Ever Notice the Star on Our Lady of Fatima?

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Yes, Blessed Mary is known as the Star of the Sea and the Morning Star.

In studying an apparition, one must not fall into the trap of “proof texting” it, so to speak. We should not look at individual components of an apparition on their own. Rather, we should endeavor to incorporate each element into a cohesive whole.

Our Lady of Fatima is purposefully connected with the 13th of the month. This underlines its relationship to Esther since Esther has as its most important date the 13th of the month of Adar. Then attempts should be made to incorporate the other elements along those lines, and in so doing, it becomes fairly easy to complete the typology of Esther and Our Lady of Fatima, and to come to an understanding of the star.

It is especially important to understand Fatima in light of the fact that it is not over. At Fatima on May 13, 2010, Pope Benedict XVI prayed for the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary to happen before the centenary of Fatima arrives ( in 2017).

The cited article points to the possibility of July 13, 2017 as being the end of the apparition, but I personally think its “expiration” date will be October 13, 2017.

God bless you.
 
Not to belabor the point, but here is another very strong, reliable Jewish source that basically says Esther could mean ‘star’ (and Hadassah and myrtle are mentioned too, so both are usually associated with Esther in various sources):

*R. Nehemiah said: Her right name was Hadassah. Why was she called Esther? Because the nations called her for her beauty “star” (αστηρ).
*
jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Talmud/megillah1.html

(Search on star)

And one other point - Fatima is from God, and God doesn’t do coincidences.

God bless you.
 
beehumble said:
Oh and the sources you cited in the search for ‘strong evidence’ of Esther meaning star are not very ‘strong’ . Neither one of the Jewish sources cited mention star or Hadassah or even delve into the meaning of Esther (lack of meaning does not by any means rule it out.)

The Jewish Encyclopedia does mention ‘star’ in association with Hadassah’s Persian name ‘Esther’:

jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/5872-esther

Name of the chief character in the Book of Esther, **derived, according to some authorities, from the Persian “stara” (star); **but regarded by others as a modification of “Ishtar,” the name of the Babylonian goddess (see below).
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Thanks. I’ll accept that as support, albeit inconclusive, for Esther meaning “star”.

Going back to the original purpose of this thread, which was to associate Our Lady of Fatima with Esther, my view is that it’s plausible, and possibly significant, but unproven.

With regard to 13 February being in 13 Adar I won’t be going back to the article, as my post was not intended as a direct “checklist” on the article itself. I was looking at the article, and also the OP and other information which has been posted here.

I’ll have to leave it there. Thankyou for your posts.

~ Edmundus
 
No analogy or typology aligns perfectly. And God always gives us more than one way to interpret things. Why? So that we can accept His ways with faith. A way out with Esther/Fatima is to claim it is coincidence. But as it says in Scripture, God does not do ‘coincidence’:

Prov 16:33 “The lot is cast into the lap, but its every decision is from the LORD.”

Jesus sent Blessed Mary to Fatima (later He indicated this when He told Lucia ‘…they did not heed My request…’ (the request to consecrate Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary).

It is very safe to assume everything about that apparition was given to us from God for a reason - appearing on the 13th for six times, the ‘clothed with the sun’ aspect of Our Lady’s appearance , the yellow star, the Miracle of the Sun, the final appearance of Our Lady as Our Lady of Mount Carmel complete with a scapular on her arm, etc.

I readily accept Our Lady of Fatima as being related to Esther on one level (as do many many others). Unpacking other layers of Fatima reveal other aspects as well, such as the great sign that appeared in the sky - a Woman clothed with the sun - seen by John in Revelation 12.

God bless you.
 
**1) ** “With regard to 13 February being in 13 Adar I won’t be going back to the article…”

I made the mistake. The month of February coincides with the Jewish month of Adar and nothing more, which is still significant.

2) “The cited article points to the possibility of July 13, 2017 as being the end of the apparition, but I personally think its “expiration” date will be October 13, 2017.”

But Our Lady returned and made the formal request on June 13, 1929.

Note: If Pope Pius XII consecrated Russia in 1952, there is no “expiration date”.
 
beehumble said:
No analogy or typology aligns perfectly. And God always gives us more than one way to interpret things. Why? So that we can accept His ways with faith. A way out with Esther/Fatima is to claim it is coincidence. But as it says in Scripture, God does not do ‘coincidence’:

Prov 16:33 “The lot is cast into the lap, but its every decision is from the LORD.”

Jesus sent Blessed Mary to Fatima (later He indicated this when He told Lucia ‘…they did not heed My request…’ (the request to consecrate Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary).

It is very safe to assume everything about that apparition was given to us from God for a reason - appearing on the 13th for six times, the ‘clothed with the sun’ aspect of Our Lady’s appearance , the yellow star, the Miracle of the Sun, the final appearance of Our Lady as Our Lady of Mount Carmel complete with a scapular on her arm, etc.

I readily accept Our Lady of Fatima as being related to Esther on one level (as do many many others). Unpacking other layers of Fatima reveal other aspects as well, such as the great sign that appeared in the sky - a Woman clothed with the sun - seen by John in Revelation 12.

God bless you.
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👍 Here’s an interesting site about the relation of Esther/Fatima Star
Hidden Revelations: The Star of Esther and the Secrets of Fatima
keepingitcatholic.blogspot.com/2008/05/hidden-revelations-star-of-esther-and.html
 
“Here’s an interesting site…”

And its the same link I gave in the OP.
 
Albino_Luciani said:
**1) ** “With regard to 13 February being in 13 Adar I won’t be going back to the article…”

I made the mistake. The month of February coincides with the Jewish month of Adar and nothing more, which is still significant.

2) “The cited article points to the possibility of July 13, 2017 as being the end of the apparition, but I personally think its “expiration” date will be October 13, 2017.”

But Our Lady returned and made the formal request on June 13, 1929.

Note: If Pope Pius XII consecrated Russia in 1952, there is no “expiration date”.
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Pius did not do the consecration in union with the bishops so it was not accepted.

The intent to make the request - and great detail of what the request would be - was announced on July 13, 1917. Our Lady knew the Church would need time to study and accept Fatima. Part of the difficulty in July 1917 of the CHurch accepting the request as being authentic is that Russia had not yet become officially atheistic - but later the Church became aware of how the USSR had begun to presecute Christians en masse etc. thus making the nature of the request more understandable and thus more believable.

So what I am saying is that the notification given by Our Lady - in fact the promise to return to do so - in 1917 that she will return to formally make the request for the Act of Consecration of Russia, was the announcement of the request.

(Suppose the children went to the bishop on July 13, 1917 and told him Our Lady had appeared to them and she wants the Pope to make an Act of Consecration of Russia to her Immaculate Heart, in union with the bishops of the world. The bishop would have said, "No way am I going to pass this on to the Pope - how do we know this is authentic? How do we know you’re not lying? We need to study this event.)

Accepting this reasoning, and then using the words of Jesus comparing Fatima’s request to the request made for an Act of Consecration to His Sacred Heart, then we note that the Sacred Heart request ‘ran out’ exactly 100 years after it was made. Using this fact, it could mean there are 100 years from the 1917 Fatima apparition until it ‘expires’. Logically it would seem then the request timeframe would run from July 13, 1917 until July 13, 2017. However, Fatima spanned 6 apparitions and through careful study one can see that all of the first five apparitions were given as the lead in to the climax on October 13, 1917 and its Miracle of the Sun. The intent was to have the miracle witnessed by many people, and in 1917 that would require time for the message to travel throughout the region - a poor, underdeveloped region without mass transit nor mass communication. It required the spreading by word of mouth, which took time. Halfway through the series of apparitions, the message was given (July), as if to say, ‘this is why I have come - this is what this apparition is about.’ But then the sun miracle underlined the message - in fact the sun miracle was prefaced with Our Lady saying “Man must stop offending God for He is already too much offended” then the great miracle began.

(Think of it the other way - suppose Our Lady appeared and did the sun miracle on May 13 - who would have seen it? Not many. And they would have no idea why that strange movement of the sun had occurred. But by giving several month’s time for word to spread, and for rumors to spread that the children had been given a secret by Our Lady, the miracle had a great audience and it served to confirm that Our Lady has indeed appeared and the secret was true. So all five apparitions were the lead-in, they set the stage, so to speak, for the great theophany of the Miracle of the Sun.)

Hence, I use October 13, 1917 as the date for the Fatima apparition and I think it ‘expires’ on October 13, 2017.

God bless you.
 
“Accepting this reasoning…” -Beehumble (love your name tag)

If I may, Our Lady of the Rosary came back in 1929 to make the formal request for the consecration of Russia. Two years later in 1931, Our Lord complained to Sister Lucia, “Make it known to My Ministers, that as they delay in fulfilling My requests, like the King of France, they will follow him into misfortune.”

POINT NUMBER ONE

After two years, Our Lord was getting impatient.

POINT NUMBER TWO

The consecration of Russia is mentioned in PART TWO of the Secret. Part two of the Secret is only concerned with material chastisements, namely wars and persecutions of the Church and the Holy Father.

POINT NUMBER THREE

The Third Part of the Secret of Fatima is concerned only with the loss of Faith worldwide.

HERE IS PROOF

“The (Third) Secret of Fatima speaks neither of atomic bombs, nor nuclear warheads, nor Pershing missiles, nor SS-20’s. Its content concerns only our faith. To identify the Secret with catastrophic announcements or with a nuclear holocaust is to deform the meaning of the message.” -The Bishop of Fatima, Alberto Cosme do Amaral, 9-10-84.

CONCLUSION

Pope Pius XII consecrated Russia in 1952 without the Bishops as Our Lady of the Rosary predicted at Fatima:

“THE HOLY FATHER WILL CONSECRATE RUSSIA TO ME, SHE WILL BE CONVERTED (from making war), AND A “CERTAIN” PERIOD OF PEACE WILL BE GRANTED TO THE WORLD.” There is no hundred year time limit and even if there was, we have this promise from the Holy Bible - “For the sake of the elect, the time will be shortened.” THE YEAR 2013 IS THE YEAR I WILL BE WATCHING.
 
Albino_Luciani said:
“Accepting this reasoning…” -Beehumble (love your name tag)

If I may, Our Lady of the Rosary came back in 1929 to make the formal request for the consecration of Russia. Two years later in 1931, Our Lord complained to Sister Lucia, “Make it known to My Ministers, that as they delay in fulfilling My requests, like the King of France, they will follow him into misfortune.”

POINT NUMBER ONE

After two years, Our Lord was getting impatient.
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Yes, but this does not change anything I said about a possible one hundred year time span being based on the date of October 13, 1917.

If the hundred-year time span aspect is true, then even before Jesus said that in 1931, He already knew He had set one hundred years for the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary to take place. That would mean that In 1931, He was just letting us know the ‘clock is ticking’ and that we did not have forever to adhere to the Fatima requests.
Albino_Luciani said:
POINT NUMBER TWO

The consecration of Russia is mentioned in PART TWO of the Secret. Part two of the Secret is only concerned with material chastisements, namely wars and persecutions of the Church and the Holy Father.
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Not necessarily so. Persecution can take physical as well as spiritual forms - forcing churches to close their doors doesn’t physically kill anyone but it is a persecution of the Church none the less.

Remember Jesus also said that Russian errors will spread throughout the world before the consecration was made. Russian errors include atheism and government-sanctioned abortion, amongst others. Removing God from the public sphere such as schools is a Russian error that has spread and this is a form of spiritual persecution aimed at the spreading of the Gospel.

After Russia (USSR) collapsed in 1991 the physical persecutions in Russia stopped, but the spiritual forms of persecution continue in the West and have even increased since 1991.
Albino_Luciani said:
POINT NUMBER THREE

The Third Part of the Secret of Fatima is concerned only with the loss of Faith worldwide.

HERE IS PROOF

“The (Third) Secret of Fatima speaks neither of atomic bombs, nor nuclear warheads, nor Pershing missiles, nor SS-20’s. Its content concerns only our faith. To identify the Secret with catastrophic announcements or with a nuclear holocaust is to deform the meaning of the message.” -The Bishop of Fatima, Alberto Cosme do Amaral, 9-10-84.
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That is not proof of anything unfortunately, because the secret wasn’t released until 2000, so the bishop was just giving his private, personal opinion about it. (Lucia wrote it down and sealed it in an envelope that was given to the Bishop of Fatima decades earlier, who passed it to the Vatican.)

Others have pointed out that the third secret is a picture vision form of what Our Lady said in the second part of the message, including the period of peace part of the vision where souls make there way to God while Our Lady restrains the fire that will fall to engulf the world, thus giving those trying to return to God more time to do so.
Albino_Luciani said:
CONCLUSION

Pope Pius XII consecrated Russia in 1952 without the Bishops as Our Lady of the Rosary predicted at Fatima:

“THE HOLY FATHER WILL CONSECRATE RUSSIA TO ME, SHE WILL BE CONVERTED (from making war), AND A “CERTAIN” PERIOD OF PEACE WILL BE GRANTED TO THE WORLD.” There is no hundred year time limit and even if there was, we have this promise from the Holy Bible - “For the sake of the elect, the time will be shortened.” THE YEAR 2013 IS THE YEAR I WILL BE WATCHING.
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Sr. Lucia herself indicated that previous attempts at the consecration, those before the March 25, 1984 consecration, failed mainly because they were not done in union with the bishops. Sr. Lucia and the vatican have confirmed the March 25, 1984 consecration fulfilled the request.

On May 13, 2010, Pope Benedict prayed for Our Lady’s triumph of her Immaculate Heart to come before 2017, implying that that has not yet happened and is still awaited by the Church faithful.

So Fatima is not over. But I believe it will end on or before late 2017.

God bless you.
 
“The Secret wasn’t released until 2000”

You are naive if you think the Vatican has released the ENTIRE Third Secret.

You can lead a horse to water…

This is yet another Catholic Answers dead end.
 
Er…no offense, but this is my personal opinion. There’s nothing wrong drawing meaningful themes and lessons in Scripture that overlap with the approved Marian apparitions. However, none of the apparitions’ core messages are extraordinary–all of them repeat the same message God has been trying to tell mankind since Creation: everyone must draw close to God by love and faith, live an upright life according to his will, and reject evil.

IMO, the controversies over the Third Secret and the Consecration of Russia seems not only irrelevant to the main message of our lady but slipping dangerously into Harold Camping territory…
 
I have indeed noticed it. It’s the thing that sets her apart from OL of Guadalupe, OL of Lourdes, and OL of everything else. 😉
 
I feel slightly gypped. My Fatima statue has no star. She has a very long rosary instead.

She’s still awesome though. 🙂
 
Bezant said:
Er…no offense, but this is my personal opinion. There’s nothing wrong drawing meaningful themes and lessons in Scripture that overlap with the approved Marian apparitions. However, none of the apparitions’ core messages are extraordinary–all of them repeat the same message God has been trying to tell mankind since Creation: everyone must draw close to God by love and faith, live an upright life according to his will, and reject evil.

IMO, the controversies over the Third Secret and the Consecration of Russia seems not only irrelevant to the main message of our lady but slipping dangerously into Harold Camping territory…
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Actually Fatima is extraordinary. The Miracle of the Sun is the greatest theophany (manifestation of the Divine presence able to be witnessed by a group) since the descent of the Holy Spirit to the disciples at Pentecost.

Fatima underlines that we are in the short time of Satan mentioned in Revelation 20.

Fatima with its dates of the 13th , the star, and the Triumph, tie it to Esther.

Fatima’s date of May 13 is the date when Israeli leaders sent notice to their personnel to gather to announce the independence and birth of the nation of Israel on May 13, 1948, the nation born in a day. The rebirth of the nation of Israel, the rebirth of the Hebrew language, and the possession of Jerusalem by the Jews are all key markers of where we are on the eschatological timeline.

Fatima’s Miracle of the Sun served as a foreshadowing , a forewarning, of what will come upon the world (the consuming fire of Revelation 20) should it keep offending God who is already too much offended. The clock is ticking, but we await and hope and pray for the Triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary over all the evil that is surrounding and suffocating us at this time (abortion, gay marriage, forcing of religious institutions to offer insurance with contraception, sterilization, and Ru-486, persecution of pastors preaching the good news as being intolerant of gays, atheists and others, etc.)

We are rapidly advancing, stride by stride towards the conclusion of Fatima - it will be but a while longer and then all that Blessed Mary started with Fatima will end.

God bless you.
 
“Hence, I use October 13, 1917 as the date for the Fatima apparition and I think it ‘expires’ on October 13, 2017.”

The number synonymous with Fatima and the Book of Esther in “13”.

Our Queen, the Queen of Heaven, holy Mary, will act to save us next year - 2013.

Make sure you wear your Brown Scapular and say your Rosary every day.
 
beehumble said:
Actually Fatima is extraordinary.
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I said nothing of the miracle(s) being extraordinary. I said that the core message of the apparition isn’t extraordinary–it’s something that every devoted Catholic should know otherwise, with, or without, the apparition.
beehumble said:
Fatima with its dates of the 13th , the star, and the Triumph, tie it to Esther.

Fatima’s date of May 13 is the date when Israeli leaders sent notice to their personnel to gather to announce the independence and birth of the nation of Israel on May 13, 1948, the nation born in a day. The rebirth of the nation of Israel, the rebirth of the Hebrew language, and the possession of Jerusalem by the Jews are all key markers of where we are on the eschatological timeline.
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The debate over numbers and dates are, to me, largely irrelevant anyway because 1) there are many ways to interpret history, historical triumphs, and fit them to a thematic date and 2) interpretations tend to favour certain dates and events while ignoring other significant dates and events.

To begin with, Israel’s official date of independence is 14 May – a more significant date, in my view. Furthermore, considering the the efforts that culminated into the declaration of Israel before 14 May, and the efforts to maintain it afterwards, it’s quite narrow to focus only on one date. At the time of its independence Israel didn’t have possession of East Jerusalem.
 
Bezant said:
I said nothing of the miracle(s) being extraordinary. I said that the core message of the apparition isn’t extraordinary–it’s something that every devoted Catholic should know otherwise, with, or without, the apparition.

The debate over numbers and dates are, to me, largely irrelevant anyway because 1) there are many ways to interpret history, historical triumphs, and fit them to a thematic date and 2) interpretations tend to favour certain dates and events while ignoring other significant dates and events.

To begin with, Israel’s official date of independence is 14 May – a more significant date, in my view. Furthermore, considering the the efforts that culminated into the declaration of Israel before 14 May, and the efforts to maintain it afterwards, it’s quite narrow to focus only on one date. At the time of its independence Israel didn’t have possession of East Jerusalem.
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Israel’s official date of independence is Iyar 5 each year (and it floats or changes its Gregorian date each year, as do all Jewish dates), which in 1948 fell on May 14. However, May 14 is the Gregorian date. Jewish days actually begin on sunset of the previous Gregorian day, so Iyar 5 in 1948 began on sunset of May 13, 1948.

Note the note (:))at the left bottom of the calendar page saying how the days start at sunset of the previous day: timeanddate.com/calendar/?year=1948&country=34

The invitation including the date of 5/13/1948:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Invitation_to_Signing_of_Israel%27s_Declaration_of_Independence.PNG

Link to the invitation in English:
cojs.org/cojswiki/Invitation_to_the_Declaration_of_the_State,_May_13,_1948.

Link to recent and future Iyar 5 dates, and the note mentioning how they start the (Gregorian) day before actually:

when-is.com/israel-independence-day-2013.asp

I was showing how Fatima seems to reveal something about God’s plan of salvation, how it is tied to the eschatoological timeline. The rebirth of the nation of Israel is a key marker and its date matches the Fatima date (just one of many Fatima date type occurrences). So I was not interested in talking about Israel’s efforts to sustain itself, since I am lookign at the broader view of worldwide salvation with Israel’s rebirth as one marker along that timeline.

I mentioned May 13 1948 but there are many other dates associated with Fatima (see the link to the blog on the number 13 a few posts back). One other key one is May 13, 1981, when JP II was shot as foreseen in the third part of the Fatima secret.

And the message itself is extraordinary - it singled out Russia, which is rare for a public message from Heaven to single out a specific nation, and it prophesied Pius XI, World War II, and Russia spreading its errors, all of which happened. It basically laid out the future that was coming upon the world throughout the twentieth century AND provided a remedy to avoid the upcoming horrors, that if followed, would avert so much evil and death.

It also prophesied a period of ‘peace’ (reconciliation between God and man after all of the carnage) and the triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary ‘in the end’.

A lot of specific prophecies there in that one secret.

God bless you.
 
Albino_Luciani said:
“Hence, I use October 13, 1917 as the date for the Fatima apparition and I think it ‘expires’ on October 13, 2017.”

The number synonymous with Fatima and the Book of Esther in “13”.

Our Queen, the Queen of Heaven, holy Mary, will act to save us next year - 2013.

Make sure you wear your Brown Scapular and say your Rosary every day.
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Well that is possible, but if I had to speculate about a year for the triumph of Our Lady’s Immaculate Heart, I would choose 2017.

God bless you.
 
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