Expose them all!

[Loud-living-dogma]

Hey – we’re all obviously struggling with the horrifying abuse scandal out of Pennsylvania. I have a couple of questions though. Why is it, that no one is calling for the same level of transparency for all organizations that have dealt with children? Seriously, why is no one calling on public schools, or all schools, medical societies, etc. to expose teachers, doctors, coaches etc. who have been credibly accused of abuse since the 1940s to open their files as well? I can understand that in the Catholic Church the cover-up is a huge part of the story, but isn’t the cover-up still going on everywhere else?
Not to mention, there are medical professionals working today, who are incompetent and actually killing people. Last week, today, and tomorrow. Where is the transparency there? My understanding is that hospital boards review those cases and there may be action, or not, but I doubt if there is a public naming of names, so hospitals can invite more lawsuits. Why aren’t we all calling for all abusers to be outed?

 

[goout]

Hey – we’re all obviously struggling with the horrifying abuse scandal out of Pennsylvania. I have a couple of questions though. Why is it, that no one is calling for the same level of transparency for all organizations that have dealt with children? Seriously, why is no one calling on public schools, or all schools, medical societies, etc. to expose teachers, doctors, coaches etc. who have been credibly accused of abuse since the 1940s to open their files as well? I can understand that in the Catholic Church the cover-up is a huge part of the story, but isn’t the cover-up still going on everywhere else?
Not to mention, there are medical professionals working today, who are incompetent and actually killing people. Last week, today, and tomorrow. Where is the transparency there? My understanding is that hospital boards review those cases and there may be action, or not, but I doubt if there is a public naming of names, so hospitals can invite more lawsuits. Why aren’t we all calling for all abusers to be outed?

Because the Church seminaries and diocesan higher levels have a culture of entrenched power that is self-protecting.

 

[Loud-living-dogma]

Yes, agreed. ALL of these organizations are self-protecting. It is the nature of organizations to be self-protecting. Why is no one else calling them on it? Wouldn’t you like the media to expose incompetent medical professionals, at the he very least?

 

[goout]

Yes, agreed. ALL of these organizations are self-protecting. It is the nature of organizations to be self-protecting. Why is no one else calling them on it? Wouldn’t you like the media to expose incompetent medical professionals?

The documents have to be available.
I think you may see more states take direct action against Church hierarchy, like Pennsylvania did.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Public schools haven’t exactly been hush hush about the abuses going on in them. I see huge numbers of teacher cases online both in the news and in blogs which follow arrests.

 

[KJW5551]

Because the Church seminaries and diocesan higher levels have a culture of entrenched power that is self-protecting.

Yeah, because teachers unions have no power in this country.

OP I agree 100%. It’s inconsistent at best to only demand the Church be accountable for it’s problems when it goes on in so many other places.

 

[goout]

goout:

Because the Church seminaries and diocesan higher levels have a culture of entrenched power that is self-protecting.

Yeah, because teachers unions have no power in this country.

OP I agree 100%. It’s inconsistent at best to only demand the Church be accountable for it’s problems when it goes on in so many other places.

Teachers unions are not the same as diocese. They are directly beholden to the public. They do not have quite the same power to secrecy as a diocese.

 

[KJW5551]

Respectfully, that’s a very naive point of view to think that teachers unions always do what’s best for the public.

The schools will have their day in the spotlight.

 

[goout]

Respectfully, that’s a very naive point of view to think that teachers unions always do what’s best for the public.

The schools will have their day in the spotlight.

Didn’t say that.
Can you make the distinction between the two types of body?

 

[AlbertDerGrosse]

When the Boy Scouts, public schools, hospitals, et. al. begin telling me that it is incumbent upon the salvation of my immortal soul to be in visible communion with and submission to them, and that I must give assent to everything they say in regards to faith and morals de fide, then I’ll start demanding the same kind of transparency and moral integrity from them as I do from “Holy” Mother Church.

By the way, nice demonstration of the Tu Quoque you got there.

 

[Jezra]

Seriously, why is no one calling on public schools, or all schools, medical societies, etc. to expose teachers, doctors, coaches etc. who have been credibly accused of abuse since the 1940s to open their files as well?

The UK is doing just that with the UK Child Abuse Inquiries. There have also been a large number of non-Church high profile child abuse cases in court. The UK has no statute of limitations so even cases from the 70s and 80s have been tried and the assailants successfully prosecuted.

Other countries with a statute of limitations do not prosecute old abuses. No prosecution, no interest. Individual teachers, doctors etc in individual schools and practices are not high profile enough for the media, especially with no trial.

The Church, as a collective, on the other hand, is high profile and its reputation all it has, given prosecution after a fixed period is no longer an option. And this is why this makes news.

A nation’s statute of limitations is the stumbling block, IMHO.

 

[Loud-living-dogma]

When the Boy Scouts, public schools, hospitals, et. al. begin telling me that it is incumbent upon the salvation of my immortal soul to be in visible communion with and submission to them, and that I must give assent to everything they say in regards to faith and morals de fide, then I’ll start demanding the same kind of transparency and moral integrity from them as I do from “Holy” Mother Church.

By the way, nice demonstration of the Tu Quoque you got there.

So transparency only matters for religious organizations? Not for Larry Nassar, or any other cases?

 

[KJW5551]

So you don’t think it’s in any way inconsistent that we’re on the front page all across the country but when it was reported that there were 500 cases of abuse in the Chicago public school system in just 10 years that barely makes the news? Please.

 

[goout]

So you don’t think it’s in any way inconsistent that we’re on the front page all across the country but when it was reported that there were 500 cases of abuse in the Chicago public school system in just 10 years that barely makes the news? Please.

Ok now you’re talking about press coverage.
Another important issue for sure, but you are conflating a few things here.

Agreed that secular press is an enemy of the Church, and agreed that a school teacher is way more likely to abuse a child than a priest. Agreed that teachers unions also protect their employees.
Agreed.

But the Church has a power structure in place that does not operate like a teacher’s union, and it involves a layer of secrecy that other public organizations do not have. That’s just a fact. That needs to be changed so that this warped self protecting culture can be rooted out.

 

[AlbertDerGrosse]

So transparency only matters for religious organizations? Not for Larry Nassar, or any other cases?

So you don’t think it’s in any way inconsistent that we’re on the front page all across the country but when it was reported that there were 500 cases of abuse in the Chicago public school system in just 10 years that barely makes the news? Please.

Please! I’m done with this trite Catholic whataboutism. You two and everyone else engaging in it really need to get new material cuz this just isn’t cutting it anymore.

 

[goout]

Loud-living-dogma:

So transparency only matters for religious organizations? Not for Larry Nassar, or any other cases?

So you don’t think it’s in any way inconsistent that we’re on the front page all across the country but when it was reported that there were 500 cases of abuse in the Chicago public school system in just 10 years that barely makes the news? Please.

Please! I’m done with this trite Catholic whataboutism. You two and everyone else engaging in it really need to get new material cuz this just isn’t cutting it anymore.

I have to agree. It perpetuates the evil. This is the one thing the Pope’s remarks emphasized (even if they were short on action)…we need to take communal responsibility as Catholics for our Church and not point to everyone else’s faults. We have more than our share.

 

[Benadam]

This is a spiritual answer.
Like Peter, satan’s desire to sift is granted. Like Peter, Jesus has prayed that her faith not fail.
Like Peter, when she recovers she is called to strengthen her brethren.

 

[Loud-living-dogma]

Wow – that is the kind of thing I was wondering about. It seems to me that this was fairly prevalent, NOT just in the Catholic Church. What the hell – is this just a common thing? That people (probably mainly men) routinely want to fondle and otherwise abuse / molest children? Is there a sociologist who can chime in – how prevalent did this used to be? How prevalent is it now – ditto for child porn?
I find it telling that no one commented (yet) that this kind of abuse was not happening to some degree in other organizations?

 

[Roseeurekacross]

we are and have, in Australia

next week the Australian Bishops Conference brings down its response to the Royal Commission into historic sexual abuse. This Commission took in all institutions and made them all accountable.

 

[deMontfort]

Well, for starters, the public schools are protected from transparency by corrupt teachers unions.