Exactly how is NFP (Natural Family Planning) NOT just another form of birth control?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Lepanto
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Newbie2 said:
Agreed, but from a theological perspective, how is it “liberating” per your previous assertion.
Click to expand...
when you have “relations” you are liberating your marriage. The act is only reserved those married.
 
Carjack1 said:
With all due respect NFP put a strain on my marriage. I wanted to become Catholic, but this NFP stuff wouldn’t work for me. It has cause me mental anguish and I am glad that I do not practice it.
Click to expand...
Take the time to learn what the Church has to say about ABC. It hasn’t always been so, but in our day and age the Church’s teaching against ABC is very counter-cultural, so don’t expect to understand it right away. It wasn’t that long (about 80 years ago) that all Christian denominations condemned ABC. Martin Luther and John Calvin both condemned it.

This teaching is for all Catholics and for everyone really. Most of us who now accept this teaching have not always accepted it. But when we learned the Church’s arguments against ABC and the consequences of ABC on marriage and society, the arguments made a lot of sense.

All I’m saying is don’t reject what the Church has to say without giving it a fair hearing.

You might try reading Pope Paul VI’s encyclical Humanae Vitae. It’s pretty short, and you can read it online.

The Pope warned what would happen with the widespread acceptance of ABC:
Consequences of Artificial Methods
Click to expand...
  1. Responsible men can become more deeply convinced of the truth of the doctrine laid down by the Church on this issue if they reflect on the consequences of methods and plans for artificial birth control. Let them first consider how easily this course of action could open wide the way for marital infidelity and a general lowering of moral standards. Not much experience is needed to be fully aware of human weakness and to understand that human beings—and especially the young, who are so exposed to temptation—need incentives to keep the moral law, and it is an evil thing to make it easy for them to break that law. Another effect that gives cause for alarm is that a man who grows accustomed to the use of contraceptive methods may forget the reverence due to a woman, and, disregarding her physical and emotional equilibrium, reduce her to being a mere instrument for the satisfaction of his own desires, no longer considering her as his partner whom he should surround with care and affection.
Click to expand...
**Finally, careful consideration should be given to the danger of this power passing into the hands of those public authorities who care little for the precepts of the moral law. **Who will blame a government which in its attempt to resolve the problems affecting an entire country resorts to the same measures as are regarded as lawful by married people in the solution of a particular family difficulty? Who will prevent public authorities from favoring those contraceptive methods which they consider more effective? Should they regard this as necessary, they may even impose their use on everyone. It could well happen, therefore, that when people, either individually or in family or social life, experience the inherent difficulties of the divine law and are determined to avoid them, they may give into the hands of public authorities the power to intervene in the most personal and intimate responsibility of husband and wife.
Click to expand...
vatican.va/holy_father/paul_vi/encyclicals/documents/hf_p-vi_enc_25071968_humanae-vitae_en.html
 
Carjack1 said:
Not from what. I am liberated inside my marriage. I am free to connect with my husband.
Click to expand...
Have you ever read anything about the Catholic teaching on marriage and the marital embrace? Other then the threads on these forums hammering the use of ABC.
 
LJN21 said:
Have you ever read anything about the Catholic teaching on marriage and the marital embrace? Other then the threads on these forums hammering the use of ABC.
Click to expand...
😊 not really. I bought a christopher west book, I haven’t read it yet.
 
Carjack1 said:
😊 not really. I bought a christopher west book, I haven’t read it yet.
Click to expand...
EXCELLENT! Great place to start…

Sorry, many may have missed the fact that you are not Catholic. While I believe all God’s children are really expected to follow the same rules, if one claims to be Catholic, one is expected to follow them even if they don’t understand them. This does not technically apply to you. Read on… CW has a great way of communicating the TOB stuff.

Might I suggest you take a break from the forums and read the book? So much more is said in the book than you can get from wading through all the posts here… Read and come back and let us know what you think, please?
 
newbetx said:
EXCELLENT! Great place to start…

Sorry, many may have missed the fact that you are not Catholic. While I believe all God’s children are really expected to follow the same rules, if one claims to be Catholic, one is expected to follow them even if they don’t understand them. This does not technically apply to you. Read on… CW has a great way of communicating the TOB stuff.

Might I suggest you take a break from the forums and read the book? So much more is said in the book than you can get from wading through all the posts here… Read and come back and let us know what you think, please?
Click to expand...
A little off the subject… I was baptized Catholic by my mother, never got any other sacraments done. I am still technically Catholic? If I am, why. If I go to non-denominatiol services. I heard because I am baptized, I technically am. I want children someday.
 
Carjack1 said:
😊 not really. I bought a christopher west book, I haven’t read it yet.
Click to expand...
Awesome!

Yeah take a brake form the forums read the book and then tell us what you think 🙂
Carjack1 said:
A little off the subject… I was baptized Catholic by my mother, never got any other sacraments done. I am still technically Catholic? If I am, why. If I go to non-denominatiol services. I heard because I am baptized, I technically am. I want children someday.
Click to expand...
I don’t really know. Probably best bet if your really interested in the Catholic Faith is to talked to you local Parish Priest.

You may also want to pick up the Catechism of the Catholic Church if you have not to read as well 😉
 
Carjack1 said:
That is why I am not Catholic. My “relations” with my husband should not be sinful, yet it is according to Catholics. So if one doesn’t practice NFP, their other choice is to abstain? Those choices are not liberating at all.😦
Click to expand...
I don’t think you understand the Catholic position. (Nor do some Catholics.)

Based on reading your others posts here on CAF, I don’t think it was the NFP that was the problem but the issues NFP brought out in your marriage. Catholics do not have to use NFP. Catholics don’t have to abstain within marriage either.

Catholics who have medical problems can take medication or have surgeries, even if the undesirable side effect is infertility. However, fertility is a sign of health, not a medical problem requiring treatment. “Contraceptive mentality” regards fertility, pregnancy and childbirth as medical problems.

As I understand it,* marital relations* between husband and wife is really not the sin; the sin is the that contracepting couples reject and attack their fertility. I used to use contraception, it was difficult to break away from using contraception. But now that I have, I feel liberated by the Catholic teachings.
 
gardenswithkids said:
I don’t think you understand the Catholic position. (Nor do some Catholics.)

Based on reading your others posts here on CAF, I don’t think it was the NFP that was the problem but the issues NFP brought out in your marriage. Catholics do not have to use NFP. Catholics don’t have to abstain within marriage either.

Catholics who have medical problems can take medication or have surgeries, even if the undesirable side effect is infertility. However, fertility is a sign of health, not a medical problem requiring treatment. “Contraceptive mentality” regards fertility, pregnancy and childbirth as medical problems.

As I understand it,* marital relations* between husband and wife is really not the sin; the sin is the that contracepting couples reject and attack their fertility. I used to use contraception, it was difficult to break away from using contraception. But now that I have, I feel liberated by the Catholic teachings.
Click to expand...
Thank you for your post. I got some research to do.
 
Carjack1 said:
Not from what. I am liberated inside my marriage. I am free to connect with my husband.
Click to expand...
There are more ways to connect with your husband than sex.

I feel your pain – NFP can be difficult at times, but that’s how we grow in holiness. And learning sexual self-control now will only make it easier during the times of life when self-control must also be exercised – for example, in the six-week postpartum period after childbirth, or in the later months of pregnancy (if pelvic rest is an issue), or during travel or illness of one’s spouse.

I hope you enjoy the Christopher West book – it’s a great resource!
 
Carjack1 said:
Not from what. I am liberated inside my marriage. I am free to connect with my husband.
Click to expand...
:confused:

The implication is that there is something that exists that you’ve been liberated from. What exactly is that?
 
Carjack1 said:
Not from what. I am liberated inside my marriage. I am free to connect with my husband.
Click to expand...
Is sex really “liberating”? I would have thought sex is about giving your body completely to your spouse, like the way the Groom Jesus gave his body completely for His Bride/The Church.

The stance against contraception seems to make sense to me when one looks at marriage as a sacrament. (It was once explained to me that marriage is a sacrament because it is a witness to the Groom Jesus and His Bride/The Church.) If one doesn’t consider marriage to be a sacrament - well - I suppose contraception is no issue.
 
Charlie_Zeaiter said:
Is sex really “liberating”? I would have thought sex is about giving your body completely to your spouse, like the way the Groom Jesus gave his body completely for His Bride/The Church.

The stance against contraception seems to make sense to me when one looks at marriage as a sacrament. (It was once explained to me that marriage is a sacrament because it is a witness to the Groom Jesus and His Bride/The Church.) If one doesn’t consider marriage to be a sacrament - well - I suppose contraception is no issue.
Click to expand...
That, dear Sir, is an excellent point!
 
Neil_Anthony said:
It’s very simple, no jumping through hoops are required:

Each individual marital act has to be open to life. Since God designed our bodies, it isn’t our fault if we are sometimes infertile. If we don’t want to have a baby, then a couple may choose to not have sex when their God-created reproductive system is fertile.

The end may be the same, to avoid having a baby, but the means is different. God gave us the choice to abstain if we aren’t ready to have a baby. Waiting until God’s system is infertile is very different from intentionally breaking the reproductive system that God designed for us.
Click to expand...
If you sincerely think that God sees this as a difference, then so be it. God will do as God wills I assume in the end.
 
newbetx said:
Like it’s the poor that benefit from contraception… another lie you’ve bought into. If the poor “starve to death” then WE aren’t doing our jobs. Remember, we are here to help those who need it. Not ourselves.

So in your world, would you propose a income limit on who could have birth control? Only those making less than $xK/yr are allowed?
Click to expand...
I suspect you have come into this discussion late, since your conclusions regarding me are quite untrue. The same folks who argue here so vociferously against ABC, also tend to be against most universal health care and most poverty programs because they tend to think that the real number of actually poor people is quite small and capable of being met by charity. They believe most “poor” are simply too lazy to work. I on the other hand am all for govt programs meant ot assist the poor in any number of ways to break the cycle of poverty. So please be more careful in casting aspersions upon my Christian charity. I am in solidarity with the poor of the world.

Your remark about setting some income limitation is simply so far beyond the pale of anything I consider rational as to require no answer.
What is advocated is self-control and Trust in God. Something ABC says is unneeded.
Click to expand...
Nice platitudes but the real world works differently. Abstinence programs are a total failure and have zero impact on pregnancy rates among teens. Full sex education and full availability of ABCs do reduce pregnancy rates and thus abortions, and that is a study proven truth.
You seem to be a strong supporter of Sex as right rather than privalege. Sorry, I’m loosing hope quickly here. Kids have no right to be having sex. It’s really that simple.

And if the non-christian empire supported something, it must have been good? Really do you think God “goes with the majority”? God doesn’t do “democracy.”
Click to expand...
I hope that all young people refrain from sexual activity until they are wise enough to understand the consequences in any number of ways. I doubt that that is fully true until the mid twenties at least. However, I am also intelligent enough to know that most do not wait and all the threats and teaching to the contrary isn’t going to change that. Therefore, responsible adults need step in and attempt to ameliorate the consequences for all sides as best that can be done. I tend not to assume I have the right to dictate to anyone who has reached the age of majority. I certainly will lend my opinion if it is asked for, but I am not God and do not attempt to speak for God.

I have no truck with statements that majorities rule and are thereby right. Minorities are also to be protected against the excesses of majorities. Neither has any assumed claim on truth. I have no clue why anyone would think they do. I would argue that when one finds oneself in the minority, it is perhaps time to re-evaluate the entire subject again. It is why I became a believer in the first place. I found it unlikely that so many could be wrong about God’s existence. It became incombent on me to investigate further. My research led me to conclude that believe was correct.
 
Carjack1 said:
That is why I am not Catholic. My “relations” with my husband should not be sinful, yet it is according to Catholics. So if one doesn’t practice NFP, their other choice is to abstain? Those choices are not liberating at all.😦
Click to expand...
I’m not advocating anything, but lest you be unclear, 85% of all Catholics in the US practice birth control. They are all misguided by poor priests according to most here. Still they do. This forum is not representative of American Catholics. It is very representative of utlra orthodox Catholic practice. I don’t know if you discussed this issue with a local priest in your diocese or not. Those are simply the statistics from the latest PEW survey. They are not new, but have remained quite steady for oh, probably 30 or more years.
 
LJN21 said:
Having relations with ones spouse is not sinful, it is in fact quite the opposite, it is a sacramental! Is the act of renewing your wedding vows, its saying “I do” again and giving your self wholly and completely to each other. That is one of the reasons use of ABC is so wrong. Your saying I’m going to give my self to you except for this part, I’m keeping it for my self.
Click to expand...
If both are in mutual agreement then I don’t see the distinction. I’m withholding a viable uterus or my husband is withholding his sperm. It is by mutual agreement, so I don’t think you can claim one is keeping something of oneself from the other.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top