Fast this Friday Dec. 27

[felsguy]

I am equally certain that 100% of the people currently in Hell were not seriously expecting to end up there.

Who’s to say.

Nonetheless, I am certain that erroneous opinion is sometimes presented here as fact.

 

[jmcrae]

Who’s to say.

Nonetheless, I am certain that erroneous opinion is sometimes presented here as fact.

When in doubt, do more good, rather than less. And what I am presenting is “fact” for 95% of Catholics. Only 5% of Catholics live in the United States, meaning that the American rules are not “the norm” for most people.

 

[felsguy]

Better to accidentally end up in Heaven than accidentally end up in Hell.

Nonetheless, I am certain that erroneous opinion is sometimes presented here as fact.

When in doubt, do more good, rather than less. And what I am presenting is “fact” for 95% of Catholics. Only 5% of Catholics live in the United States, meaning that the American rules are not “the norm” for most people.

That may well be, but what I’m “quibbling” over is your implication that someone could accidentally end up in hell.

I’ll just leave it at that.

 

[John_Lazarus]

Someone set me straight here please…

I thought “solemn feasts” trumped fasting and abstinence?

 

[paperwight66]

This is a disciplinary matter, subject to the Local Ordinary of any country - in fact, the UK has reinstated Friday abstinence a couple of years ago. They may not eat meat on any Friday throughout the year.

Well, with exceptions. For instance, over Christmas-tide meat can be eaten on Fridays.

And, of course, eating meat on any Friday in the UK is not a matter of mortal sin - that was made clear at the time in the Briefing Notes put out with the Press release.

A local parish had a Hotpot Supper one Friday last year, attended by the clergy.

 

[Sirach2]

Well, with exceptions. For instance, over Christmas-tide meat can be eaten on Fridays.

And, of course, eating meat on any Friday in the UK is not a matter of mortal sin - that was made clear at the time in the Briefing Notes put out with the Press release.

A local parish had a Hotpot Supper one Friday last year, attended by the clergy.

 

[JM3]

We need to be careful not to misinform the faithful who read these posts. The Church upholds that Fridays are days of penance, and encourages all to voluntarily enter into the spirit of penance. However, there is NO obligation binding under pain of sin if one does not do penance.

Can. 1249 The divine law binds all the Christian faithful to do penance each in his or her own way.

Divine law binds you. This is an obligation. The Church prescribes days for penance. It does not say that you are not obligated to do penance.

 

[Sirach2]

Can. 1249 The divine law binds all the Christian faithful to do penance each in his or her own way.

Divine law binds you. This is an obligation. The Church prescribes days for penance. It does not say that you are not obligated to do penance.

However, as the last poster affirmed, it is not binding under pain of mortal sin. THAT’S the big difference here. Jesus Himself stated that unless we do penance, we will perish. But HOW we do penance is left up to the individual. Most assuredly, it would entail keeping the Commandments, for a start.

 

[JM3]

However, as the last poster affirmed, it is not binding under pain of mortal sin.

You stated ‘under pain of sin’ in your post. Breaking the divine law is a sin. Refusing to do penance is a sin. Divine law does bind you under pain of sin. Whether it is mortal or not is between you and God.

 

[Sirach2]

You stated ‘under pain of sin’ in your post. Breaking the divine law is a sin. Refusing to do penance is a sin. Divine law does bind you under pain of sin. Whether it is mortal or not is between you and God.

Whoa, you leave a lot to the imagination here. When Jesus encouraged us to do penance, it was not said whether it should be daily, weekly, monthly, or on all Fridays. It is left to the individual conscience. It cannot become a sin unless our failure to do penance regularly by keeping His Commandments, etc., results in our perishing.

How on earth would you confess this? Forgive me Father, I have failed to do penance since my last confession. Is this a daily sin, therefore? Define it, please.

 

[AlexV]

I cannot help but think that one contributing factor to the decline of a liturgical sense is the far greater concern one often encounters about whether one can eat a piece of chicken on a particular Friday than over the liturgical calendar, the feasts, what is being celebrated, etc.

The same mentality can be seen in the far greater worry over, “Does this or that Mass ‘count’ for this or that obligation,” than over the liturgical season or feast.

A more balanced and healthy approach to these matters would avoid scrupulosity on one extreme and complete laissez faire at the other, and instead recommend greater immersion in the spirit of the liturgy and less obsession over whether a particular Friday carries an exemption from this or that disciplinary practice.

 

[JM3]

Whoa, you leave a lot to the imagination here. When Jesus encouraged us to do penance, it was not said whether it should be daily, weekly, monthly, or on all Fridays. It is left to the individual conscience. It cannot become a sin unless our failure to do penance regularly by keeping His Commandments, etc., results in our perishing.

How on earth would you confess this? Forgive me Father, I have failed to do penance since my last confession. Is this a daily sin, therefore? Define it, please.

I think you will oppose and ridicule anything I say. Do as you wish, and go roll your eyes at someone else for awhile.

 

[maklavan]

We need to be careful not to misinform the faithful who read these posts. The Church upholds that Fridays are days of penance, and encourages all to voluntarily enter into the spirit of penance. However, there is NO obligation binding under pain of sin if one does not do penance.

Clear as a bell from EWTN:

Abstaining from meat on Friday

Question from on 01-27-2007: Is it true that one must perform a penitential or charitable act on any Friday if one does not abstain from meat?

Answer by Rev. Mark J. Gantley, JCL on 01-28-2007: In the United States, Catholics are obliged to abstain from meat on Fridays during Lent, Ash Wednesday, and Good Friday (along with fasting on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday). There is no provision permitting them to substitute other acts of penance for abstaining for meat on Fridays during Lent. Other Fridays are penitential days and the faithful are encouraged to do acts of penance, but this is not strictly obligatory in the United States.

Kindly note that JCL means he is a canon lawyer.

Catholics in the UK are obliged to fast and abstain on Good Friday and Ash Wednesday. Voluntary abstaining from meat every Friday was suggested some years ago

 

[Sirach2]

Catholics in the UK are obliged to fast and abstain on Good Friday and Ash Wednesday. Voluntary abstaining from meat every Friday was suggested some years ago

Following their May meeting at Leeds the Bishops of England and Wales have announced the re-introduction of abstinence from meat on Friday as an obligatory pentitential act for Catholics. The discipline will re-commense on September 16th, the first anniversary of Pope Benedict’s state visit to the UK.
protectthepope.com/?p=3092

I’m surprised you haven’t heard about this change. It seems clear that it is now obligatory. However, according to Paperwight66’s post, it is not binding under pain of mortal sin. Seems we have conflicting opinions here about the reinstatement.

 

[Irish_Cabbie]

This applies only to certain regions of the United States, keep in mind. Everywhere else, penance is still required on Fridays.

Jmcrae, in which specific regions of the United States are Catholics required to do penance on Fridays? Can you provide a source for the claim that you made above?

 

[paperwight66]

Following their May meeting at Leeds the Bishops of England and Wales have announced the re-introduction of abstinence from meat on Friday as an obligatory pentitential act for Catholics. The discipline will re-commense on September 16th, the first anniversary of Pope Benedict’s state visit to the UK.
protectthepope.com/?p=3092

I’m surprised you haven’t heard about this change. It seems clear that it is now obligatory. However, according to Paperwight66’s post, it is not binding under pain of mortal sin. Seems we have conflicting opinions here about the reinstatement.

I have tried unsuccessfully to copy and paste, so must ask those interested in the situation in the UK to go to the Catholic Bishops of England and Wales website, search for ‘Friday abstinence’ then go to the Q and A section at the end of the Bishops’ statement of 2011.

 

[Sirach2]

I have tried unsuccessfully to copy and paste, so must ask those interested in the situation in the UK to go to the Catholic Bishops of England and Wales website, search for ‘Friday abstinence’ then go to the Q and A section at the end of the Bishops’ statement of 2011.

Wonderful! You are absolutely correct, and I have saved the reference because this is not the first time I have encountered a challenge that denies what the UK bishops have said. The Q&A at the bottom of the Bishops webpage page did confirm that it is not a sin to eat meat, even though the regulation calls for abstinence.

The law of the Church requires Catholics on Fridays to abstain from meat, or some other form of food, or to observe some other form of penance laid down by the Bishops’ Conference. The Bishops have decided to re-establish the practice that this penance should be fulfilled simply by abstaining from meat and by uniting this to prayer. Those who cannot or choose not to eat meat as part of their normal diet should abstain from some other food of which they regularly partake.
This decision will come into effect from Friday 16 September 2011.

Source: catholic-ew.org.uk/Home/News/2011/Friday-Penance/(language)/eng-GB

Therefore, the ‘gravity’ of the obligation does not relate to observing the specific act of penance (abstaining from meat) prescribed by the Conference of Bishops. The ‘gravity’ of the obligation applies to the intention to do penance during the prescribed penitential days and seasons of the Church’s yearxv. **Failure to abstain from **meat on a particular Friday then would not constitute a sin.

 

[jmcrae]

Jmcrae, in which specific regions of the United States are Catholics required to do penance on Fridays? Can you provide a source for the claim that you made above?

Again - check with your local Bishop, and believe him, according to the spirit of St. Ignatius of Antioch.

 

[Irish_Cabbie]

Again - check with your local Bishop, and believe him, according to the spirit of St. Ignatius of Antioch.

Why should I check with my bishop in order to confirm the veracity of claim that you made? You claimed that in some regions of the United States, penance is “required” on Fridays. I am asking you to name one specific region of the US where doing penance on a Friday is “required.” I am asking you to provide a source for the claims that you have made. Why are you unwilling to do that?

 

[jmcrae]

Why should I check with my bishop in order to confirm the veracity of claim that you made? You claimed that in some regions of the United States, penance is “required” on Fridays. I am asking you to name one specific region of the US where doing penance on a Friday is “required.” I am asking you to provide a source for the claims that you have made. Why are you unwilling to do that?

I am simply making a general statement. Each Diocese has its own Bishop. Each Bishop has his own interpretation of the canons on fasting and penance. Each Bishop is also in charge of his own Diocese and has authority over the people in it.

Therefore, not every American Bishop is going to say that the phrase “we urge you to do penance on Fridays” means, “Do whatever you want; we don’t care one way or the other.”

Some may - others might not. Check with your own, and find out for sure what is required in your own Diocese.

Simple enough?