Evolution of Man CONTRADICTS the Church

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How can so many people, even on this forum, give in to Satan in such a way as to rob the human body of its dignity.
I don’t buy into evolution for a second… Darwinists will do anything to make evelution seem like fact when there is hardly any true evidence for it at all… why The New York Times once published an article on their front page claiming that evolution was proven to be a fact when the “proof” was later found to be a fraud.

But, just thinking of what people might say to this…
  1. what if Adam evolved from primates and when he was born, God breathed a soul into him (not a soul that would die with the body)… meaning that he would have been convieved not with a soul, but was given a soul… i don’t even know if that would be possible… but just wondering if you knew a good response to that… I would love to share your point with some family and friends.
 
And what if anything did all of that have to do with MY post?? :confused:
When Kamalayka posted:
“How can so many people, even on this forum, give in to Satan in such a way as to rob the human body of its dignity.”
Why did you answer as you did?

If your reply wasn’t implying that the other posters who disagreed with the OP were not in league with Satan and the anti-Christ, what on earth were you saying? What did your post have to do with this discussion on this thread…I mean, what does a willingness to consider evolution as a possible method of God’s creativity have to do with that?

Those who concede evolution as a possibility are not in league with the devil. They may well be in keeping with the orthodox teaching of the Catholic Church, assuming that they do not, as the Pope warns, fail to lose sight of the indisputable points outlined by Pius XII in Humani Generis. To imply otherwise is to be complicit with confusion, too.

There are a lot of Traditional Catholics who are picking up ideas from Protestants, too, only it is the fundamentalist Protestants they’re listening to, instead of the liberal Protestants that the liberal Catholics listen to. There is plenty of room for orthodox thought that has both liberal and traditional elements to it…as long as orthodoxy is adhered to. Follow the Church first, then traditional and liberal can concievably be complimentary charisms that are not that far apart in actual fact, but rather different aspects of the same faith. Granted, “liberal” won’t go nearly so far to into left field as some do, but there is room for some differences of opinion within orthodoxy, and there is error to be found by going too far to the right, too (whatever those directions even mean any more…I just mean that the narrow way is not found by throwing the steering wheel as far to the right or to the left as the wheel can possibly be thrown.)

Satan finds whichever error we are the most blind to, or most attracted to, and pushes us that way. If we are so terrified of the left ditch that he can get us to drive willingly into the right ditch, that is no problem for Old Scratch. As long as we’re off the road, he doesn’t care which direction we go. In the ditch is in the ditch, and therefore onto his dinner plate, as far as he’s concerned.
 
When Kamalayka posted:
“How can so many people, even on this forum, give in to Satan in such a way as to rob the human body of its dignity.”
Why did you answer as you did?

If your reply wasn’t implying that the other posters who disagreed with the OP were not in league with Satan and the anti-Christ, what on earth were you saying? What did your post have to do with this discussion on this thread…I mean, what does a willingness to consider evolution as a possible method of God’s creativity have to do with that?

Those who concede evolution as a possibility are not in league with the devil. They may well be in keeping with the orthodox teaching of the Catholic Church, assuming that they do not, as the Pope warns, fail to lose sight of the indisputable points outlined by Pius XII in Humani Generis. To imply otherwise is to be complicit with confusion, too.

There are a lot of Traditional Catholics who are picking up ideas from Protestants, too, only it is the fundamentalist Protestants they’re listening to, instead of the liberal Protestants that the liberal Catholics listen to. There is plenty of room for orthodox thought that has both liberal and traditional elements to it…as long as orthodoxy is adhered to. Follow the Church first, then traditional and liberal can concievably be complimentary charisms that are not that far apart in actual fact, but rather different aspects of the same faith. Granted, “liberal” won’t go nearly so far to into left field as some do, but there is room for some differences of opinion within orthodoxy, and there is error to be found by going too far to the right, too (whatever those directions even mean any more…I just mean that the narrow way is not found by throwing the steering wheel as far to the right or to the left as the wheel can possibly be thrown.)

Satan finds whichever error we are the most blind to, or most attracted to, and pushes us that way. If we are so terrified of the left ditch that he can get us to drive willingly into the right ditch, that is no problem for Old Scratch. As long as we’re off the road, he doesn’t care which direction we go. In the ditch is in the ditch, and therefore onto his dinner plate, as far as he’s concerned.
Excellent summation! :clapping:
 
The Church teaches that while evolution may not turn out to be the best scientific encapsulation of how God created humans, it would not be a violation of the the Church’s understanding of Scriptures if evolution turned out to be the method by which God chose to make humans.

Read Genesis. In Chapter 1, people are created, not man and then woman, but together, after the creation of the animals. In Chapter 2, man is made before the animals, which he names, and then the woman is made. It makes sense to conclude that these accounts may not be meant as a literal chronology of creation. It would be in keeping with the oral traditions from which these Holy Scriptures came if the accounts were poetic expressions of the truth that God is the ultimate creator of all, that all of creation is good, and that man is not simply one among the animals, but that humans, uniquely among all creatures, bear the likeness of God, and so on.

It is important that we realize our relationship to our Creator and the rest of his creatures and that we live that realization. Finding that God chose to effect our creation in one manner rather than another is relatively unimportant. It was fairly recently that anyone would think it was.

We must realize that the Scriptural accounts of our creation were written before the concept of sterile and strictly literal scientific descriptions artificially divorced from poetry and theology were ever thought of. We are so used to our literal rational way of looking at the world, we often forget how narrow and limited it is. It suits the enterprise of science to be so limited, but that is a poor mindset to have take over one’s whole worldview. It is not the job of Scripture to bend to suit our current way of understanding the truth. Instead, it is our job to bend our Western brains and our narrow modern idea of what a fact is to the Scriptural way of expressing truth.

If you ask why God wouldn’t give us a strictly literal description of creation, one that takes no poetic license with the “facts”, consider that most people didn’t talk or even think that way until relatively recently. We don’t even talk or think that way all of the time. It would be like asking why John referred to Jesus as the Lamb of God, when Jesus was not in fact a sheep and never was. Isn’t Scripture true, after all? It was because it would not dawn on anyone in earshot to dream that John meant that! I mean truly: do we ever use the Scriptural truth that God breathed life into man as evidence that God must literally have physical lungs? I would think not.

Contrast this with Jesus talking about Himself in the Eucharist in John 6. People got mad when they heard him talking that way. Former disciples quit following him. He obviously was being literal, he was being taken that way, and he did not correct his meaning when he found he was being taken that way. The hard meaning was the one he meant. If Jesus’ miracles, for example, all had a natural explanation, had you but been there, then why would Herod have hoped to see Jesus work some miracle? He wouldn’t. Likewise, the story of “doubting Thomas.” When Scripture is saying something that could literally strain credulity, Scripture says so, and reiterates that the difficult meaning is indeed the one that is meant.

It is not a good idea to try to teach the Church how to interpret Holy Scriptures. The Scriptures are from the Church, and God elected to use the Magesterium to guide us through the Scriptures and their meaning. It is the office of the Magesterium to teach us what the Scriptures say, not our job to teach the Magesterium what they say. Using Scriptures to teach our teachers is the road that lead to the thousands of Protestant sects in this country alone. We ought not go there.
I am 60 years old and converted from non-denominational Christian to catholic faith 3 years ago. I was having a real problem with this issue because I tend to take scripture literally.
I have been sincerely seeking an answer.Your explanation has truly set me free from this issue.
Thank You and GOD bless you,
Steve
 
I am 60 years old and converted from non-denominational Christian to catholic faith 3 years ago. I was having a real problem with this issue because I tend to take scripture literally.
I have been sincerely seeking an answer.Your explanation has truly set me free from this issue.
Thank You and GOD bless you,
Steve
Catholics do take scripture literally, though not literalist. Catholics read scripture as what the author was intending to convey.
 
Catholics do take scripture literally, though not literalist. Catholics read scripture as what the author was intending to convey.
Point well taken. The intended method of interpretation ( literally word for word or metaphorically ) for some scriptures is not so clear.Thank GOD we have the Magesterium to guide us.
GOD bless and thanks,
Steve
 
When Kamalayka posted:
“How can so many people, even on this forum, give in to Satan in such a way as to rob the human body of its dignity.”
Why did you answer as you did?

If your reply wasn’t implying that the other posters who disagreed with the OP were not in league with Satan and the anti-Christ, what on earth were you saying? What did your post have to do with this discussion on this thread…
So you believe that the posters here run the world and are responsible for all of the confusion that becomes a part of what is posted here???

That seems like a rather narrow view of the world. To think that these posters are purely isolated from the world they live in seems a bit emm… well, insane frankly.
Satan finds whichever error we are the most blind to, or most attracted to, and pushes us that way. If we are so terrified of the left ditch that he can get us to drive willingly into the right ditch, that is no problem for Old Scratch. As long as we’re off the road, he doesn’t care which direction we go. In the ditch is in the ditch, and therefore onto his dinner plate, as far as he’s concerned.
You wrote this, but did you think it doesn’t apply to you and what you presume??

Presumption IS the seed of ALL sin.
 
I am 60 years old and converted from non-denominational Christian to catholic faith 3 years ago. I was having a real problem with this issue because I tend to take scripture literally.
I have been sincerely seeking an answer.Your explanation has truly set me free from this issue.
Thank You and GOD bless you,
Steve
Welcome to the one, holy, catholic and apostolic Church!

It would do well to understand that the Catholic Church is not literalist in its reading of Scripture, but rather contextualist. That does not mean that we do not read some things literally, but rather that if we do, it is because the context of the Scripture indicates that (as well as Tradition).

That can send people into a bit of a tizzy; but it is part of why we have a Magisterium - a constant teaching authority which guides us.
Being a contextualist does not mean that we do not accept, for example, the two creation stories in Genesis as true; it means that we accept them for what they were written for; to provide us with God’s self-revelation to us. It does not mean that one cannot accept that the world was created in seven days; but it means that one is not required to accept that literally, but rather that it teaches us that God is the source of all creation. Another way of saying it is that the Bible was not given to us to teach archeology, or astronomy, or geology, or biology. It is there to instruct us in our faith. Attempting to force those issues out of the Bible is to misuse the Bible. A poor analogy would be to read a fair tale, and start on a search for the parents of the individuals in the tale, or the location of the stream, sya, or the castle mentioned in it. One would have entirely missed the point.
 
Catholics do take scripture literally, though not literalist. Catholics read scripture as what the author was intending to convey.
Can I ask briefly for the distinction between “literally” and “literalist”? :confused:
 
So you believe that the posters here run the world and are responsible for all of the confusion that becomes a part of what is posted here???

That seems like a rather narrow view of the world. To think that these posters are purely isolated from the world they live in seems a bit emm… well, insane frankly.].
I’m sorry. In this case, I guess took what was essentially a non-sequitor (because it has nothing to do with how the topic was being treated by any of the previous posts or posters) as being aimed at the posters in this thread, instead of to people who weren’t involved in the conversation at all. I guess should have asked more politely for clarification, instead of assuming that could not have been meant, particularly when you objected.

My apologies for jumping to uncharitable conclusions, then…twice.

Speaking of non-sequitors, I also have this very bad habit of switching from references to one poster and over to references to some other poster or posters without making the jump in reference clear. In other words, I might write one sentence that refers to what you said and then jump into two paragraphs voicing some opinion I have that refers to what someone else said, which I think is related because I think it is common ground for you and me…and I assume you will know that I know that you agree. I talk like that, too, but the error is corrected more quickly in real time. Sorry about that, too. I’m trying to work on that.
You wrote this, but did you think it doesn’t apply to you and what you presume??

Presumption IS the seed of ALL sin.
When I start adding or subtracting things from what the Church teaches, yet do not identify what is only my opinion, then of course it applies to me. If my opinions stray from what the Church teaches, I’m in the ditch. Do I ever go there? Alas, I do. It is a good reason to put my opinion out in a place like this. I have gotten whacked on the knuckles for that, and I deserved it. And yes, sometimes it takes awhile for me to come to realize that I am the one in error…which is presumptuous, yes.

Still: “Let the just man strike me; that is kindness; let him reprove me; it is oil for the head, which my head shall not refuse, but I will still pray under these afflictions.” Ps. 141:5

In this case, though, to the best of my knowledge I have only reported what the Holy Fathers have taught on the subject. I believe what they say is true, and that we can put our confidence in it. If I am in error, and report what they say incompletely or interpret it wrongly, then point out where I am wrong. That is a kindness.

Unfortunately, I may not be back to read it for awhile. If I don’t reply, don’t take the silence as either disagreement or agreement.
 
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