Extended family gatherings... differences in parenting

[gardenswithkids]

Don’t worry - grandma wears big panties! That’s where the conflict came in. Unlike you, her daughter-in-law argued and yelled and then the whole family marched out! … all for Grandma saying “Yelling is not acceptable in my house” (I heard it - it wasn’t a very stern voice)…

I really truly understand all the comments you’re all making regarding true shyness - and I totally, completely agree! 100%
From the looks of the situation, though… I really don’t think that’s the case…

Ah well…

Ummm… slight correction/clarification…
The *correction *was made for yelling/screeching… the “shyness” issue was at a totally different time and was not handled harshly whatsoever… it was responded to with a “I love you!” and a smile.

As a formerly shy child, I would have been mortified if my behavior attracted attention or correction in front of others. Some of my children are shy, and they don’t do this type of thing you described in front of seldom seen relatives, (but lets face it–seldom seen relatives are virtual strangers to young children.) Yelling and screaming attract attention–and shy children general try to avoid attracking attention… There are other issues beyond shyness. Children melt down for other reasons–such as being hungry or tired. Regular meals and naps are often disturbed or missed when visiting relatives over the holidays.

Maybe there’s a problem with parental discipline, maybe the child has other issues, maybe the child needed a nap, maybe all of the above or something else entirely. In any case, the grandmother’s response seems appropriate–unless the parents have told her about issue you aren’t aware of. The parents walking out seems an over-reaction, but if they were told she doesn’t permit yelling in her home and they didn’t know how to quiet down their child, maybe they thought she wanted them to leave.

Ahhh, Em…so how was the turkey?

 

[Em_in_FL]

As a formerly shy child, I would have been mortified if my behavior attracted attention or correction in front of others. Some of my children are shy, and they don’t do this type of thing you described in front of seldom seen relatives, (but lets face it–seldom seen relatives are virtual strangers to young children.) Yelling and screaming attract attention–and shy children general try to avoid attracking attention… There are other issues beyond shyness. Children melt down for other reasons–such as being hungry or tired. Regular meals and naps are often disturbed or missed when visiting relatives over the holidays.

Maybe there’s a problem with parental discipline, maybe the child has other issues, maybe the child needed a nap, maybe all of the above or something else entirely.

I completely understand… the issue wasn’t the behavior of the child, but of the parents. The parents literally ignored the screeching the entire day (even after the grandparents mentioned something quietly in the other room to the parents). Then once it became totally out of control, the grandparents stepped in kindly to correct. The parents then yelled at the grandparents (nice use of “Honor Thy Mother/Father”), and stormed off.

I get it… I really do… kids break down and are stressed under these conditions - that’s NOT the issue.
The issue in the parenting techniques used by the parents - ignoring the screaming and then yelling at their own parents.

The grandparents just cleaned all week, opened their home, made a huge meal, quietly tolerated screaming, kindly corrected - and then were yelled at. It’s the PARENTS that I have issue with in how they treated the grandparents. This is not about the kids… kids will be kids and all have unique personalities.

 

[idrum677]

It sounds to me like this grand niece might have some issues beyond just being ‘shy’. Screaming, lack of social awareness,blank stares…say to me something more is going on. How old is she?

I agree. As a parent of a child on the Autisim spectrum, I know what it is like to have a child who screams, has trouble with social skills, blank stares, etc. We teach our children how to behave, be polite, and to respect others, espicially family. Our middle son, however, at times can seem like he has never been disciplined.

I don’t know your whole dilema but is sounds like a lot of the issues we faced before getting diagnosed. Family gathering always seemed to bring out the worst of those behaviors. How often did we see the stares and the judgement that we were somehow “bad parents.”

Unless these parents are blatently being derelict in their parenting duties or this child seems a danger to herself or others, its the parents call on how to “discipline” her. Also, please pray for them…they will appreciate it.

 

[whatevergirl]

I completely understand… the issue wasn’t the behavior of the child, but of the parents. The parents literally ignored the screeching the entire day (even after the grandparents mentioned something quietly in the other room to the parents). Then once it became totally out of control, the grandparents stepped in kindly to correct. The parents then yelled at the grandparents (nice use of “Honor Thy Mother/Father”), and stormed off.

I get it… I really do… kids break down and are stressed under these conditions - that’s NOT the issue.
The issue in the parenting techniques used by the parents - ignoring the screaming and then yelling at their own parents.

The grandparents just cleaned all week, opened their home, made a huge meal, quietly tolerated screaming, kindly corrected - and then were yelled at. It’s the PARENTS that I have issue with in how they treated the grandparents. This is not about the kids… kids will be kids and all have unique personalities.

Yes, I see more of what you’re saying now. Looks like the parents could have showed more respect in the situation. What’s interesting, is on Nanny 911 (I sometimes watch lol) …the nanny will often discover that the real issues behind children acting out, and misbehaving stem from misbehaving parents. It’s an interesting theory. (not always the case, for sure, but it’s interesting…and a lot of times, the nanny on the show is right!) (Meaning, if the parents are selfish, they tend to raise selfish kids. If the parents are yelling and screaming at one another 24/7…the kids then yell and scream at each other. Mirroring, I think she calls it)

 

[shannyk]

Em I understand more now…from you first post it seemed like the big issue in question was the rudeness of the niece not saying hi to grandma. Maybe you personally had more of an issue with that than g-ma did? is how I’m taking it? I can see how it would seem rude from your perspective. As for the screaming part…I can’t blame g-ma for correcting in the way she did. After all this is a child she seems not to know that well (becasue she probably doesn’t see her often) so if there is an underlying issue with the child she’s not privy to that info or used to the behavior.

Let me look at this again from the eyes of the parent with the hard to discipline child (for whatever reason…shyness or something more). The parents are probably acutely aware that g-ma had cleaned and cooked and the expectations were high for their DD making the whole thing stressful. Getting there might have been a battle. From where I sit I can’t defend your SIL walking out, but I can understand it. She was probably on stress level 100000000 to begin with if her child’s behavior is any indication of what she regularly deals with. Couple that with momma bear instincts and a grandparent who doesn’t understand (through no fault of her own) and you have a recipe for disaster.

I hope things can be mended. If this niece/granddaughter does have some things that need dealing with, or even if the parents are just…lazy, they’re going to need support.

 

[gardenswithkids]

I completely understand… the issue wasn’t the behavior of the child, but of the parents. The parents literally ignored the screeching the entire day (even after the grandparents mentioned something quietly in the other room to the parents). Then once it became totally out of control, the grandparents stepped in kindly to correct. The parents then yelled at the grandparents (nice use of “Honor Thy Mother/Father”), and stormed off.

I get it… I really do… kids break down and are stressed under these conditions - that’s NOT the issue.
The issue in the parenting techniques used by the parents - ignoring the screaming and then yelling at their own parents.

The grandparents just cleaned all week, opened their home, made a huge meal, quietly tolerated screaming, kindly corrected - and then were yelled at. It’s the PARENTS that I have issue with in how they treated the grandparents. This is not about the kids… kids will be kids and all have unique personalities.

I don’t know what your relationship with the child’s parents is like, but I agree that their behavior seems a bigger concern than the child’s behavior. Sounds like they’re the ones who were stressed and who broke down. Is this your brother and SIL? (…and might they be able to appreciate and use a book on disciplining by Dr. Ray for Christmas? ) If it’s your brother, maybe your dad can talk to him about the situation–and the need for dads to participate in discipline.

 

[SamH]

I agree. As a parent of a child on the Autisim spectrum, I know what it is like to have a child who screams, has trouble with social skills, blank stares, etc. We teach our children how to behave, be polite, and to respect others, espicially family. Our middle son, however, at times can seem like he has never been disciplined.

I don’t know your whole dilema but is sounds like a lot of the issues we faced before getting diagnosed. Family gathering always seemed to bring out the worst of those behaviors. How often did we see the stares and the judgement that we were somehow “bad parents.”

Unless these parents are blatently being derelict in their parenting duties or this child seems a danger to herself or others, its the parents call on how to “discipline” her. Also, please pray for them…they will appreciate it.

Agreed.

I’ve been there and done that. Our older son has epilepsy and at age 4 he was a literal terror to deal with. He was on 6 medications and all listed various anti social behaviors as side effects. In the past I had no problems with “If that were my child he’d never act like that” and have since eaten those words many times and have also learned to keep my mouth shut. You never know what some people are going though.

Few on my wife’s side of the family knew what we were going through and looked at his behaviour as a reflection of our parenting. My wife was not interested in explaining his medical details because we lived it every day and rehashing it to “family” that we saw a couple times a year was much more pain than it was worth. A few years back one of my wife’s sister in laws made a comment about “If that child had half a brain…” and my wife corrected her saying he did only have half a brain (hemispherectimy at age 5) and was still smarter than any child her SIL had.

 

[gardenswithkids]

Agreed.

I’ve been there and done that. Our older son has epilepsy and at age 4 he was a literal terror to deal with. He was on 6 medications and all listed various anti social behaviors as side effects. In the past I had no problems with “If that were my child he’d never act like that” and have since eaten those words many times and have also learned to keep my mouth shut. You never know what some people are going though.

Few on my wife’s side of the family knew what we were going through and looked at his behaviour as a reflection of our parenting. My wife was not interested in explaining his medical details because we lived it every day and rehashing it to “family” that we saw a couple times a year was much more pain than it was worth. A few years back one of my wife’s sister in laws made a comment about “If that child had half a brain…” and my wife corrected her saying he did only have half a brain (hemispherectimy at age 5) and was still smarter than any child her SIL had.

I get that there may be more going on with the child than Em knows. What do you think about the parents discipline style and behavior that she mentioned–ignoring the child’s screaming then eventually yelling at the grandmother? What do you think extended family should do in the type of situation described?

 

[1ke]

Don’t worry - grandma wears big panties! That’s where the conflict came in. Unlike you, her daughter-in-law argued and yelled and then the whole family marched out! … all for Grandma saying “Yelling is not acceptable in my house” (I heard it - it wasn’t a very stern voice)…

DIL would have gotten a big heaping spoonful from me, too!

Wow, that’s pretty bad.

 

[SamH]

I get that there may be more going on with the child than Em knows. What do you think about the parents discipline style and behavior that she mentioned–ignoring the child’s screaming then eventually yelling at the grandmother? What do you think extended family should do in the type of situation described?

Depends.

Does Em know what is going on? My mother in law tried to “counsel” us several times on how to deal with our child - she was convinced he had ALERGIES and that all the medications were a waste of money (apparently she knew more than several neurologist at the Cleveland Clinic). Her reaction was part of the reason why we didn’t bother telling people on her side of the family what was going on, after we would explain what we were dealing with we then had to justify his medical treatment and deal with their “helpful” (name removed by moderator)ut. We were under enormous stress (who wants to tell a doctor to remove half their child’s brain) and our tolerance for other people’s meddling reached an end several years ago. More than one person has been asked to simply “SHUT UP” because they have no idea what they are talking about even after it has been explained to them. Eventually we simply quit telling her parents what we were doing because they did not support us and only added to the stress in our lives.

The medications our son was on (in addition to the epilepsy) caused him to act like out and there was no consoling him. He didn’t want to be held, he didn’t want a piece of candy, he didn’t need a nap and yelling at him to be quiet only added to the noise and confusion and spanking him for something he couldn’t control only added to the noise and is cruel. Having someone TELL you to take actions that you knew didn’t work only added to the frustration level. “Oh, I should ****** and he’ll be quiet – why didn’t I think of that? I’ve only been dealing with this for 24/7/365 days a year.” At one point we felt we were prisoners in our own home. Our younger son was in danger from his brother and could not be left alone with him. Had I not lived it I would never had understood how little control a parent could have over a child that has a chemical imbalance caused by the doctors trying to treat him.

It took years to work through it and today most people think he’s a little shy with a slight stutter. Few people know he’s a walking talking miracle that defies most of what doctors think they know about neurology.

Just this year we had to deal with a speech teacher who confidently explained to us that she would have our son speaking “normally” in one year. As part of his IEP she made this totally unrealistic goal and fully expected to meet it “with our help”. She was convinced if we made him practice at home (as if we were not doing that) he would quickly “recover”. A few months in she finally realized what it meant when we said “The part of the brain that controlled his speech was removed”. The doctors as Cleveland were amazed he had recovered as much as he had given the fact that the operation was done so late in speech development. We are talking years of therapy to hopeful some day appear normal – not a single school year.

 

[Em_in_FL]

No one has suggested one iota of a medical problem within any of our situations. Our family is one that appreciates the truth - as far as I know there aren’t any hidden medical conditions or underlying issues with any of the kids (thanks be to God!), but the parenting styles vary across the board.

These aren’t strangers that we don’t know anything about - these are close family members who defend their methods as “parenting choices” - which is perfectly fine and totally acceptable if that works for them in their homes - but the backlash to the grandparents was completely unwarranted and unacceptable.

Sometimes things should be said - sometimes they shouldn’t. I’m not the best story teller on the exact situation, but the impression was fairly universal with the remaining family members. I’m not a judgmental person and would never judge challenging situations, but communication is necessary to make sure full understanding is shared - as in the medical issues you all mentioned above… as far as anyone else knows - that is not the case.

Clearly there are many issues within many different families - I’m not suggesting what we observed is universal or unique - just sharing our experience. I felt bad for those who were insulted and was just looking for ways to quell explosive upsets before they happen.

 

[kage_ar]

Heck, Em, I think that unless the child has some serious disorder that they should be REQUIRED to respond to adults who ask them a question. That is called being polite, it is good manners.

If the child is shy, they do not have to chatter on and carry on a conversation, they do have to be civil. All the better to learn to say “Yes sir” “No, Maam” “Please” and “Thank You” as a child - it will serve the shy person well later in life if they learn that the world does not revolve around their shyness and they are expected to be civil.

 

[tapiocapudding]

perhaps the child is extremely shy and sensitive? As a small child my parents would try and make me answer questions asked by well meaning extended family I didn’t know too well and I’d just cry because I was that painfully shy. I would cry at school when the teacher called on me. It got better as I grew. My DS has an easygoing temperament so sometimes I’m inclined to think I’m doing something better than the moms of those toddlers who tantrum. But them I remind myself that all kids are born with unique temperaments and I just might get the kind of child next who is sensitive or is very reactive. I can imagine travelling would be pretty hard on a young child. So I try and suspend judgement because it could be me in a few years with a child who knows his/her manners but refuses to use them just when it is most important! However it is unfortunate your relatives just leave the child to scream in another room.

Anyways I’m also dealing with differences in parenting in family gatherings. One of DH’s brother’s has a little girl about 16 months and when she goes to touch something she is not supposed to they smack her hands and yell at her. It is painful for me to watch! I also have plenty of extended family commenting on if I’m still breastfeeding and how it’s stealing nutrition from the new baby and how DH and I are too lax on our little guy because we don’t use physical discipline and we’re babying him to death etc etc. Tis the season for unsolicited advice. We try and grin and bear it