Extraordinary Ministers

[Jim_Roberts]

Please,. the use of Echaristic Ministers is completely VALID.

They go for training for this.

The time they use Eucharistic Ministers if the liturgy is crowded; however,l it is invalid if the priest sits during thew EUcharist, unless he is ill, but he still has to give out the Eucharist just as the ministers

 

[Love_Divine]

Please,. the use of Echaristic Ministers is completely VALID.

They go for training for this.

The time they use Eucharistic Ministers if the liturgy is crowded;

Actually, the Eucharistic Minister is the one who celebrates the Mass. The Priest, and only the priest, is the Eucharistic Minister.

I’m getting all my information from the documents released by the Vatican, which has stated that the habitual use of EMHCs on Sundays needs to cease. I don’t know where everyone else get their information.

 

[benedictgal]

Actually, the Eucharistic Minister is the one who celebrates the Mass. The Priest, and only the priest, is the Eucharistic Minister.

I’m getting all my information from the documents released by the Vatican, which has stated that the habitual use of EMHCs on Sundays needs to cease. I don’t know where everyone else get their information.

Even the Norms for the Distribution of Holy Communion in the United States (which is now included in the 2011 revised GIRM as an appendix in the back of the book) state that:

In practice, the need to avoid obscuring the role of the priest and the deacon as the ordinary ministers of Holy Communion by an excessive use of extraordinary minister might in some circumstances constitute a reason either for limiting the distribution of Holy Communion under both species or for using intinction instead of distributing the Precious Blood from the chalice.

The proper mode for distribution by intinction is for the priest to do this.

 

[TheMc]

In an ideal world you’d be correct. But some people can be rather touchy about arranging their weekend schedules to be free to serve at a particular Mass only to be “waved off” at the last minute. I wouldn’t blame a pastor for sitting down on a one time occasion to show respect for those who make time in their busy schedules to serve at Mass.

While I know many EMHCs who would be understanding about being “waved off” due to last minute circumstances I also know that they wouldn’t be “overjoyed.”

Whats more important: respect for peoples egos, or respect for the Sacred Species?

Do EMHC`s do it to help the priest, or because it gives them a kick?

My thoughts exactly, Fink.

 

[ibo]

The sad thing is that abuses are not trivial when it comes to the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. If we cannot be faithful in small matters, how can we be trusted in greater ones?

abuses in masses? never heard of it, anyhow i am not from the USA.

 

[TheMc]

While I know many EMHCs who would be understanding about being “waved off” due to last minute circumstances I also know that they wouldn’t be “overjoyed.”

If that is true, they are doing it for the wrong reason. They ONLY reason they are assisting in the first places is because we don’t have enough clergy. They should be overjoyed if they are not needed.

 

[Love_Divine]

Even the Norms for the Distribution of Holy Communion in the United States (which is now included in the 2011 revised GIRM as an appendix in the back of the book) state that:

The proper mode for distribution by intinction is for the priest to do this.

Hmm, the most efficient means for a priest to single-handed distribute communion would be kneeling at an communion/altar rail. This plus intinction would solve the majority of communion problems, save for sacrilige communion reception.

 

[John_Lilburne]

Some thoughts here:

1.) An extraordinary minister of Holy Communion is not a person, it is not a title, it is not an office. It is a duty that can be performed by a lay person at Mass should there be, in the judgement of the celebrant, an insufficient number of ordained ministers to distribute.
…

From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:
“1672 Certain blessings have a lasting importance because they consecrate persons to God, or reserve objects and places for liturgical use. Among those blessings which are intended for persons - not to be confused with sacramental ordination - are the blessing of the abbot or abbess of a monastery, the consecration of virgins, the rite of religious profession and the blessing of certain ministries of the Church (readers, acolytes, catechists, etc.). the dedication or blessing of a church or an altar, the blessing of holy oils, vessels, and vestments, bells, etc., can be mentioned as examples of blessings that concern objects.”

Paul VI began his1972 Motu Proprio Ministeria Quaedam:
"Certain ministries were established by the Church even in the most ancient times for the purpose of suitably giving worship to God and for offering service to the people of God according to their needs. By these ministries, the offices to be carried out in the liturgy and the practice of charity, deemed suitable to varying circumstances, were entrusted to the faithful. The conferring of these functions often took place by a special rite, in which, after God’s blessing had been implored, a Christian was established in a special class or rank for the fulfillment of some ecclesiastical function.

Some of these functions, which were more closely connected with the liturgical celebration, slowly came to be considered as a training in preparation for the reception of sacred orders. As a result, the offices of porter, reader, exorcist, and acolyte were called minor orders in the Latin Church in relation to the subdiaconate, diaconate, and priesthood, which were called major orders. Generally, though not every where, these minor orders were reserved to those who received them as steps toward the priesthood.

Nevertheless, since the minor orders have not always been the same and many functions connected with them, as at present, have also been exercised by the laity, it seems fitting to reexamine this practice and to adapt it to contemporary needs."

A person becomes an Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion with varying degrees of permanence. It can be for one occasion. It can be for a set period of time. It the case of an instituted acolyte there is not time limit. Each method has a different liturgical ceremony associated with it.

 

[Brendan]

Hmm, the most efficient means for a priest to single-handed distribute communion would be kneeling at an communion/altar rail. This plus intinction would solve the majority of communion problems, save for sacrilige communion reception.

That is exactly how our parish does it, kneeling at the communion rail at an OF Mass

We have 950+ families and communion is distributed with either our pastor and the deacon, or our pastor and a Chaldean Subdeacon that is in our parish.

The Subdeacon is an EMHC though

We are getting a associate pastor soon too, so that can only help. Then we will have intinction in all the lines

 

[Love_Divine]

That is exactly how our parish does it, kneeling at the communion rail at an OF Mass

We have 950+ families and communion is distributed with either our pastor and the deacon, or our pastor and a Chaldean Subdeacon that is in our parish.

The Subdeacon is an EMHC though

We are getting a associate pastor soon too, so that can only help. Then we will have intinction in all the lines

Wow, my current parish has about 100-150 people on Sundays and on Sunday I counted 11 EMHCs, while there was also the priest and deacon. They don’t even all fit in the sanctuary!

 

[Mrs_Sally]

Wow, my current parish has about 100-150 people on Sundays and on Sunday I counted 11 EMHCs, while there was also the priest and deacon. They don’t even all fit in the sanctuary!

We have 5000+ FAMILIES and six masses. Even with 3 priests assigned to our parish, we use EMHCs at every Sunday Mass in order to get through communion in a reasonable amount of time.

EMHCs are scheduled (usually 4 per Mass=24 per Sunday), but are trained to take note of the number of ciboria and the number of clergy. Then they either step back if they are not needed, or additional people come up as necessary if they are at that Mass. No one is “waved off” because we can all count.

Our pastor invites people to take this role and we receive training from the diocese and the parish. The role is taken very seriously and there is a time limit for how long someone can serve. Since our parish also takes care of a nursing home and retirement community, we have quite a need for people to take communion to the sick. We have about 20 people who do that, many of whom do not also assist at Mass.

Helping to distribute communion is an important role, even in suburban parishes like mine with more than one priest. It is a privilege and a blessing, something that each EMHC should approach with humility and not pride.

 

[Edward_H]

Could I ask your opinions about the Indiscriminate, needless use of Extraordinary Ministers which appears to go directly against Rome.

I recently attended a Mass at a small urban church with a small congregation.
Two priests officiated at the Mass.
The celebrant took no part in the distribution of Holy Communion.
The other priest distributed Holy Communion with the assistance of four EMs, all female.

Extraordinary surely means means non-customary ie used only if the situation demands it.

A lot of churches, nowadays, have an all-pervasive matriarchal predominance in the parish council, its officers and church organisations.

Could it be that this abuse have evolved as part of a sop to female catholics who seem to be in the majority in the EM ranks.

We have 22 at our 1030 Sunday Mass.

 

[Like]

Please,. the use of Echaristic Ministers is completely VALID.

They go for training for this.

The time they use Eucharistic Ministers if the liturgy is crowded; however,l it is invalid if the priest sits during thew EUcharist, unless he is ill, but he still has to give out the Eucharist just as the ministers

Jim, You are absolutely right as The Eucharistic Minister(s) is/are completely VALID,
BECAUSE they are a ORDAINED PRIEST!!!

Every parish I have been to here makes up MONTHLY schedulers for EMHC’s for every Mass & I have never seen one who was scheduled waved off. In fact if you failed to show up when scheduled without arraigning for a substitute you will be suspended for a month clapping

We usually attend Sunday evening Mass where there are about 50 to 70 attending (depending on tourist) with a priest and 7 EMHC’s (3 for the Host & 4 for distributing the Blood)! And sometimes with a Deacon thrown in. SAD!

 

[Jim_Roberts]

I received by information from a Catholic seminary: The Pontifical Josephinum Seminary,
COlumbus, Oh

 

[benedictgal]

I received by information from a Catholic seminary: The Pontifical Josephinum Seminary,
COlumbus, Oh

The information might be outdated, as the terminology has changed since 1997, with the promulgation of Ecclesia de Mysterio:

1. The non-ordained faithful may be generically designated “extraordinary ministers” when deputed by competent authority to discharge, solely by way of supply, those offices mentioned in Canon 230, 3(56) and in Canons 943 and 1112. Naturally, the concrete term may be applied to those to whom functions are canonically entrusted e.g. catechists, acolytes, lectors etc. Temporary deputation for liturgical purposes – mentioned in Canon 230, 2 – does not confer any special or permanent title on the non-ordained faithful.(57)

Here is the reference to EMHC:

The Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion
The non-ordained faithful already collaborate with the sacred ministers in diverse pastoral situations since “This wonderful gift of the Eucharist, which is the greatest gift of all, demands that such an important mystery should be increasingly better known and its saving power more fully shared”.(95)

Such liturgical service is a response to the objective needs of the faithful especially those of the sick and to those liturgical assemblies in which there are particularly large numbers of the faithful who wish to receive Holy Communion.

1. The canonical discipline concerning extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion must be correctly applied so as to avoid generating confusion. The same discipline establishes that the ordinary minister of Holy Communion is the Bishop, the Priest and the the Deacon.(96) Extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion are those instituted as acolytes and the faithful so deputed in accordance with Canon 230, 3.(97)

A non-ordained member of the faithful, in cases of true necessity, may be deputed by the diocesan bishop, using the appropriate form of blessing for these situations, to act as an extraordinary minister to distribute Holy Communion outside of liturgical celebrations ad actum vel ad tempus (acting or temporarily appointed) or for a more stable period. In exceptional cases or in unforeseen circumstances, the priest presiding at the liturgy may authorize such ad actum.(98)

1. Extraordinary ministers may distribute Holy Communion at eucharistic celebrations only when there are no ordained ministers present or when those ordained ministers present at a liturgical celebration are truly unable to distribute Holy Communion.(99) They may also exercise this function at eucharistic celebrations where there are particularly large numbers of the faithful and which would be excessively prolonged because of an insufficient number of ordained ministers to distribute Holy Communion. (100)

This function is supplementary and extraordinary (101) and must be exercised in accordance with the norm of law. It is thus useful for the diocesan bishop to issue particular norms concerning extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion which, in complete harmony with the universal law of the Church, should regulate the exercise of this function in his diocese. Such norms should provide, amongst other things, for matters such as the instruction in eucharistic doctrine of those chosen to be extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion, the meaning of the service they provide, the rubrics to be observed, the reverence to be shown for such an august Sacrament and instruction concerning the discipline on admission to Holy Communion.

To avoid creating confusion, certain practices are to be avoided and eliminated where such have emerged in particular Churches:

extraordinary ministers receiving Holy Communion apart from the other faithful as though concelebrants;
association with the renewal of promises made by priests at the Chrism Mass on Holy Thursday, as well as other categories of faithful who renew religious vows or receive a mandate as extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion;
the habitual use of extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion at Mass thus arbitrarily extending the concept of “a great number of the faithful”.

If any of this looks familiar, it’s because it is virtually the same language found in Redemptionis Sacramentum, promulgated seven years later.

 

[hudson]

I had a thread about this happening during the Mass this past weekend. There was a summer camp ending and the Priest handed the Body and Blood over to the kids to distribute while he sat down. This Priest is probably in his 50s and more then able to distribute just fine. There were multiple other abuses that happened during this Mass that made me mentally sin therefore I didn’t receive.

 

[Love_Divine]

The information might be outdated, as the terminology has changed since 1997, with the promulgation of Ecclesia de Mysterio:

Here is the reference to EMHC:

If any of this looks familiar, it’s because it is virtually the same language found in Redemptionis Sacramentum, promulgated seven years later.

I posted that somewhere in a condensed version. It even says the habitual use of EMHCs on Sundays needs to cease. Could it not be any clearer?

 

[benedictgal]

I posted that somewhere in a condensed version. It even says the habitual use of EMHCs on Sundays needs to cease. Could it not be any clearer?

The reason why I posted this in its entirety is because Ecclesia de Mysterio does use titles. In fact, it refers to the EMHC in the plural.

 

[TheMc]

I posted that somewhere in a condensed version. It even says the habitual use of EMHCs on Sundays needs to cease. Could it not be any clearer?

Ohh! Could you possibly find that and post it?

 

[lifequest]

Hello once again,

Please forgive me for saying this but I feel that in jumping out of the frying pan (C of E) to avoid the impending fire (Chaos), I find that I might be in another frying pan doing my utmost to avoid the same fate.

Please God that this isn’t the case.

I beg you you, all, not to go the way of the Church of England.