Faith and Free Will

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Dimmesdale

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Hello. The following is my sincere appraisal of how I cannot believe in Christianity or Catholicism. I welcome Catholic responses and even prayers, as I would LIKE to believe even if I find it hard or even impossible to… I still believe in God, but I don’t know the Truth. I want to be guided INTO the truth, whatever it is… so again, I welcome prayers and good intentions.

The bottom line: I don’t believe in Christianity, and I CANNOT believe it; I DO NOT have the freedom TO believe it, whether you think I do or not.

I have a friend who really, truly believes I can CHOOSE to believe in Christianity. Well, guess what, I can’t. I’ve tried numerous times to believe in the Bible and I’ve failed everytime - the longest I ever believed was for a couple of weeks. I just couldn’t believe in it any longer. I did not “walk away” from the faith intentionally; or if I did, I couldn’t help doing what I did; it just happened.

I want to know truth. Maybe by an act of grace God could change my heart. I do not feel it is within my power to believe. But maybe God could help? I welcome prayers, again…

P.S., maybe this is the wrong subforum? Maybe in prayer intentions…
 
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I think you are conflating lack of (so far) convincing evidence with an absolute inability to believe.

Be patient
 
Sigh, I should probably expand on what I’ve written…

Really it seems like it’s a whole matrix of things that’s an obstacle to belief… Part of its also moral and psychological consideration, such as thinking I’m too bad a person to go to heaven, and hence running away from/denying Christianity as true even though a part of me thinks its real… some of the time.

I also am influenced by other things, and evidence also factors in. For instance, just a few days ago I was reading through the genaeologies of genesis (where they live hundreds of years) and I just say to myself “this is nonsense.” It’s hard to accept the whole Christian story when ONE thing seems to invalidate it as a whole…

I’m also attracted to Eastern mysticism/pantheism, and that’s a whole different type of temptation which seems to override Christian belief. So… I don’t know what’s true. But I want to become established in the truth. - and experience ACTUAL PEACE, which I believe is an indispensable attribute of the Truth.
 
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I actually feel 100% certain there is a God, so I’m not agnostic about that. I am a theist. But I am agnostic with regard to Christianity and other religions, I suppose. At least, many of the particulars.
 
It seems that can grasp the transcendent - that which goes beyond this life - and that is good. A question which you need not answer: Do you suffer from any form of anxiety, OCD or scrupulosity?

If so, this can be a barrier to belief.
 
“A question which you need not answer: Do you suffer from any form of anxiety, OCD or scrupulosity?”

As a matter of fact I do have a history of mental illness. So that’s probably at play as well. As for scrupulosity, I DO try to “do the right thing” and this has extended into more minute details I suppose (hand washing). I don’t think I’m THAT obsessed though. At least I don’t think I’m unreasonable.
 
Dan_Defender said:
You can tell yourself this all you want, but the fact is you are choosing your path. It is an act of the will. Instead, open your heart and pray.
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I honestly don’t know what to say. I really, truly, sincerely do not feel I am in control of this. Maybe I resisted God and had free will at some point in the past. But now it seems like my mind is set in unbelief. I am open to being proved wrong, but, what can I say? (or do?).
 
If you have a diagnosis and are in treatment, then be patient and allow the treatment to help. God knows what you are made of and knows your struggle to believe. That alone is comforting, I would think.
 
I was an unbeliever back in the day. I wondered, if God did these fabulous things in the bible, where has he been? Why is he hiding?

Then somehow I got the book book of the story of Fatima. That was my game changer.

I hope there’s a day coming soon when the light bulb comes on.
We could use your help, to be an impact for good in this world.
 
po18guy said:
If you have a diagnosis and are in treatment, then be patient and allow the treatment to help. God knows what you are made of and knows your struggle to believe. That alone is comforting, I would think.
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I am taking medication and seeing a therapist, but there’s only so much that can be done. I’ve been in treatment for years and most meds haven’t had much effect on me. I still hold out hope and try my best to trust that God is good and that I’ll attain him. I’ve learned to say no to despair, so that is something!
 
Dimmesdale said:
Hello. The following is my sincere appraisal of how I cannot believe in Christianity or Catholicism. I welcome Catholic responses and even prayers, as I would LIKE to believe even if I find it hard or even impossible to… I still believe in God, but I don’t know the Truth. I want to be guided INTO the truth, whatever it is… so again, I welcome prayers and good intentions.

The bottom line: I don’t believe in Christianity, and I CANNOT believe it; I DO NOT have the freedom TO believe it, whether you think I do or not.

I have a friend who really, truly believes I can CHOOSE to believe in Christianity. Well, guess what, I can’t. I’ve tried numerous times to believe in the Bible and I’ve failed everytime - the longest I ever believed was for a couple of weeks. I just couldn’t believe in it any longer. I did not “walk away” from the faith intentionally; or if I did, I couldn’t help doing what I did; it just happened.

I want to know truth. Maybe by an act of grace God could change my heart. I do not feel it is within my power to believe. But maybe God could help? I welcome prayers, again…

P.S., maybe this is the wrong subforum? Maybe in prayer intentions…
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God gives the initial grace necessary for conversion. What is impossible for man is possible with God. From the Catechism:
153 When St. Peter confessed that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God, Jesus declared to him that this revelation did not come “from flesh and blood”, but from “my Father who is in heaven”.24 Faith is a gift of God, a supernatural virtue infused by him . "Before this faith can be exercised, man must have the grace of God to move and assist him; he must have the interior helps of the Holy Spirit, who moves the heart and converts it to God, who opens the eyes of the mind and ‘makes it easy for all to accept and believe the truth.’"25

154 Believing is possible only by grace and the interior helps of the Holy Spirit. But it is no less true that believing is an authentically human act. Trusting in God and cleaving to the truths he has revealed is contrary neither to human freedom nor to human reason. Even in human relations it is not contrary to our dignity to believe what other persons tell us about themselves and their intentions, or to trust their promises (for example, when a man and a woman marry) to share a communion of life with one another. If this is so, still less is it contrary to our dignity to “yield by faith the full submission of. . . intellect and will to God who reveals”,26 and to share in an interior communion with him.
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To find the truth you must seek it. Faith is one of the theological virtues that we recieve from God. The other two are Hope and Love. We can accept them or not because of Free will. The right to choose. Not what we want but to choose God above everything else. Jesus does not want to force anyone to know him, love him or serve him. He wants us to choose him out of our own free will. Jesus says "I am the way, the truth and the life. No one goes to the Father except through me. Christianity is the religion of Love. Not because of us Christians but because of Jesus. It is not easy to have faith, to believe or to know the truth. The world that we live in distracts us with temptations, lies and things of the world. Only God can change your heart but it is a choice to allow Him. Blessing with your search.
 
Dimmesdale said:
I’ve tried numerous times to believe in the Bible and I’ve failed everytime
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I’ve tried, numerous times, to bake impressive cakes. I’ve failed every time.

Here’s the thing, though: that doesn’t mean that I cannot do it, or that I don’t have the freedom to do it. I just need to keep trying.

So, I think you’re being overly pessimistic about your prospects. Sure, you haven’t yet done it; that doesn’t mean you cannot.
Dimmesdale said:
Part of its also moral and psychological consideration, such as thinking I’m too bad a person to go to heaven
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I remember reading a book, decades ago, that included the aphorism “argue long enough for your limitations and, sure enough, they’re yours!”

You’ve said that you’ve tried to believe in the Bible, and I don’t know why that’s a stumbling block for you, but let me point to a narrative from the Bible: the Good Thief. Literally, as he was dying on his cross, for his sins, he turned to Jesus, and Jesus assured him that he would go to heaven. Are you saying you’re worse than a condemned murderer who is being executed for his crimes?
Dimmesdale said:
For instance, just a few days ago I was reading through the genaeologies of genesis (where they live hundreds of years) and I just say to myself “this is nonsense.”
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Good for you!

Let me ask you: does the Catholic Church assert that this is a literal, historical narrative? If not – if it’s a different genre of literature – then it would be nonsense to accept it as if it were the TV evening news, right? And yet, there could be truth there, no?
Dimmesdale said:
Maybe I resisted God and had free will at some point in the past. But now it seems like my mind is set in unbelief. I am open to being proved wrong
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You’re continuing to ask the question, aren’t you? Doesn’t that mean that, in your free will, you’re continuing to approach free will decisions? And therefore… you’re not sunk!
Dimmesdale said:
I still hold out hope and try my best to trust that God is good and that I’ll attain him. I’ve learned to say no to despair
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Congratulations! That’s a critical part of being a Christian!!!
 
You are in my prayers. I would suggest just reading the Gospels. Matthew , Mark , Luke and John. They are about the life of Jesus and His Ministry.

The Old Testament can be hard going and there are a lot of subtle nuances in it from a Jewish perspective. The first 11 Chapters of Genesis we are not bound to believe as this is what actually happened. The historical Old Testament begins with Abraham and his story in Genesis. This is the story of the Tribes of Israel and also Abraham is our adopted Spiritual father too , given we are Christians. Being Christian simply means we believe Jesus Christ lived on earth and died on the Cross for us and was Resurrected.

Do you believe in the Trinity?
 
You say you are a theist, so you do have the capacity for a rudimentary faith. How do you know there is a God? You certainly cannot strictly prove or disprove it. How did you get to that point?

If you’re looking for a reasonable explanation, I would read Mere Christianity or The Case for Christ. They may not entirely convince you, but they will definitely give you a lot to think about. If you’re familiar with how philosophical proofs work, you might try Thomas Aquinas, but he’s over a lot of people’s heads, including mine, but parts if his writing have been helpful to me at times.

As far as not being good enough, I say this gently, but this is a form of pride. You have made your sin too big and God too small. If you knew the depth and scope of God’s mercy and his capacity of forgiveness, you would laugh at such a statement.

These things take time. If you are sincerely seeking truth, and continue to ask for faith, God will give it to you. Are you praying? Are you specifically and sincerely asking God to lead you to truth and faith? I guarantee He will answer that prayer, for He desires all to come to Him, so you are praying according to His will.

ETA: This Bible passage may help a little. Both the disciples and the man’s father lacked faith, so you’re in good company.
 
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Dimmesdale said:
I want to know truth.
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Then love your fellow man as if he or she is your self…

And never compromise truth within your own soul…

Know you will suffer catastrophic loss…

And pray as to someone who loves and knows you intimately…

Pray each night going to sleep…

And each morning as you arise…

“O Lord of all, have mercy on me…
Yea O Lord, in Whom I do not believe…
In Whom I cannot believe…
Help me the sinner to believe in You…”

Remember your wretchedness…
And the brevity of this life…
Pray your self to sleep each night…
Praying over and over and over:

“O Lord Jesus Christ…
Son of God…
Have Mercy on me…
The sinner…”

Pray with tears…
Pray with compunction…
Pray with all your doubts…
Pray in your poverty…

Make this your way of life…

God will hear your prayer…
He will not ignore your prayer…
Pay attention to events…
His answers are in them…

God Bless your journey…
The God -Quest is worthy…
You were born for it…
Weep but do not despair…

God IS the Truth…
Be seeking Him…

geo
 
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Lucy_1 said:
You say you are a theist, so you do have the capacity for a rudimentary faith. How do you know there is a God? You certainly cannot strictly prove or disprove it. How did you get to that point?
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I have had a number of experiences which validate the existence of a higher order of being than just the material world. I actually had a number of visions. One was of two orbs set in the sky - which I took very naturally to imply God and something like the Father and Son. I don’t believe it was a hallucination - it seemed too solid and definite and not chaotic and ephemeral. I’ve had other validating experiences like that, including an after-death communication from a celebrity… I won’t bother going too much more into depth, but it’s a settled issue for me that there is A God. Again though, regarding the particulars I am not sure.
Lucy_1 said:
If you’re looking for a reasonable explanation, I would read Mere Christianity or The Case for Christ. They may not entirely convince you, but they will definitely give you a lot to think about. If you’re familiar with how philosophical proofs work, you might try Thomas Aquinas, but he’s over a lot of people’s heads, including mine, but parts if his writing have been helpful to me at times.
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A lot of that stuff goes over my head too to tell you the truth… or perhaps I just am not all that interested and my mind drifts/has a short attention span… At any rate, with philosophical discussion you can go on and on and never arrive at anything definite it seems. There are always objections/counterarguments it seems, and it never ends. That has been my experience in the past.
Lucy_1 said:
As far as not being good enough, I say this gently, but this is a form of pride. You have made your sin too big and God too small. If you knew the depth and scope of God’s mercy and his capacity of forgiveness, you would laugh at such a statement.
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But even the Catholic tradition believes that some people with very hardened hearts like mine can fail to be saved - that it gets progressively more difficult the more you are mired in sin? I believe I am a very great sinner, but I don’t want to go into the particulars. I do believe God is merciful though. But the thought recurs that I’ve said no to God with such anger and willfulness that I can’t untie the knot I’ve made for myself.
Lucy_1 said:
These things take time. If you are sincerely seeking truth, and continue to ask for faith, God will give it to you. Are you praying? Are you specifically and sincerely asking God to lead you to truth and faith? I guarantee He will answer that prayer, for He desires all to come to Him, so you are praying according to His will.
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I do pray sometimes. I doubt my own sincerity sometimes. This is because I have very blunted emotions. It’s hard for me to feeling genuine contrition or sorrow. I know it’s not all about emotion. But how else do I guage my sincerity? Is it just “will”? What does that mean and is it worth anything on its own with nothing to back it up?
 
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