Everyone Please Read This

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HashemEchad said:
I’ve been doing some asking around, and it seems the JWs do this a LOT. Its likely the person who sent your mom that letter was not the same person. I’m reall,y really sorry it also happened to you and your mom. 😦

I received a phone call from not only the immediate supervisor of the woman who did this, but also from the national director of privacy for the national office of the hospice. Both profusely apologized, and they also thanked me for reporting it; they said the only way they can do anything is when families DO report it.

Anyway, the webpage with her award and profile has been taken down because she is on “administrative leave” while they wait to get the evidences I sent them, and I also reported it to the US dept of Health and Human Services (they have a special website for reporting privacy violations of peoples’ health info.)

ora pro nobis, Thanks so much (and thanks to everyone else too!)

I wanted to make a request, if anyone ever has this happen to you, PLEASE report it to the hospital/nursing home/whoever treated your loved one. Its the only way to stop it!

One way I knew for sure the JW did not get my info from the obituary, is that I put very little info in the obit that could enable anyone to contact me. Be sure never to put any detailed info in obituaries, such as home addresses of families, etc

I told my funeral director about this incident, and she told me that this is one reason why Jewish obits no longer give the home address of the family for shiva purposes (in Judaism, obituaries would usually list the home address where shiva, or the Jewish mourning period, was being observed after the burial…that way, relatives and friends could go there to console the family…since in Judaism we do not have viewings before the burial.)

She said missionaries would go through the obits and send literature to the address given for shiva visitation! So evidently its been going on for a while.
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HashemEchad, again, I am sorry for you loss.

I am relieved that the woman’s supervisors appear to be taking this seriously.

You advice regarding reporting this behavior to their superiors is good. It is not difficult to find the people, as they usually provide things like a return address and do not seem to try to hide their identity.

May God bless you and bring you His peace. May the souls of the faithful departed rest in peace.
  • rpp
 
Because many of you asked, I wanted to give you an update on this situation.

I received a phone call from the national director of the hospice corporation; he finally received the copies of everything the woman sent me.

He was prohibited due to privacy regulations from telling me whether she was fired or quit, but he did tell me, “She no longer works for our corporation”.

He said they will also be reporting this incident to the Dept. of Health and Human Services, as they are required to do by law whenever an employee violates the HIPAA regulations (this will prevent her from working in such sensitive situations in the future.)

One thing he was able to tell me: he said they are certain she did not get my personal info from anyone in the local hospice office; he said her job at the time she was let go was of monitoring their crisis center, where she had access to national records in the event of an earthquake, etc (at least that is how he explained it.)
 
HaShem,

My condolences at the loss of your Mother, Baruch dayan emet!

I’ve heard of even worse HIPAA violations by JWs. I know of a nurse who worked at a doctors office…she was also a JW. A member of another congregation that she recognized came to the doctor and looking through the woman’s records the nurse discovered that the woman had previously recieved a blood transfusion. The nurse went to the “Elders” of the congregation the patient belonged to with this information. The patient was disfellowshipped…the nurse eventually fired.

Ignore what Angelorum says…yes, as Christians we must witness the gospel, the most effective way we do this is with our lives…not our mouths. Judaism is already a response to the call of God, if you ever feel the need to HEAR the gospel let me know, otherwise, be faithful to the Commandments.
 
Yerusalyim said:
HaShem,

My condolences at the loss of your Mother, Baruch dayan emet!

I’ve heard of even worse HIPAA violations by JWs. I know of a nurse who worked at a doctors office…she was also a JW. A member of another congregation that she recognized came to the doctor and looking through the woman’s records the nurse discovered that the woman had previously recieved a blood transfusion. The nurse went to the “Elders” of the congregation the patient belonged to with this information. The patient was disfellowshipped…the nurse eventually fired.

Ignore what Angelorum says…yes, as Christians we must witness the gospel, the most effective way we do this is with our lives…not our mouths. Judaism is already a response to the call of God, if you ever feel the need to HEAR the gospel let me know, otherwise, be faithful to the Commandments.
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Thanks, Yerusalyim…that incident of the JW woman who “ratted” on another JW woman is horrible! I had no idea they did things like this, until it happened to me.

As for the gospel, trust me I’ve reached saturation point with it…if I had not reached that point before stumbling upon this forum, I sure have now.

You see, one thing many Christians fail to understand, and this perhaps applies to other non-Christians too: when you expose someone to something TOO much, they burn out and get downright sick of hearing it.

Do you remember the Vonage commercial with that annoying noise in the background? The commercial they used to put on TV every few minutes or so? Or the “Head-On” commercial that also drove people crazy? Well, for me, the Christian message has become just another Vonage commercial, or Head-On commercial…I tune it out as soon as I hear it coming, because I’ve heard it too much, and I’m sick of it, frankly.

The MORE people hear it, the LESS they actually care or will listen. Its also like parents who scream at their kids too much—eventually the kids tune out.

I tuned out from the Christian message LONG ago, because of overkill. The only religions I ever found appealing were those that do not proselytize.
 
b_justb said:
I was raised a JW. I have never heard of this type of thing while I was in. I have heard of many stories similar to yours where local JW’s would send notes to people they would get from the local newspaper obituary.
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I did it. I was a regular pioneer for 15 years and I used my Avon territory and my medical background to get names and addresses and I did exactly what was described. And I counted the time. I was told just not to get caught and that sometimes we needed to skirt the law if it interfered with God’s Will. We must obey God rather than men–Acts–it is called Theocratic Warfare. God said to preach and convert and baptize, and we were in a battle doing just that.

You did right to report the woman–I hope she loses her job!
 
Hashem, This is the first I have read about your Mother, I am sorry for all the pain that you have been through. I am glad you did what you did to right this situation. God love you!!!
 
Ravyn_Guiliani said:
I did it. I was a regular pioneer for 15 years and I used my Avon territory and my medical background to get names and addresses and I did exactly what was described. And I counted the time. I was told just not to get caught and that sometimes we needed to skirt the law if it interfered with God’s Will. We must obey God rather than men–Acts–it is called Theocratic Warfare. God said to preach and convert and baptize, and we were in a battle doing just that.

You did right to report the woman–I hope she loses her job!
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She did (see my other post).

Yours is the first I’ve heard of any JWs or former JWs admitting to having done this.

I guess its not going to be a pleasant next meeting at her local Kingdom Hall, eh? Of course, she (and they) will probably chalk it up to religious persecution. :rolleyes: But I would have reported it even if she were of my own faith (though we don’t proselytize.)

Didn’t you ever feel any guilt when you did it? Did you ever stop to think of it as a violation of trust and privacy?
 
HashemEchad said:
Didn’t you ever feel any guilt when you did it? Did you ever stop to think of it as a violation of trust and privacy?
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I was indoctrinated to believe that my neighbors’ house was on fire and I was saving their lives by dragging them out–even if it was kicking and screaming. I was doing God’s Will. Most people do not understand that to a JW all is fair in Theocratic Warfare. That is why they are so dangerous.

I did one thing that I still feel bad about–a ‘spiritually weak’ JW friend of mine was leaving her abusive husband and I was helping her pack her stuff and she had a beloved collection of gnomes. Now JWs consider anything like that to be demonized and an opening for the Devil. So I believed that her ‘weakness’ was due to being influenced by demons and I managed to make sure the gnomes got lost in the move. She later accused her husband of taking them. They were quite an expensive collection–some local artist had made them. I took them all and left them in a neighbor’s trash. I never told her and a year later my friend died. I still feel bad about it. But at the time I believed I was doing her a favor.

JWs feel that we ARE our brother’s keeper. And even if I had admitted what I had done to the elders they would have commended me for my cunningness and concern for her spiritual welfare.

(I think I will mention it next Confession…😊 )
 
HashemEchad said:
Thanks, Yerusalyim…that incident of the JW woman who “ratted” on another JW woman is horrible! I had no idea they did things like this, until it happened to me.

As for the gospel, trust me I’ve reached saturation point with it…if I had not reached that point before stumbling upon this forum, I sure have now.

You see, one thing many Christians fail to understand, and this perhaps applies to other non-Christians too: when you expose someone to something TOO much, they burn out and get downright sick of hearing it.

Do you remember the Vonage commercial with that annoying noise in the background? The commercial they used to put on TV every few minutes or so? Or the “Head-On” commercial that also drove people crazy? Well, for me, the Christian message has become just another Vonage commercial, or Head-On commercial…I tune it out as soon as I hear it coming, because I’ve heard it too much, and I’m sick of it, frankly.

The MORE people hear it, the LESS they actually care or will listen. Its also like parents who scream at their kids too much—eventually the kids tune out.

I tuned out from the Christian message LONG ago, because of overkill. The only religions I ever found appealing were those that do not proselytize.
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HaShem,

Unfortunately some see the gospel as a club with which to beat people over the head. As I stated earlier, Judaism is ALREADY a response to the call of God, so I don’t feel the need to preach at you. In fact, in my personal theology it’s important that the Jews remain faithful to the Commandments until the coming (or return) of Messiah.

As to the JW situation, MOST JWs, in my experience, are very sincere people who would horrified if they found out about this kind of conduct, but there was an article in the Watchtower not too many years back that “hinted” that it wouldn’t necessarily be a bad thing to violate confidences of this nature.
 
Ravyn_Guiliani said:
I was indoctrinated to believe that my neighbors’ house was on fire and I was saving their lives by dragging them out–even if it was kicking and screaming. I was doing God’s Will. Most people do not understand that to a JW all is fair in Theocratic Warfare. That is why they are so dangerous.

I did one thing that I still feel bad about–a ‘spiritually weak’ JW friend of mine was leaving her abusive husband and I was helping her pack her stuff and she had a beloved collection of gnomes. Now JWs consider anything like that to be demonized and an opening for the Devil. So I believed that her ‘weakness’ was due to being influenced by demons and I managed to make sure the gnomes got lost in the move. She later accused her husband of taking them. They were quite an expensive collection–some local artist had made them. I took them all and left them in a neighbor’s trash. I never told her and a year later my friend died. I still feel bad about it. But at the time I believed I was doing her a favor.

JWs feel that we ARE our brother’s keeper. And even if I had admitted what I had done to the elders they would have commended me for my cunningness and concern for her spiritual welfare.

(I think I will mention it next Confession…😊 )
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Raven, I understand how you feel about your late friend, and the gnome collection. Where she is now, I’m sure she knows and has forgiven you.
If you are Catholic now, maybe it would be a good idea to talk this over with a priest…its always hardest to forgive ourselves for things, but sometimes, talking to someone about it, esp. a religious authority, can make all the difference in the world! 🙂
 
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