onegirlinchrist]

I’ll post a better reply tomorrow but just wanted to say hi and I know exactly how you feel.

My family are secular, husband atheist, I went to a catholic primary, was Mormon for three years, have tried various Protestant churches (evangelical, Pentecostal, baptist, cultish, c of e etc) and I’ve attended a few masses. I’m at a stage where I feel completely cut off from God (I’m sure my doing), don’t know which feelings to trust or what to do.

Well done for leaving Mormonism

Thank you, and oh my, take a deep breath!

I mentioned this in response to another poster…

I’m sure Christ did not intend for His fold to have to wander and “try out” so many different Churches; the confusion of Protestantism seems to be the work of the adversary, and I can’t believe Christ would make people wait until 1820 for Mormonism.

So I’ve now decided that if Catholicism is not true, then Christ failed miserably to shepherd us from above. My Mormon family will say, “human nature” can be blamed for the supposed apostasy of Catholicism and Protestantism: I would ask, “how can you trust the Mormon church to not apostatize, if Christ’s original church in ancient times did?”

In other words…

If Christianity is true, Catholicism has to be true. Christ either succeeded in establishing a church, or He didn’t. If Catholicism is not true, then Christ can not be who He claimed He was, because His church failed…that’s the point I’ve come to. Helps to give me some clarity.

A deeper question that I’m uncomfortable with facing, but feel the need to, is: is Jesus Christ who He said he was? Is Christianity itself the right paradigm?

Frankly, the Catholic Church appears to be the only church that can satisfy my hunger for absolute answers. No other religion outside of Catholicism but the Mormon Church claims to be divinely inspired and guided by a single leader who can speak definitely for the Heavens. In fact, even the Mormon Church can’t claim that. Their Prophet can never speak infallibly; all of his revelation is subject to a churchwide vote before it can become doctrine. Sounds a lot like the Eastern Orthodox, who believe that the Holy Spirit will lead the faithful to the right consensus, and no pronouncements from “above” in EO hierarchy are infallibly binding.

God bless you in your journey! At least it helps (for me at least) to have narrowed Christianity down to Catholicism. Otherwise, it’s 30,000 something possibilities and growing. Thank you, Martin Luther.

 

[DAML72]

I do know a little bit of what you are talking about. My suggestion would be to read the Catechism of the Catholic Church. Take a little at a time. See if it makes sense to you, pray about the aspects you don’t understand, and see where it takes you. Don’t force anything, don’t burn yourself out. Pray for guidance and wisdom. It will come.

 

[DAML72]

Thank you so much for your intelligent and gracious response, and your quote above has been ringing in my ears. The book recommendations sound on point. I would be interested in knowing if there was a defining doctrine or concept that made you commit fully to Catholicism. If I had to pick one at this point for myself, it would be an awareness of how much harm is done by the great diversity of Christian doctrines. Homes are divided, people wander for years looking for the truth. Somehow, I just know that’s not what Christ intended.

For years, I thought Martin Luther was a hero I see things so differently now. The chaos of Protestantism paved the way for the Mormon Church, too. How sad that these divisions and hostilities exist within Christendom.

Might I also suggest watching a few episodes of ‘The Journey Home’ on EWTN? I believe most of them are on Youtube now. I find them absolutely fascinating because each week features the conversion story of a different person - all from different backgrounds. I don’t want to overload you, because it sounds like maybe you could use a little bit of time to just sit with things, but I think it could really give you some perspective. You may also see, as many others have, that the journey to the Catholic faith is often circuitous, and you will begin to see that nothing in your past has been wasted - it has all brought you to where you are today. It’s been one of my favorite shows on TV since I began my journey almost 2 years ago.

 

[DAML72]

Perfect. I am so reading that from start to finish later. Happy that the Church has addressed this phenomenon.

After 2000 years of growth and development, there isn’t much the Church hasn’t addressed in one way or another.