Evolution or Creationism

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I have a fairly simple question. What is the Church’s teaching on the origin of man. Do they condone evolution or creationism?

Appreciate your help.

Respectfully,
Mark
 
The Baltimore Catechism says:
Q. 206. What is the difference between making and creating?
A. “Making” means bringing forth or forming out of some material already existing, as workmen do. “Creating” means bringing forth out of nothing, as God alone can do.
Q. 207. Has everything that exists been created?
A. Everything that exists except God Himself has been created.
Q. 208. Who created heaven and earth, and all things?
A. God created heaven and earth, and all things.
Therefore the earth and all creation was created not made.
 
Theistic evolution is creationism. What’s so hard about that concept?
 
My neighbors across the street who are non-denominational fundamentalists would tell you that the world was created in six days and that God rested on the seventh.

As an anthropologist and a believer in theistic evolution, I see the hand of God in operation throughout Creation and I don’t believe that the world was created just before the nightfall preceding October 23, 2004 BC. But as hard as I have tried to explain to them that God first created light and therefore there could not have been nighfall…
 
I read a book a while back by Pope Benedict XVI that was very good. It’s called “In The Beginning”. I think he does a good job of addressing why the Creation account was written in the first place. To combat the pagan religions of the time. Most of those religions worshiped the sun, the moon, and the stars. The Creation account was written to show that those things were not gods but were created by God.
 
My neighbors across the street who are non-denominational fundamentalists would tell you that the world was created in six days and that God rested on the seventh.

As an anthropologist and a believer in theistic evolution, I see the hand of God in operation throughout Creation and I don’t believe that the world was created just before the nightfall preceding October 23, 2004 BC. But as hard as I have tried to explain to them that God first created light and therefore there could not have been nighfall…
So if you refuse to believe what Genesis says literally about God and creation, how do you figuritively explain God and the resurrection story in the NT?
 
Why do so many people view Genesis as an either/or proposition?

Why can’t some of it be figurative but other parts of it be literally and factually true?

I believe in theistic evolution and also a literal Adam and Eve.

And if Jesus can be substantially present underneth the accidents of bread and wine–why could not the Garden of Eden be substantially underneath the accidents of present day Iraq?

And if Eden is on a different time scale than the rest of the Earth then Both the time scale of the Genesis account and the timescale for the age of the Earth of roughly 4.5 billion years by scientists could both be true!

And both time scales would come into sync at about the time of Abraham.

The Flood and Noah would not have to be just a few hundred years before Abraham because the time scale from Adam to Noah to Abraham would not be literally in sync with what we view as years.

Look–I believe all the people in Genesis from Adam to Abraham were real historical factual literally true individuals.

I don’t know exactly when they lived on Earth because I was not there and I wasn’t there during all their lifetimes to be able to vouch for their exact points in history.

Some would say–why would God create that way? Maybe so people would believe what they do not see–the same as when they receive Christ in the Eucharist–and also so that people wouldn’t abandon the mind that God gave them that is also able of discerning the wonderfulness of God being able to Theistically create and achieve all His purposes!

The resurrection is absolute fact at an absolute verifiable point in history. If that isn’t true then the whole Christian faith isn’t true.

So bottom line–don’t be afraid to believe things you do not see–and also don’t be afraid to believe what your mind and eyes do see.

It’s not a question of Evolution or Creationism–both are true!
 
Why do so many people view Genesis as an either/or proposition?

Why can’t some of it be figurative but other parts of it be literally and factually true?

I believe in theistic evolution and also a literal Adam and Eve.

It’s not a question of Evolution or Creationism–both are true!
Paul referred to Adam and Eve as real people. Jesus, who is God believed in Adam and Eve and the creation event in Genesis. He talked about the creation, not the point of millions of years later of brutal dying and killing and evolving. See Matthew 19:4.

Look at the geneology of Jesus in Luke 3:38.

So you are telling me that before Adam, his ancestors were evolving apes that had to kill, kill and kill some more, you know survival of the fittest?

How did after all those millions of years, at the same time, male and female evolved perfectly from a long line of ape-inoid critters?

How does the eye evolve?

What about the brain?

How does thesistic evoltution explain this?
 
Theistic evolution is creationism. What’s so hard about that concept?
So after thousands upon thousands of years evolving, survival of the fittest, and dying, there is finally Adam. So now in the timeline of man, there is Adam, able to speak and communicate and walk upright. What happens now, well as Paul said in Romans 5:12- Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned—"
 
So you are telling me that before Adam, his ancestors were evolving apes that had to kill, kill and kill some more, you know survival of the fittest?
I hesitate to get into this, but (and with all due respect) do you understand the Theory of Evolution? The pre-human ancestors did not have to “kill, kill, and kill some more”, that is most definitally not what ‘survival of the fittest’ means. It simply means that those creatures who have the best body type for living in that area are more able to escape predators, or maybe they’re resistant to diseases, and thus they survive to breed and pass on their genes (and thus their body types) to the next generation, who also pass on those genes, etc. etc. etc. until the entire species is that way.

For example, say there is a herd of horses, two third are normal, one third had a big bump on the back that holds an organ that produces a certain chemical that is resistant to a certain disease. The disease hits the herd, and only those with the bump on their back survive because only they can resist the illness. So with the others dead, that last third reproduce and pass on the genes that produce the bump on the back and eventually all the horses in that area will have that bump.

It’s simple logic, and there’s no reason that God couldn’t be behind it, guiding it to produce what creations He desired.
 
I also see no problem with the hybrid approach. One can believe that God created the world through an evolutionary process.
 
So you are telling me that before Adam, his ancestors were evolving apes that had to kill, kill and kill some more, you know survival of the fittest?
Probably not. It is more likely that those who survived were the ones able to scramble to the nearest tree and climb it quickest when a hungry pride of lions appeared. Things like disease resistance would also have been important.
How did after all those millions of years, at the same time, male and female evolved perfectly from a long line of ape-inoid critters?
All mammals have “male and female evolved perfectly”, why should Homo sapiens be any different? Reptiles, birds, fish, many non-vertebrates and some plants have male and female. The two sexes go back a long long time before humans. If you are going to talk about evolution then you will make fewer mistakes if you learn some biology first.
How does the eye evolve?
You may have heard of a chap called Charles Darwin, who wrote a book called “On the Origin of Species”. Try reading Chapter Six, in particular the subsection “Organs of extreme perfection”.

If you do not understand evolution, and have not read even the basic texts of evolution, then you are in the position of someone who says “I know that the Bible is wrong, so I have never read it”.
What about the brain?
What about it? We have exactly the same parts in our brain as the other apes. Our brain overall is larger in proportion to our body and the relative porportions of the different parts are slightly different, but there are no major differences in the biology of our brains and the brains of the other apes.

rossum
 
I have a fairly simple question. What is the Church’s teaching on the origin of man. Do they condone evolution or creationism?

Appreciate your help.

Respectfully,
Mark
And now back to what the OP actually asked…
The Church teaches that we are free to have a number of various opinions on creation as the Bible isn’t a scientific journal and before Adam there were NO people on earth to have witnessed any part of creation to that point. The basics of what we HAVE to believe are that God is the creator of everything, that Adam and Eve were actual people and our actual first parents, that they did disobey God committing the first/original sin, that God creates a unique individual soul for every human…might be a few others but this is the jist.
As for the method of creation God chose to use, we are pretty much free to have our opinion. He very well could have used some parts of evolution in the creation process. He could have created everything in 6 days approximately 6-10 thousand years ago. He could have had man’s body evolve and then created and installed Adam and Eve’s souls to begin the actual human race. He could have used any number of variations in the creation process. What the writer of Genesis was getting across to us was that God is the author of life and creator of everything.

Go to the Catechism for numerous paragraphs dealing with creation:
scborromeo.org/ccc/index/c.htm
 
And now back to what the OP actually asked…
The Church teaches that we are free to have a number of various opinions on creation as the Bible isn’t a scientific journal and before Adam there were NO people on earth to have witnessed any part of creation to that point. The basics of what we HAVE to believe are that God is the creator of everything, that Adam and Eve were actual people and our actual first parents, that they did disobey God committing the first/original sin, that God creates a unique individual soul for every human…might be a few others but this is the jist.
As for the method of creation God chose to use, we are pretty much free to have our opinion. He very well could have used some parts of evolution in the creation process. He could have created everything in 6 days approximately 6-10 thousand years ago. He could have had man’s body evolve and then created and installed Adam and Eve’s souls to begin the actual human race. He could have used any number of variations in the creation process. What the writer of Genesis was getting across to us was that God is the author of life and creator of everything.

Go to the Catechism for numerous paragraphs dealing with creation:
scborromeo.org/ccc/index/c.htm
Well said!
 
I think the thing to remember here is that there are lots of diffrent types of books in the Bible. History, Law, Poetry, Letters etc. They are NOT all history books, and quite frankly do not claim to be. Pope John Paul II said in “The Theology of the Body” that Genesis has mythical elements. This does NOT mean that Genesis is untrue, rather that it is an account that expresses a spiritual reality. Catholics believe that the Bible IS in-errant (without error), but our interpretation of the bible is not without error. That is why we submit interpretations to the Magesterium who guide us.

Here are some things we MUST believe as Catholics.
  1. The creation of all things out of nothing by God at the beginning of time (including the creation of time).
  2. The special creation of man.
  3. The creation of woman from man.
  4. All of humanity is descended from an original pair of human beings - i.e. Adam and Eve.
  5. Adam and Eve were created in an original state of holiness, justice, and immortality.
  6. A divine command was laid upon man to prove his obedience to God [do not eat from the tree…]
  7. The transgression of that Divine Command at the instigation of Satan.
  8. The loss of the state of holiness, justice, and immortality of our 1st parents [because of their disobedience, Adam and Eve were kicked out of Paradise].
  9. The promise of a future Redeemer, a Savior [Genesis 3:15, the protoevangelium, the first “good news”].
Reference: Denzinger: #2123
:twocents: Could an ape evolve into a created human being with a soul?
 
Could an ape evolve into a created human being with a soul?
No biologist would ever claim so. Souls do not fossilise and souls cannot be found in our DNA so there is no evidence of the evolution of a soul. A better question might be: “Could an ape evolve into a physical form into which God would wish to place a created soul?”

rossum
 
Another question might be could a completely new species be born of an old one due to spontaneous mutation?

that way you could have evolution and also have Adam and Eve as a new species as parents of us all.

they would be our sole parents because what became before was not our species.

Could God choose to gvie them souls?

Absolutely.
 
Personally I think both Evolution and Creationism are highly flawed philosophies/theories. **Both **have so many holes that you could argue 'til you’re blue in the face and still not get anywhere. :rolleyes:
 
That is why a wise peson will not argue to death over theories.

A wise person will ask what the Catholic Church teaches that must be believed and hold to that.

Beyond that a person has the freedom to believe what they think to be right where the church is silent.

It’s OK to try to persuade people of your own view–just always remember that it is your own view and as such is very low on the totem pole when it comes to the priority that it should have as we exercise stewardship over a very precious gift that God has given us–the gift of time!
 
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