Evolution and the Bible?

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I don’t think so. I think it just reiterates that God made things inherently good and that it was man who brought evil and death into the world.
 
Wisdom
{1:12} Seek not death in the error of your life, neither procure ye destruction by the works of your hands.
{1:13} For God made not death, neither hath he pleasure in the destruction of the living.
{1:14} For he created all things that they might be: and he made the nations of the earth for health: and there is no poison of destruction in them, nor kingdom of hell upon the earth.

I dunno, probably
 
The Bible isn’t a biology textbook, and we don’t need to treat it as such. The Bible is there to answer theological and religious questions, not scientific ones.
 
De_Maria said:
What, in that verse, do you see as contradicting evolution?
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Usually, the argument goes something like this:
  • God didn’t make death and doesn’t take pleasure in destruction
  • evolution requires generations worth of change to reach a potential speciated result (for instance, humans)
  • therefore, there had to be millennia of “death and destruction” in order to reach any potential form
  • since God doesn’t create death and destruction, therefore evolution must be false, because He wouldn’t have created scores of intermediate forms (whose ‘purpose’ was merely to die or be destroyed) in order that Homo sapiens would result
:roll_eyes:

As arguments go, it’s not particularly persuasive.
 
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I don’t think it does. But that doesn’t mean Darwinian evolution cannot be challenged. For example, why would Darwinian evolution would result in such a complex adaptation as use and storage of electricity by some animal species but none developed something utterly simple like the wheel?
 
Gorgias said:
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De_Maria:
What, in that verse, do you see as contradicting evolution?
Click to expand...
Usually, the argument goes something like this:
  • God didn’t make death and doesn’t take pleasure in destruction
  • evolution requires generations worth of change to reach a potential speciated result (for instance, humans)
  • therefore, there had to be millennia of “death and destruction” in order to reach any potential form
  • since God doesn’t create death and destruction, therefore evolution must be false, because He wouldn’t have created scores of intermediate forms (whose ‘purpose’ was merely to die or be destroyed) in order that Homo sapiens would result
:roll_eyes:

As arguments go, it’s not particularly persuasive.
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The argument is actually a lot less than “not particularly persuasive”.
It ignores that fact that changes happen through living organisms transmitting living material.
 
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goout said:
It ignores that fact that changes happen through living organisms transmitting living material.
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You added this assertion after I’d already responded to your post, so please let me respond to this comment…

I don’t think that the “living organisms / living material” dimension touches upon the (admittedly weak) argument being made. The issue isn’t that there are lots of dead organisms; it’s that they appear to have lived solely for the purpose of being evolutionary fodder for subsequent species. So, the fact that the dinosaurs died? Not part of the (presumed) argument. That argument would be “if evolution is true, then many intermediate species would have been created not for their own sake but solely so that they would contribute material – a gene here and a chromosome there – to the eventual successor species. That would mean that God had created merely for destruction, which is against Scripture.”

See how that’s different than the “well, things die” response? Their argument is that “creation for the sole purpose of death, rather than their own lives” is what is messed up with evolution.
 
FrancisFan43 said:
(Wisdom) 1:13 For God made not death…
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Theologically interesting. Death exists. God did not make death. Therefore there is a second creator somewhere…

Or is death eternal, like God?

One for the theologians I think.
 
I have a theory of my own, I think when God finally reveals the answersto us one day, it{s probably not going tto be any of these options, maybe somewhere in the middle.

the bible is not a scientific text that needs to be taken literally, nor is the theory of evolution absolute gospel truth either
 
rossum said:
Therefore there is a second creator somewhere…
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Umm…no.
There is only one creator. Death is just the absence of life. Something God never wanted in the world, but unfortunately came about when Adam and Eve rebelled and introduced orginal sin in the world. Cut off from God’s eternal life, there can be death.

Tbh, upon looking back at the verses that OP wanted us all to look at, it doesn’t really say evolution doesn’t exist. The key verse being
{1:14} For he created all things that they might be
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OP most likely thinks this is the key to it all. That God made the animals just the way they are and ergo they cannot change over time depending on environmental circumstances. Which isn’t right. Look at our history with our canine friends. Due to selective breeding we were able to change this:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

A fierce and slim hunter into this:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

And small puggy boi. It wouldn’t be that much of a stretch to say that nature taking it’s course and having animals adapt to their environment based on selective breeding.
 
goout said:
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De_Maria:
What, in that verse, do you see as contradicting evolution?
Click to expand...
It ignores that fact that changes happen through living organisms transmitting living material.
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Why should it include this “fact”? Is the verse concerned with changes that happen through living organisms transmitting living material?
 
Just like how dark is the absence of light. In the Garden, Adam and Eve willfully cut themselves off from the eternal life of God. Thus they introduced death in the world from that act.
 
FrancisFan43 said:
Just like how dark is the absence of light. In the Garden, Adam and Eve willfully cut themselves off from the eternal life of God. Thus they introduced death in the world from that act.
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If God made the world, then the evidence of the world is as reliable as the Bible. More so perhaps, since we still have the original copy of the world to examine while we do not have the original autographs of the Bible to look at.

The world tells us that death existed long before the first humans, millions of years before.

I suggest you find a better Bible interpretation, one which reconciles God’s word with God’s work. The two must agree.
 
The world also tells us that it is okay to murder your children, doesn’t mean the world is right. Nor does it mean we have to change scripture to conform to the world and what the world wants or thinks whats best. We aren’t protestants, we are christians. We just can’t change scripture willy nilly to conform to the world.
 
FrancisFan43 said:
The world also tells us that it is okay to murder your children, doesn’t mean the world is right.
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The world is right when it tells us that it is billions of years old and that death was present before man. If your interpretation of the Bible disagrees than find a better interpretation. There are plenty to choose from both inside and outside the Catholic church.
 
rossum said:
Then how come death exists? If it exists then the one single creator must have created it.
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I disagree. It may have proceeded from something that the Creator created, but since He created humans with agency, then death could logically proceed from creature rather than from creator…
 
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