FAO: Orthodox

[StMarina303ad]

Thanks. I had never seen that.

I did find it interesting that you cut the article off before this sentence.

The entire article was too long. I tried to just get the part about the kissing of the feet.

This says to me that it is more about him representing Jesus than him being over anyone…So that makes it okay for a brother Bishop, the Pope of Rome, to demand this from his equal brothers, Bishops of other parts of the Church to kiss his feet, because once upon a time a repentant woman kissed Jesus’? First the Orthodox Bishops had nothing to repent of. Second, she did it out of love for Jesus who is God. Jesus certainly did not “Force” her to.

 

[ralphinal]

The article you posted never said anything about anyone ever being FORCED to do it. Now, I am not saying that your story did not happen. However, while you did prove that this was accepted, you did not show that anyone was ever forced to do so, bishop or otherwise.

Besides, who is to say that someone cannot love the pope?

 

[Genesis315]

StMarina, you’re usually promoting the whole “primacy of honor” idea. So you shouldn’t be surprised if the Pope of Rome was given more accentuated acts of honor.

 

[Peter_J]

For a while, the normal way to show respect to the Pope of Rome when being introduced, was for the person to kiss the Pope’s feet. Some Orthodox Bishops (possibly Patriarchs) went to a visit to Rome and were shocked that the Pope demanded them to kiss his feet - they obviously refused to kiss the Pope’s feet because they were all equal brother Bishops. Caused quite a scandle. The Pope refused to speak with them for failing to kiss his feet. Being a Bishop is to serve the flock, not to have the flock serve the Bishop. No one should be treated inhumanly.

I don’t know if this is what you’re referring to, but something like that certainly happened at the Council of Florence.

… This was the first verbal request by a pope for pardon from the Orthodox. Paul VI, however, had delivered a de facto apology on Dec. 14, 1975, when he kissed the feet of a delegate from the patriarch of Constantinople in the Sistine Chapel. It was Paul VI’s way of apologizing for the arrogance of a predecessor, Pope Eugene IV, who in 1437 at the Council of Florence, had forced the Orthodox patriarch to kiss his feet in an act of submission.

findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1141/is_/ai_75247906

(I believe that’s slightly inaccurate, actually. If memory servers, Pope Eugene initially demanded that the Patriarch kiss his feet, but eventually relented when the Patriarch refused.)

Somehow requiring someone to kiss your feet rubs me the wrong way since Jesus said that the humble will be exalted and the exalted will be humbled.

I will be happy to show a sign of respect for a bishop or patriarch of a heretical church as I would show respect for every human being created in the Image and Likeness of our Triune God, but I will not show any sign of submission of authority to someone who has no authority over me. Kissing someone’s hand or ring, in my opinion, is showing someone that they have authority over you. I’d never do that. Because that action would be a lie. The Pope of Rome does not have authority over me, but each Sunday (& feast day) I kiss my priest’s hand because he does have authority over me, as does my spiritual father, my Bishop, my Archbishop and my Patriarch (who happens to be the Ecumenical Patriarch) - I’d have no problem kissing any of their hands.

I think I sympathize with what you are saying here.

It’s a lot like asking the Orthodox to call us “the Catholic Church”: I’d be extremely happy if you called us “the Catholic Church” and meant it, but for you to simply call us “the Catholic Church” as a sort of ecumenical or PC gesture without meaning it … well, you know.

 

[Peter_J]

(I believe that’s slightly inaccurate, actually. If memory servers, Pope Eugene initially demanded that the Patriarch kiss his feet, but eventually relented when the Patriarch refused.)

P.S. I remember now where I read that:

The Council itself was really doomed from the very start. As soon as the Orthodox delegates arrived, they were greeted with a demand by Pope Eugene IV: the Patriarch of Constantinople had to get down on his knees and kiss the feet of the pope. This outraged the Orthodox Patriarch, who refused to comply. After a tense standoff Pope Eugene eventually relented, but from that point on things were sour.

east2west.org/ecumenism.htm#reunion

 

[Mickey]

Kissing someone’s hand or ring, in my opinion, is showing someone that they have authority over you. I’d never do that. Because that action would be a lie. The Pope of Rome does not have authority over me, but each Sunday (& feast day) I kiss my priest’s hand because he does have authority over me, as does my spiritual father, my Bishop, my Archbishop and my Patriarch (who happens to be the Ecumenical Patriarch) - I’d have no problem kissing any of their hands.

Ditto.