EWTN on now, Pope Benedict XVI Mass with delegation from the Ecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople

[trophybearer]

“Although all heretics wish to be styled Catholic, yet if any one ask where is the Catholic place of worship none of them would venture to point out his own conventicle.” - St. Augustine.



(not saying you’re a heretic)

If a stranger were to ask me where the genuinely catholic place of worship was I most certainly would point out to them the Orthodox Church. If I thought they were asking where the nearest Roman Catholic Church was I could also direct them to such a place. I believe that quote to have lost all meaning in a modern context. If a stranger were to ask you where is the Orthodox place of worship I imagine you would not point out your own Church unless you were looking to make a point as I admittedly was in replying to this post. We both consider our own Churches to be catholic and orthodox in the true sense of those words, but out of politeness either of us would probably know which Church such a person was looking for.

 

[Hesychios]

… I would not attend an Orthodox Church because they do no want me to do so. …

All are welcome *and encouraged *to attend.

 

[WetCatechumen]

If a stranger were to ask me where the genuinely catholic place of worship was I most certainly would point out to them the Orthodox Church. If I thought they were asking where the nearest Roman Catholic Church was I could also direct them to such a place. I believe that quote to have lost all meaning in a modern context. If a stranger were to ask you where is the Orthodox place of worship I imagine you would not point out your own Church unless you were looking to make a point as I admittedly was in replying to this post. We both consider our own Churches to be catholic and orthodox in the true sense of those words, but out of politeness either of us would probably know which Church such a person was looking for.

That’s the whole point. Even though you claim that you are Catholic and we are not, you still call us Catholic, even if only out of politeness and for simplicity.

 

[josephdaniel29]

That’s the whole point. Even though you claim that you are Catholic and we are not, you still call us Catholic, even if only out of politeness and for simplicity.

Would you prefer we stop being polite then?

 

[captainmike]

“Although all heretics wish to be styled Catholic, yet if any one ask where is the Catholic place of worship none of them would venture to point out his own conventicle.” - St. Augustine.



(not saying you’re a heretic)

wow, that’s a great quote. have to use that one with one of my anglican friends.

 

[captainmike]

Just for clarity of the Orthodox position, as far as we are concerned, the Orthodox Church is the Catholic church

if you really believe that, then why not call yourselves the catholic church?

 

[5Loaves]

if you really believe that, then why not call yourselves the catholic church?

The Orthodox Church, also officially called the Orthodox Catholic Church and commonly referred to as the Eastern Orthodox Church…

I would hope that we could move on. The Orthodox on here are simply stating basic facts about Orthodoxy. The presence of his Eminence Gennadios at the Papal Mass yesterday was a reflection of the ongoing efforts between Rome and Constantinople to find their common ground on this so important Feast day of Sts. Peter and Paul.

Let us praise Peter and Paul, the two great stars of the Church.
They shine brighter than the sun in the sky of faith.
Let the nations follow the rays of their preaching,
and be led from ignorance to the knowledge of God!

 

[josephdaniel29]

if you really believe that, then why not call yourselves the catholic church?

So since you don’t use the term “orthodox” in your name is that a formal admission that the Roman Catholic Church has heterodox beliefs?

 

[trophybearer]

if you really believe that, then why not call yourselves the catholic church?

When Pope St. Leo III had the creed without the filioque inscribed on silver tablets and placed at the tomb of Sts. Peter and Paul it was inscribed with these words: "“HAEC LEO POSUI AMORE ET CAUTELA ORTHODOXAE FIDEI” (I, Leo, placed these here out of love and guardianship of the Orthodox faith). Pope St. Leo III dindn’t say the Catholic faith? Not even the orthodox Catholic faith? By your logic he then must have been refering to us and not you.

 

[josephdaniel29]

When Pope St. Leo III had the creed without the filioque inscribed on silver tablets and placed at the tomb of Sts. Peter and Paul it was inscribed with these words: "“HAEC LEO POSUI AMORE ET CAUTELA ORTHODOXAE FIDEI” (I, Leo, placed these here out of love and guardianship of the Orthodox faith). Pope St. Leo III dindn’t say the Catholic faith? Not even the orthodox Catholic faith? By your logic he then must have been refering to us and not you.

Well he was Orthodox after all.

 

[josie_L]

When Pope St. Leo III had the creed without the filioque inscribed on silver tablets and placed at the tomb of Sts. Peter and Paul it was inscribed with these words: "“HAEC LEO POSUI AMORE ET CAUTELA ORTHODOXAE FIDEI” (I, Leo, placed these here out of love and guardianship of the Orthodox faith). Pope St. Leo III dindn’t say the Catholic faith? Not even the orthodox Catholic faith? By your logic he then must have been refering to us and not you.

9th Century
West: Pope St. Leo III of Rome (6/12)

58.Eastern Orthodox apologists make much of the fact that Pope St. Leo III opposed the edition of Filioque to the Niceno-Constantinopolitan Creed of 381 and had it engraved in its original form in Greek and Latin on two silver shields in front of St. Peter’s/,{1} but that is where the usefulness of their polemical weapon ceases. St. Leo III told Bl. Charlemagne (1/28) that he agreed with the doctrine of Filioque.{2} **But Pope St. Leo III–who omitted Filioque from the Creed for the sake of Church unity{3} and was aware of the sensitivity of the Greeks about their Creed{4} and the nuances of ἐκπορευόμενον vs. προείναι{5}–openly confessed, in letter to all the Eastern Churches, his belief in “the Holy Spirit, proceeding equally from the Father and from the Son, consubstantial, coeternal with the Father and the Son. The Father, complete God in Himself, the Son, complete God begotten of the Father, the Holy Spirit, complete God proceeding from the Father and the Son…” **{6} This manifestly concerns the hypostatic procession of the Holy Spirit.

{6} Swete, H. B. On the History of the Doctrine of the Procession of the Holy Spirit from the Apostolic Age to the Death of Charlemagne. Cambridge and London, 1876. p. 230. The Latin reads, “Spiritum Sanctum a Patre et a Filio aequaliter procedentem, consubstantialem, coaeternum Patri et Filio. Pater plenus Deus in se, Filius plenus Deus a Patre genitus, Spiritus Sanctus plenus Deus a Patre et Filio procedens.”

catholicpatristics.blogspot.c…/filioque.html

Just making sure you know he wasn’t referring to “orthodox” with a big “O”.

 

[Ahimsa]

9th Century
West: Pope St. Leo III of Rome (6/12)

In other words, Pope Leo III was being polite.

 

[5Loaves]

**Mantiya **

Mantiya: sleeveless cape that fastens at the neck and the feet, worn by the bishop when he formally enters the church before Divine Liturgy.
orthodoxwiki.org/Vestments

It’s part of the “choir dress” equivalent for the Eastern Bishops, both EO and Byzantine.

Two of the Holy Icons for the Hierarchical Liturgy at Ft. Ross were St. Innocent of Alaska, who had traveled to Ft. Ross, and St. John Maximovitch, whose feast day is July 2. In their icons the mantiya with those characteristic stripes was very clearly present.

In the Russian tradition, the episcopal mantiya is characteristically decorated with red and white horizontal ribbons, called “rivers” or “streams” (Greek: ποταμοί, potamoí; Slavonic: Istochniki), symbolizing the word of God going out into the entire world (Ezekiel 47:1-12, John 7:38, Revelation 22:1). Among the Greeks, these rivers are normally gold.

 

[WetCatechumen]

Would you prefer we stop being polite then?

No, of course not. The point is that your common decency and accuracy of information forces you to acknowledge that the Roman Church is Catholic.

When did the Catholic Church exchange her title Catholic for Orthodox? She did not. Ignatius did not say, “Where is Jesus Christ, there is the Orthodox Church,” after all.