Expert: Hezbollah, Hamas abusing immigration

[gilliam]

Hezbollah, al-Qaida and Hamas are exploiting the U.S. immigration system, a border security expert testified in Congress. Hamas, the terrorist group currently governing the Palestinian Authority, needs people in the United States to fund raise, Janice Kephart, a consultant who advised the 9/11 commission, said Tuesday. The Lebanese terrorist group Hezbollah used fake marriages to smuggle 200 people across the Mexican border to work in a cigarette-smuggling scheme, Kephart said.

(Excerpt) Read more at jta.org …

 

[LCMS_No_More]

This is part of the reason why it’s a very bad thing that Comprehensive Immigration reform failed because of political maneuvering by the majority party.

 

[gilliam]

LCMS_No_More:

This is part of the reason why it’s a very bad thing that Comprehensive Immigration reform failed because of political maneuvering by the majority party.

We need to defend our borders 1st. Amnesty is not going to keep the terrorists out.

 

[LCMS_No_More]

gilliam:

We need to defend our borders 1st. Amnesty is not going to keep the terrorists out.

Sigh

1. Comprehensive immigration reform includes border security.
2. No one is proposing amnesty and that’s not going to change no matter how many times you call it that.

 

[gilliam]

Sigh

1. Comprehensive immigration reform includes border security.
2. No one is proposing amnesty and that’s not going to change no matter how many times you call it that.

Borders 1st… you can get around to your “comprehensive” after that.

And telling people to stick around and we will make you a citizen is amnesty.

 

[LCMS_No_More]

gilliam:

Borders 1st… you can get around to your “comprehensive” after that.

That was the big talking point during the Senate debate.

And telling people to stick around and we will make you a citizen is amnesty.

No it is not. The amnesty talking point is so tired. Stop changing the definition of words.

am·nes·ty Audio pronunciation of “amnesty” ( P ) Pronunciation Key (mn-st)
n. pl. am·nes·ties

A general pardon granted by a government, especially for political offenses.

tr.v. am·nes·tied, am·nes·ty·ing, am·nes·ties

To grant a general pardon to.

[Latin amnstia, from Greek amnsti. See amnesia.]

[Download Now or Buy the Book]
Source: The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.
Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.

Main Entry: am·nes·ty
Pronunciation: 'am-n&s-tE
Function: noun
Inflected Form: plural -ties
: an act of clemency by an authority (as a government) by which pardon is granted esp. to a group of individuals <illegal-alien farm workers seeking amnesty —National Law Journal>

Source: Merriam-Webster’s Dictionary of Law, © 1996 Merriam-Webster, Inc.

amnesty

n 1: a period during which offenders are exempt from punishment 2: a warrant granting release from punishment for an offense [syn: pardon] 3: the formal act of liberating someone [syn: pardon, free pardon] v : grant a pardon to (a group of people)

Source: WordNet ® 2.0, © 2003 Princeton University

There are no exemptions from punishment, just a change in the nature of it (from deportation to two $2,000 fines).

Second, “we’ll make you a citizen” is a mischaracterization of any of the plans being put forth. The most liberal would require $2,000 in fines, payment of taxes, learning of English and six years of work before being granted resident status (resident status is NOT citizenship), after which one must wait an additional six years before being considered for citizenship. There are no guarantees of citizenship and it’s not without penalty.

 

[gilliam]

LCMS_No_More:

There are no exemptions from punishment, just a change in the nature of it (from deportation to two $2,000 fines)…

1st time I’ve heard anyone call them fines. … 1st time I’ve seen $2,000 also. I keep seeing it written $1,000 in fees (which can be waived under a lot of different senarios). A fee is not a fine and telling someone who broke a law to stick around and we will make it all OK again is amnesty. You can play with the wording all you want, but it doesn’t fool us who live with the problem day in and day out.

By the way, do you know how much it costs a US Citizen these days to get a passport?

 

[wabrams]

LCMS_No_More:

This is part of the reason why it’s a very bad thing that Comprehensive Immigration reform failed because of political maneuvering by the majority party.

So if it were the Democrats in the majority pusing this, you would have a problem with them too?

 

[LCMS_No_More]

1st time I’ve heard anyone call them fines. … 1st time I’ve seen $2,000 also. I keep seeing it written $1,000 in fees (which can be waived under a lot of different senarios).

You must have been reading right-wing blogs and watching FOXNews, then. I get my news from a variety of sources. My sources read as fines.

Check this story from Yahoo! News .

It’s actually two $1000 fines. One to get the nonimmigrant work visa and the second when applying for Permanent Resident Status.

A fee is not a fine and telling someone who broke a law to stick around and we will make it all OK again is amnesty.

Those who are telling you that it’s just a fee obviously have an agenda. It’s a fine that replaces the civil action of deportation.

You can play with the wording all you want, but it doesn’t fool us who live with the problem day in and day out.

Agreed. The Republicans need to stop trying to change the meaning of words.

 

[wabrams]

LCMS_No_More:

You must have been reading right-wing blogs and watching FOXNews, then. I get my news from a variety of sources. My sources read as fines.

Check this story from Yahoo! News .

It’s actually two $1000 fines. One to get the nonimmigrant work visa and the second when applying for Permanent Resident Status.

Those who are telling you that it’s just a fee obviously have an agenda. It’s a fine that replaces the civil action of deportation.

Agreed. The Republicans need to stop trying to change the meaning of words.

Thats not a fine; you don’t pay a fine to renew your driver’s license, you pay a fee. It looks like it’s the Democrats are the ones changing the meaning of words.

 

[LCMS_No_More]

wabrams:

So if it were the Democrats in the majority pusing this, you would have a problem with them too?

Abso-fraggen-lutely! I believe in immigration reform because it’s necessary, not for political purposes.

 

[wabrams]

LCMS_No_More:

Abso-fraggen-lutely! I believe in immigration reform because it’s necessary, not for political purposes.

I’ll remember you said that.

 

[LCMS_No_More]

wabrams:

I’ll remember you said that.

Why?

 

[LCMS_No_More]

wabrams:

Thats not a fine; you don’t pay a fine to renew your driver’s license, you pay a fee. It looks like it’s the Democrats are the ones changing the meaning of words.

One does if one has tickets that haven’t been paid for. You pay the fine and the normal $18 or whatever.

This is the fine on top of all the normal fees for background checks, fingerprints, visa application, etc. that will have to be paid as well. USCIS charges fees for almost everything and you can be sure that the regular fees plus the fines will be collected up front and via a secure method of payment (like a money order).

Currently, the fee for a “Petition for A Nonimmigrant Worker” is $190 (and other fees may apply), the fee for an “Application to Register Permanent Residence or to Adjust Status” is $325, the fee for a “Supplement A to Form I-485, Application to Register Permanent Residence” (which many who would benefit from the regularization program) is $1,000, the fee for an “Application to Preserve Residence for Naturalization Purposes” is $155. I could go on and on.

 

[gilliam]

LCMS_No_More:

One does if one has tickets that haven’t been paid for. You pay the fine and the normal $18 or whatever.

This is the fine on top of all the normal fees for background checks, fingerprints, visa application, etc. that will have to be paid as well. USCIS charges fees for almost everything and you can be sure that the regular fees plus the fines will be collected up front and via a secure method of payment (like a money order).

Currently, the fee for a “Petition for A Nonimmigrant Worker” is $190 (and other fees may apply), the fee for an “Application to Register Permanent Residence or to Adjust Status” is $325, the fee for a “Supplement A to Form I-485, Application to Register Permanent Residence” (which many who would benefit from the regularization program) is $1,000, the fee for an “Application to Preserve Residence for Naturalization Purposes” is $155. I could go on and on.

There you go, it isn’t a fine, it is a fee.

 

[LCMS_No_More]

gilliam:

There you go, it isn’t a fine, it is a fee.

Give me patience!

No, it’s a fine for breaking the lw that is paid on top of the normal fees that must be paid!

See, the problem is that you seem to only want deportation (which practically leads to permanent banishment). No choices, no mercy, no hope. Forget the families that would be broken apart. Forget the economic damage it would do to whole regions. Forget the suffering it woudl cause.

Sorry, that’s not real-world thinking.

There are

 

[LCMS_No_More]

gilliam:

There you go, it isn’t a fine, it is a fee.

Give me patience!

No, it’s a fine for breaking the law that is paid on top of the normal fees that must be paid! Using the renewal of driver license example, let’s say I get a ticket for speeding with a fine of $120. If I don’t pay it, it goes up to, say, $250 and I can’t renew my license until it’s paid. I have to pay the FINE for breaking the law and pay the normal $18 fee to renew my license.

But let’s get down to brass tacks: from what I have seen, you seem (I add seem to avoid the charge that I’m assuming what you think…I’m extrapolating this from your words) to only want deportation (which practically leads to permanent banishment). No choices, no mercy, no hope. Forget the families that would be broken apart. Forget the economic damage it would do to whole regions. Forget the suffering it woudl cause. They violaed the law, so they’re persona non grata. Buh-bye. Never even TRY to come back because we’ll just turn you away (because the truth is, there is NO legal process for poor people to enter the US unless they already have a mother, father, brother or sister here who are citizens).

Sorry, that’s not real-world thinking. Good emotional workout, though.

 

[gilliam]

Give me patience!

No, it’s a fine for breaking the law that is paid on top of the normal fees that must be paid! .

LOL! Stubbern. Sorry, you are playing word games to try to make it sound like it isn’t amnesty. But it is. We all know it is. Those protesting know it is.

 

[LCMS_No_More]

gilliam:

LOL! Stubbern. Sorry, you are playing word games to try to make it sound like it isn’t amnesty. But it is. We all know it is. Those protesting know it is. There really isn’t any debate about it.

Whatever! The right is the side playing word games, but who am I to try to convince you? That’s the thing about the Right…“stubbOrn.” Refuse to give an inch to anyone and always assert the talking point.

Today’s Republican talking points on immigration are:

Anything but deportation and banishment is amnesty.

Fence the border before doing anything else.

No guest worker program (sorry, Your Majesty, we mean, Mr. President. )

 

[gilliam]

LCMS_No_More:

Whatever! The right is the side playing word games, but who am I to try to convince you? That’s the thing about the Right…“stubbOrn.” Refuse to give an inch to anyone and always assert the talking point.

Today’s Republican talking points on immigration are:

Anything but deportation and banishment is amnesty.

Fence the border before doing anything else.

No guest worker program (sorry, Your Majesty, we mean, Mr. President. )

Sorry I didn’t get the memo. I guess I need to check D.U. more often.

There really isn’t any debate about it. A “fine” that is less than the cost of a passport can’t really be called anything else but a fee to try to appease those of us who are against the whole idea. I think they think we are stupid. You don’t think we are stupid do you? I keep getting the idea that those in big cities think of us as “hicks” and they can play word games and do what they wish.