Excommunication, please help!

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Des_Neiges

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Thank you for reading, I am deeply worried. I attended a Mass this Sat. evening as part of a group that said it is Catholic. The mass was off to me in different ways, and I feld something was not right. When I got home, I did some research and found out that the group is NOT Roman Catholic, but some kind of “Reformed Catholic”.

I am in good standing with the Roman Catholic Church, and I am very affriad because in my research once I got home, I found that the priest is in fact a former Roman Catholic preist who has been excommunicated. When I read that, my heart was broken and panic setit. Is my soul in danger for having attend that Mass and taking communion? I did not know when I attended, and now I am so fearful. Am I in a state of Mortal Sin? Do I need to go to confession?

Thank you for you help, and I eagerly await your responce.
 
You answered your own question, friend. You were unaware of the identity of the group. This was not an intentional act on your part. Therefore there was nothing sinful, nothing conspiratorial, and certainly (therefore) nothing excommunicable on your own part.

Peace! 🙂

(This may be the Dutch Reformed Church, btw.)
 
Just go to Confession.
Sounds like you innocently got caught up in a common scam.

It bothers me that so many heretics and schismatics still purposely call themselves Catholic when they know they are not. That makes them liars too.

Always check out Churches (on internet) prior to attending.

Go to Mass today - in a real Catholic Church.
 
For a sin to be a Mortal Sin, full knowlege (as well as consent and gravity).

You did not commit a Mortal Sin, you were just unfortunately misled.
 
Des_Neiges said:
I am in good standing with the Roman Catholic Church, and I am very affriad because in my research once I got home, I found that the priest is in fact a former Roman Catholic preist who has been excommunicated. When I read that, my heart was broken and panic setit. Is my soul in danger for having attend that Mass and taking communion? I did not know when I attended, and now I am so fearful. Am I in a state of Mortal Sin? Do I need to go to confession?

Thank you for you help, and I eagerly await your responce.
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Do you know for a fact that the Mass was invalid? The priest can be excommunicated and/or suspended and/or be in a state of mortal sin but the Mass can still be valid. Obviously you want to hold your distance outside of Mass but you still need to fulfill your Sunday obligation at a valid Mass.
Can. 1248 §1 The obligation of assisting at Mass is satisfied wherever Mass is celebrated in a catholic rite either on a holyday itself or on the evening of the previous day.
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Can. 844 §2 Whenever necessity requires or a genuine spiritual advantage commends it, and provided the danger of error or indifferentism is avoided, Christ’s faithful for whom it is physically or morally impossible to approach a catholic minister, may lawfully receive the sacraments of penance, the Eucharist and anointing of the sick from non catholic ministers in whose Churches these sacraments are valid.
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Your ignorance protected you in this instance, please be more careful there are a lot of frauds like this out there, if in doubt contact your diocese before going to a new church etc.
 
ProVobis said:
Do you know for a fact that the Mass was invalid? The priest can be excommunicated and/or suspended and/or be in a state of mortal sin but the Mass can still be valid. Obviously you want to hold your distance outside of Mass but you still need to fulfill your Sunday obligation at a valid Mass.
Can. 844 §2 Whenever necessity requires or a genuine spiritual advantage commends it, and provided the danger of error or indifferentism is avoided, Christ’s faithful for whom it is physically or morally impossible to approach a catholic minister, may lawfully receive the sacraments of penance, the Eucharist and anointing of the sick from non catholic ministers in whose Churches these sacraments are valid.
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Canon 844 doesn’t apply because of the words “in whose Churches these sacraments are valid.” The canon does not say “a valid priest” but rather says “in whose Church…are valid.” The Mass has to occur in a Church (not in the sense of a building, but “a Church” in the larger sense) which has valid Sacraments. That’s no accident either. The point of the canon is to make a distinction between an actual “Church” and an ecclesial community–not between a valid priest and non-priest.

Attending a Mass (or whatever it was) as the OP described does not fulfill the obligation. Also, see my next post to the OP.
 
Des_Neiges said:
Thank you for reading, I am deeply worried. I attended a Mass this Sat. evening as part of a group that said it is Catholic. The mass was off to me in different ways, and I feld something was not right. When I got home, I did some research and found out that the group is NOT Roman Catholic, but some kind of “Reformed Catholic”.

I am in good standing with the Roman Catholic Church, and I am very affriad because in my research once I got home, I found that the priest is in fact a former Roman Catholic preist who has been excommunicated. When I read that, my heart was broken and panic setit. Is my soul in danger for having attend that Mass and taking communion? I did not know when I attended, and now I am so fearful. Am I in a state of Mortal Sin? Do I need to go to confession?

Thank you for you help, and I eagerly await your responce.
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You were the victim of a lie, and there is no sin in that.

You acted in good faith, thinking you were attending a Catholic Mass, but only learned after the fact that it was not. You did nothing wrong. Please understand that very clearly. It’s not a sin to be a victim of someone else’s deception.
 
FrDavid96 said:
Canon 844 doesn’t apply because of the words “in whose Churches these sacraments are valid.” The canon does not say “a valid priest” but rather says “in whose Church…are valid.”
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This is what is posted on ewtn:
In keeping with the sacramental meaning of the Eucharist this canon reserves the sacraments to Catholics, that is, those who are in communion with the Church. It then addresses the question of Catholics receiving the sacraments from non-Catholics. It sets the following strict conditions:
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a. necessity or genuine spiritual advantage
b. when the danger of error or indifferentism is avoided
c. it is physically or morally impossible to approach a Catholic minister
d. a church which has valid sacraments
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This last condition is the key one, since it eliminates ALL the Reformation churches (Anglican, Episcopalian, Presbyterian, Methodist, Baptist etc.), none of whom have valid sacred orders, and therefore, a valid Eucharist. The possibility of a Catholic receiving from the minister of another church, when the first three conditions are fulfilled, is limited to the Orthodox Churches, other Oriental Churches, Old Catholics, Polish National and others whose sacraments are recognized by the Holy See…
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ewtn.com/expert/answers/intercommunion.htm
 
ProVobis said:
This is what is posted on ewtn:

ewtn.com/expert/answers/intercommunion.htm
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Yes…exactly. I’m saying the same thing that’s posted on the EWTN website. The Mass must occur in a Church (again, not building, but “Church”) with valid sacraments. What the OP described did not happen in a Church with valid sacraments. Whether or not the priest was validly ordained (and since he is a former Catholic priest, that means that in all likelihood he was indeed validly ordained) doesn’t matter. Canon 844 would not apply. Requirement “d” from the EWTN website (unofficial, but quoting official sources) has not been met.

A Catholic never fulfills the Sunday obligation unless the Mass happens within the context of a Church with valid Sacraments–not just a valid priest. Canon 844 still would not apply because the OP was deceived and that’s not the sort of thing being addressed by the canon anyway.

And there is a mistake on the EWTN website because it says “Reformation churches” rather than “ecclesial communities.” There is no such thing as “Reformation churches” unless one is speaking of the buildings.
 
Father, please clarify: So if a Mass is celebrated in a nondenominational chapel, but by a validly ordained Catholic priest and wth valid manner and rubric, etc., it is not a valid Catholic Mass? Or is it a question of not fulfilling the Sunday obligation in that respect? (I have attended weekday, non-holy-day Masses such as I describe above. I have also attended Mass in secular buildings where children’s competitive events were occurring non-stop over an entire weekend, and this, the organizers decided, was a way to get Mass offered on-site to a mostly-Catholic group of families.)

Thank you,
E.
 
Des_Neiges said:
The mass was off to me in different ways, and I feld something was not right.
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Other people have answered your question (and I agree that you committed no sin) but I wanted to note this comment. You should be pleased that your “sensus catholicus” is working properly. This is something to thank God for. It is a gift when our feelings help us to know and do what is right.
 
Des_Neiges said:
Thank you for reading, I am deeply worried. I attended a Mass this Sat. evening as part of a group that said it is Catholic. The mass was off to me in different ways, and I feld something was not right. When I got home, I did some research and found out that the group is NOT Roman Catholic, but some kind of “Reformed Catholic”.

I am in good standing with the Roman Catholic Church, and I am very affriad because in my research once I got home, I found that the priest is in fact a former Roman Catholic preist who has been excommunicated. When I read that, my heart was broken and panic setit. Is my soul in danger for having attend that Mass and taking communion? I did not know when I attended, and now I am so fearful. Am I in a state of Mortal Sin? Do I need to go to confession?

Thank you for you help, and I eagerly await your responce.
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go to confession anyway. but one of the components of Mortal Sin is for the act to be deliberate, with your full knowledge and consent. the fact that you were not aware until you got home and did your research means you didn’t have full knowledge nor did you consent into it.
 
Elizabeth502 said:
Father, please clarify: So if a Mass is celebrated in a nondenominational chapel, but by a validly ordained Catholic priest and wth valid manner and rubric, etc., it is not a valid Catholic Mass? Or is it a question of not fulfilling the Sunday obligation in that respect? (I have attended weekday, non-holy-day Masses such as I describe above. I have also attended Mass in secular buildings where children’s competitive events were occurring non-stop over an entire weekend, and this, the organizers decided, was a way to get Mass offered on-site to a mostly-Catholic group of families.)

Thank you,
E.
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E,
That’s why I kept putting in parentheses that I wasn’t referring to the word “church” in the sense of the building, but “Church” in the larger sense of a denomination (denomination is the wrong word, but I’m using it here because it’s the familiar one).

If a Catholic priest celebrates Mass in a non-Catholic building, whether that’s a church-building or a secular building it’s a valid Mass. It’s also most likely a licit Mass, although there are restrictions on this; and I’d rather not get into those restrictions on this particular thread because it would take us way off-topic. Suffice to say that such a situation (which you described) is both valid and licit and does fulfill the Sunday obligation for Catholics.

What we’re talking about here on this thread is a Mass celebrated by a validly-ordained priest but not in the context of a Church (remember: not building but ‘denomination’) which has valid sacraments. That situation does not fulfill the Sunday obligation.
 
choy said:
go to confession anyway. but one of the components of Mortal Sin is for the act to be deliberate, with your full knowledge and consent. the fact that you were not aware until you got home and did your research means you didn’t have full knowledge nor did you consent into it.
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You’re suggesting that the OP confess what? Being the victim of a lie? I don’t get it.
 
FrDavid96 said:
You’re suggesting that the OP confess what? Being the victim of a lie? I don’t get it.
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I have confessed doing things that were objectively wrong but were not mortal sins because of my ignorance. I know it was not necessary to go to Confession, but I was upset when I learned the truth about what I had done and I found the Sacrament comforting.
 
floresco said:
I have confessed doing things that were objectively wrong but were not mortal sins because of my ignorance. I know it was not necessary to go to Confession, but I was upset when I learned the truth about what I had done and I found the Sacrament comforting.
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The difference here though is that it isn’t “objectively wrong” to be the victim of someone else’s deception. The OP did not say “I’m going to attend a non-Catholic service” (knowing full well that to do so would be a sin) but rather said “I am going to make an effort to seek a Catholic Mass, and not-sin by fulfilling my obligation” The OP looked for a Catholic Mass, found something claiming to be a Catholic Mass and attended. This is what’s known as “invincible ignorance.” For reference and a more lengthy explanation, see the Catholic Encyclopedia oce.catholic.com/index.php?title=Ignorance

Look at this a little differently. Let’s say that your own pastor is away on vacation and has announced that he’s found a substitute priest. Something happens and the substitute can’t make it, so someone else who is not a priest arrives at the church and announces “I am Father so-and-so and I’ll be saying Mass for you today” He goes through the motions of Mass–which of course isn’t a valid Mass. Do all the parishioners need to confess their “sin” of missing Mass because they were lied to? Of course not. They came to a Catholic church to hear Mass, thought they were doing so, and only later learned that they were the victims of a deception. The same thing happened to the OP, who acted in good faith, and made a genuine effort to find a Catholic Mass. There’s no sin to confess.
 
Fr. David,

what if one’s conscience is bothered by something that may not be a sin? shouldn’t they confess it anyway?
 
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