EVOLUTION: A Catholic Solution?

[reggieM]

I am not at all embarrassed to declare that I am not a molecular biologist …

Very good. You’re not a molecular biologist and therefore by your own standard, you’re “not qualified to judge”. Additionally, you lack competence in this field. You’ve published no peer reviewed papers on molecular biology either. You’re not a “competent authority” and your opinions can be regarded for what they are – spoutings of an unqualified observer.

Would you like to give us some **recent **examples of “innovative scientists”

Again, we can notice the qualifer and manipulation of the point, just as you did with my statement that there are some scientists who disagree with the idea of common descent.

Here, you’ve narrowed the scope to “recent examples”.

That’s a deceptive tactic.

The point stands, there were innovative scientists who were considered “cranks and fruitcakes” before their ideas were ultimately accepted. Recent or not, that is the history of science.

But then again, if you want to argue that only “recent history” counts for anything, I think that pretty much eliminates most of the arguments you use to fuel your hatred of Catholicism (Inquisition, Pius IX’s social policies, etc).

 

[Brucegpope]

I just read Teilhard De Chardin’s book “the Jesuit and the Skull”. He was a devout Jesuit who was also an archeologist and discovered Peking Man. It was amazing how the Catholic church denied him and all but exiled him to China.
There is an overwhelming amount of empirical evidence that there is an evolutionary chain that it just can’t be called a theory any more than the “theory” that the Sun revolves around the Earth. This in no way conflicts with my Catholic Faith. God is still the immutable creator who has spoken through the prophets. Evolution vs. Creation as an argument is still in its infancy. How does an evolution argument hurt the Church (big C)? Why can’t a Catholic believe that Adam and Eve are perfect people with freewill and what we should aspire to or Eden could be a place we are going to not a place we are coming from. This does not injure the Pascal mystery that makes us Catholic. We are still one holy Catholic and apostolic church.

 

[Dchsknight]

All evolution is a lie and trap of the devil. All of it, in any form and any way. The reason is because ALL evolution in some way denies the Sovereignty of God. Denial of Adam and Eve is also really kind of dumb. People who call themselves catholic are fooling themselves when they deny God and his word. You are not Catholic, your protestant. Good luck with trying to Reconcile to God why you denied him.

 

[edwest2]

You are, of course, entitled to your opinion, but that does not change the fact that multiple lines of molecular evidence preclude the possibility that the human population has ever been as small as two individuals, and therefore, since there has never been a literal Adam and Eve, then the story of Adam and Eve while possibly containing some figurative truths, is a myth and cannot be literally true.
The proper relationship between faith and science, is that science should take precedence in matters relating to the natural processes in the universe, such as this one regarding the biological ancestry of the human race, and that religion should stay out of theoretical and factual scientific considerations. Faith gets into trouble when it attempts to meddle in scientific matters, as it lacks the tools and the competence to distinguish between fiction and reality in the natural world.

Alec
evolutionpages.com

Science gets into trouble when it attempts to meddle in religious matters, as it lacks the deposit of the faith and the God-given competence to distinguish between the knowledge that is derived from man’s limited senses and the knowledge given to man by God.

Peace,
Ed

 

[buffalo]

Very good. You’re not a molecular biologist and therefore by your own standard, you’re “not qualified to judge”. Additionally, you lack competence in this field. You’ve published no peer reviewed papers on molecular biology either. You’re not a “competent authority” and your opinions can be regarded for what they are – spoutings of an unqualified observer.

.

Uh OH! This isn’t going to go over well.

 

[wildleafblower]

I just read Teilhard De Chardin’s book “the Jesuit and the Skull”. He was a devout Jesuit who was also an archeologist and discovered Peking Man. It was amazing how the Catholic church denied him and all but exiled him to China.

His Doctorate in Sciences was in Zoology and Geology. The skull discovered was that of a female. It was not actually discovered by him though he was at the excavation site. After finding the skull he believed Adam and Eve were *homo sapiens *so he began to re-think his original thoughts which was one reason that caused him to be exiled though the reasons for the exile were a result of complex issues, eg. his health.

 

[edwest2]

You are, of course, entitled to your opinion, but that does not change the fact that multiple lines of molecular evidence preclude the possibility that the human population has ever been as small as two individuals, and therefore, since there has never been a literal Adam and Eve, then the story of Adam and Eve while possibly containing some figurative truths, is a myth and cannot be literally true.
The proper relationship between faith and science, is that science should take precedence in matters relating to the natural processes in the universe, such as this one regarding the biological ancestry of the human race, and that religion should stay out of theoretical and factual scientific considerations. Faith gets into trouble when it attempts to meddle in scientific matters, as it lacks the tools and the competence to distinguish between fiction and reality in the natural world.

Alec
evolutionpages.com

“molecular evidence” does not preclude the work of God. As the Bible tells Catholics, when the disciples told the people about Jesus, they also told them that if He did not do the things that they say He did then their faith was in vain. And the people searched the Scriptures diligently to see if what they said was true.

Peace,
Ed

 

[buffalo]

I just read Teilhard De Chardin’s book “the Jesuit and the Skull”. He was a devout Jesuit who was also an archeologist and discovered Peking Man. It was amazing how the Catholic church denied him and all but exiled him to China.
There is an overwhelming amount of empirical evidence that there is an evolutionary chain that it just can’t be called a theory any more than the “theory” that the Sun revolves around the Earth. This in no way conflicts with my Catholic Faith. God is still the immutable creator who has spoken through the prophets. Evolution vs. Creation as an argument is still in its infancy. How does an evolution argument hurt the Church (big C)? Why can’t a Catholic believe that Adam and Eve are perfect people with freewill and what we should aspire to or Eden could be a place we are going to not a place we are coming from. This does not injure the Pascal mystery that makes us Catholic. We are still one holy Catholic and apostolic church.

There is another option usually missed in this debate -

God could have specially and supernaturally created Adam and Eve and placed them in the timeline wherever He wished regardless of what may or may not have been happening in the universe at the time.

 

[edwest2]

No. Even Darwin, in his book, attributed the origin of life to God. The Catholic Church would not be open to evolution, if it were atheistic.

It doesn’t matter what Darwin thought. He is not a Church authority. And it shouldn’t matter, if evolution is a fact, what any religious leader has to say about it. Catholics are not allowed to believe in atheistic evolution, which is the variety being marketed here.

Peace,
Ed

 

[Dchsknight]

All Evolution is Atheistic…

 

[rad314]

All Evolution is Atheistic…

Apparently you define it that way. The rest of us aren’t bound by your definition.

 

[c659smith]

Apparently you define it that way. The rest of us aren’t bound by your definition.

Are you bound and a member of Christ’s Church through Sacred Scripture, Traditions, and Teachings?

 

[rad314]

Are you bound and a member of Christ’s Church through Sacred Scripture, Traditions, and Teachings?

Are you asking whether I’m a Catholic? (My profile answers that.)

If so, indeed I am! And before you tell me that ‘all evolution is atheistic’, make sure you’re familiar with the articles I’ve already cited on this topic.

 

[c659smith]

Are you asking whether I’m a Catholic? (My profile answers that.)

If so, indeed I am! And before you tell me that ‘all evolution is atheistic’, make sure you’re familiar with the articles I’ve already cited on this topic.

I asked a simple question and am asking for a simple answer before I proceed.

 

[rad314]

I asked a simple question and am asking for a simple answer before I proceed.

Is the following your ‘simple’ question?

Are you bound and a member of Christ’s Church through Sacred Scripture, Traditions, and Teachings?

If it is, I’m not clear enough about what you’re asking to give you a ‘simple’ answer.

 

[c659smith]

Is the following your ‘simple’ question?

If it is, I’m not clear enough about what you’re asking to give you a ‘simple’ answer.

Are you bound and a member of Christ’s Church through Sacred Scripture, Traditions, and Teachings?

Is the answer yes or no

 

[The_Barbarian]

All Evolution is Atheistic…

Not for a Christian. Darwin’s theory, for example isn’t. He attributed the origin of life to God.

Not for the Pope, who has said that common descent is virtually certain.

If you understand Christian faith, you will know that evolution is not incompatible with it.

 

[The_Barbarian]

(Barbarian notes that Darwin attributed the origin of life to God)

It doesn’t matter what Darwin thought. He is not a Church authority.

Nevertheless, he was right about it. God did created the first living things. Just not the way you’d like Him to do it.

And it shouldn’t matter, if evolution is a fact, what any religious leader has to say about it.

It matters to Catholics, because we need to understand that it is not incompatible with our faith.

Catholics are not allowed to believe in atheistic evolution, which is the variety being marketed here.

Hard for me to understand why you’d say that, since almost everyone here has pointed out that theistic evolution is consistent with evolutionary theory.

The Modern Synthesis (currently accepted evolutionary theory) for example, is completely consistent with Catholic doctrine. It is the version your Pope was speaking when he described the evolution of humans.

 

[Dchsknight]

Again all Evolution is atheistic and of the devil…

 

[rad314]

Are you bound and a member of Christ’s Church through Sacred Scripture, Traditions, and Teachings?

If you can’t tell me what that means, I can’t answer it. I’ve never encountered that exact question before and the wording is unclear. How about this? Are you asking whether I’m a Catholic, loyal and faithful to the Church’s teachings? If so, yes. No one should take that to mean, though, that I’m not a sinner; at least I try to recognize it when I fall short.

I can be a little more helpful than merely repeating myself. Have you read Pius XII’s encyclical Humani Generis and the articles available here on catholic.com that I referred to in earlier posts?