Ex-communicted priests

[cindyluhu]

I don’t know if I’ve chosen the correct forum, but… I live in a senior community where 2 “defrocked” priests have been saying Sunday Mass the past 4 months,complete w/ Communion, in our clubhouse. 15 to 35 people attend, mostly Catholics. I’m a Lutheran (formerly Catholic). I seem to be the only one outraged by these “fakes”. They proudly admit they are “not bound by the Vatican”, yet call themselves “New Catholics” and their “church” the “Evangelical Catholic Church”. They are gay, and “married” to each other. I contacted 3 Catholic churches in my area, and the Diocese of Orlando, months ago. I received one call-back, from a priest who said he’d look into it. That was 5 weeks ago. Isn’t there some church law against these two imposters? Thanks !

 

[YoungTradCath]

There is most certainly law against what they are doing. They have already incurred that law, as you say they have either been laicized or otherwise removed from ministry. It is mortally sinful for them to: 1) be “married” and 2) celebrate mass as they do. I think what they’re doing is despicable, especially since they are “ministering” to senior Catholics, many of whom are probably more impressionable than the average person in his or her prime years.

 

[FAB]

I don’t know if I’ve chosen the correct forum, but… I live in a senior community where 2 “defrocked” priests have been saying Sunday Mass the past 4 months,complete w/ Communion, in our clubhouse. 15 to 35 people attend, mostly Catholics. I’m a Lutheran (formerly Catholic). I seem to be the only one outraged by these “fakes”. They proudly admit they are “not bound by the Vatican”, yet call themselves “New Catholics” and their “church” the “Evangelical Catholic Church”. They are gay, and “married” to each other. I contacted 3 Catholic churches in my area, and the Diocese of Orlando, months ago. I received one call-back, from a priest who said he’d look into it. That was 5 weeks ago. Isn’t there some church law against these two imposters? Thanks !

Imposters would be a wrong term. THe church has already done something to them. They are “defrocked”. What they have done is started thier own new age religion. There is little that the church can do about it. Also those people who are going to follow this false road will. You may speak to the Catholics, you are still one as well in the eyes of the church, and aske them why they are attending. Often seniors get the idea that one church service is just as good as another and if it is the only thing being offered, they may see they have little choice. It could also be the case that the facility was offered the services and they took them up on it. The oporators also make little destictions between practices of faith.

 

[YoungTradCath]

Personally, I think this can also be taken as a message of subtle divine intervention to you, madam, to perhaps rediscover your Catholic faith. You obviously care about the Church in some way, or you wouldn’t be here. If you can, I invite you to start going to mass once again. Talk to a priest at a real Catholic church, and he will be able to help you if you so choose.

 

[ConstantineTG]

I don’t think the Catholic Church can do much other than tell faithful Catholics not to attend their Mass. The police or any civil authority will not stop them for doing something that is not illegal.

 

[NewEnglandPriest]

I don’t know if I’ve chosen the correct forum, but… I live in a senior community where 2 “defrocked” priests have been saying Sunday Mass the past 4 months,complete w/ Communion, in our clubhouse. 15 to 35 people attend, mostly Catholics. I’m a Lutheran (formerly Catholic). I seem to be the only one outraged by these “fakes”. They proudly admit they are “not bound by the Vatican”, yet call themselves “New Catholics” and their “church” the “Evangelical Catholic Church”. They are gay, and “married” to each other. I contacted 3 Catholic churches in my area, and the Diocese of Orlando, months ago. I received one call-back, from a priest who said he’d look into it. That was 5 weeks ago. Isn’t there some church law against these two imposters? Thanks !

As long as they’re not pretending/claiming to be legitimate Catholic priests with faculties then there isn’t much that can be done. You need to talk with whoever at the senior community gave them permission.

 

[puzzleannie]

As long as they’re not pretending/claiming to be legitimate Catholic priests with faculties then there isn’t much that can be done. You need to talk with whoever at the senior community gave them permission.

if the facility is advertising this as Catholic Mass you have to keep hounding the diocese until they stop it. Any clergyman of any denomination, or calling himself that can offer any service he wants, but it cannot be billed as “CAtholic”. If Catholics are attending, and they know the circumstances, it is they who are sinning as well, and they whose welfare is at stake. Why is not the Diocese providing a regular opportunity for Mass for those who cannot attend elsewhere? That is another reason to bug them until you get some action.

 

[ConstantineTG]

if the facility is advertising this as Catholic Mass you have to keep hounding the diocese until they stop it. Any clergyman of any denomination, or calling himself that can offer any service he wants, but it cannot be billed as “CAtholic”. If Catholics are attending, and they know the circumstances, it is they who are sinning as well, and they whose welfare is at stake. Why is not the Diocese providing a regular opportunity for Mass for those who cannot attend elsewhere? That is another reason to bug them until you get some action.

The problem is the name “Catholic” is not trademarked to the Church, therefore we can’t really prevent someone else from using it.

 

[NewEnglandPriest]

if the facility is advertising this as Catholic Mass you have to keep hounding the diocese until they stop it. Any clergyman of any denomination, or calling himself that can offer any service he wants, but it cannot be billed as “CAtholic”. If Catholics are attending, and they know the circumstances, it is they who are sinning as well, and they whose welfare is at stake. Why is not the Diocese providing a regular opportunity for Mass for those who cannot attend elsewhere? That is another reason to bug them until you get some action.

1. According to the OP they are not hiding who/what they are. The diocese can’t tell a private group who they can and can’t host.
2. If they are claiming to be Catholic then the diocese can complain to the senior community about false advertising, but not much else can be done.

 

[SKWill]

1. If they are claiming to be Catholic then the diocese can complain to the senior community about false advertising, but not much else can be done.

The Orlando bishop can do much more than complain to the senior community; it can instruct the pastor of the parish whose boundaries the community fall within gets out of his office and visit the Catholics living there, whether they’re “officially registered” with the parish or not. Pastors are responsible for all the souls within their parish, not just those who bother to attend Mass or register for donation envelopes.

 

[Tridentinum]

If they truly are ‘defrocked’ and ‘excommunicated’, and it is not just hearsay, then it is your duty to inform the Catholics in attendance.

 

[mamaslo]

I don’t know if I’ve chosen the correct forum, but… I live in a senior community where 2 “defrocked” priests have been saying Sunday Mass the past 4 months,complete w/ Communion, in our clubhouse. 15 to 35 people attend, mostly Catholics. I’m a Lutheran (formerly Catholic). I seem to be the only one outraged by these “fakes”. They proudly admit they are “not bound by the Vatican”, yet call themselves “New Catholics” and their “church” the “Evangelical Catholic Church”. They are gay, and “married” to each other. I contacted 3 Catholic churches in my area, and the Diocese of Orlando, months ago. I received one call-back, from a priest who said he’d look into it. That was 5 weeks ago. Isn’t there some church law against these two imposters? Thanks !

My guess is that it just takes a while for things to happen. That is a shame for those going as well.

 

[NewEnglandPriest]

The Orlando bishop can do much more than complain to the senior community; it can instruct the pastor of the parish whose boundaries the community fall within gets out of his office and visit the Catholics living there, whether they’re “officially registered” with the parish or not. Pastors are responsible for all the souls within their parish, not just those who bother to attend Mass or register for donation envelopes.

Talk about going way off the topic. The OP does not say whether or not there’s visitations by the priests so its a bit presumptuous to say they haven’t been visited.

Given that in some areas there could be thousands of Catholics in senior homes its simply not always reasonable to expect regular visits from the local priest.

And if the priest does visit when he can, that still does nothing to prevent these other guys from coming in and performing services.

 

[Anna_Claire]

I don’t believe there is much that can be done. They are within their rights to practice and evangelize the way they want if it is allowed by those who run the community. I have seen this before in retirement communities and it can be confusing to some elderly residents. Is there a community bulletin or newsletter listing worship times? You might ask that it states “not affiliated with Rome” or “not Roman Catholic”…but spread the word by mouth too. I am not opposed to other religions providing worship for others but this is deceiving to those who don’t understand. They should be clear about who they are.

 

[cindyluhu]

Sincere thanks to everyone who has replied. I really appreciate your (name removed by moderator)ut.
These men were given permission to say Mass by our former homeowners’ asso. pres. (who’s recently been voted out of office). There ARE Catholic churches nearby, that need parishoners, of course, to keep their doors open. Those attending this service are doing so because it is so convenient. Yes, they are claiming to be CATHOLIC priests. I do not know if they take a collection. Isn’t part of each church collection to go to the diocese? A Lutheran priest here told me there have been phony priests who prey on seniors trying to get their money. I do know that they advertise on our bulletin board that they will gladly visit the sick/disabled/frail. Also, I HAVE told many residents that these men have no right to say Mass. Most everyone defends them. They are gay, and no one wants to be politically incorrect. And again, they love the convenience of not having to drive to Mass. My husband and I are the youngest here, and tho’ people respect us, they seem to think we should mind our own business, especially since we are not Catholics. They cannot perform marriages, can they?

 

[ConstantineTG]

Isn’t part of each church collection to go to the diocese?

Well, I think each parish has an obligatory amount to give to the diocese, and the rest they keep for themselves. So the more a parish collects, the more they have money for themselves.

A Lutheran priest here told me there have been phony priests who prey on seniors trying to get their money. I do know that they advertise on our bulletin board that they will gladly visit the sick/disabled/frail. Also, I HAVE told many residents that these men have no right to say Mass. Most everyone defends them. They are gay, and no one wants to be politically incorrect. And again, they love the convenience of not having to drive to Mass.

Why is the issue always devolved into that? Its not about whether they are gay or not, its the fact that they are pretending to be Catholics.

My husband and I are the youngest here, and tho’ people respect us, they seem to think we should mind our own business, especially since we are not Catholics. They cannot perform marriages, can they?

They cannot perform Catholic marriages. But if they are a registered minister with the government, then they can perform civil marriages.

 

[UnityofTrinity]

If this is a heretical parish, there is nothing your local diocease can do. The best I can tell you is to leave this parish and attend another parish that is truly presided over by the true Holy Catholic Church.

 

[zab]

Why is the issue always devolved into that? Its not about whether they are gay or not, its the fact that they are pretending to be Catholics.

The word “Catholic” in these independent Catholic churches is confusing to many. But they make it clear that they are not bound by the Vatican.
I did a Google Search and saw that the Evangelical Catholic Church is “an independent Catholic Church which is theologically Lutheran” whatever that means.
Those Catholics who have been warned that these “priests” are not celebrating a valid Catholic Mass bear the responsibility of failing to head the warning.