Fast this Friday Dec. 27

[jmcrae]

The Bishops’ Statement in the US uses the language “commend.”

1. Among the works of voluntary self-denial and personal penance which we especially **commend **to our people for the future observance of Friday, even though we hereby terminate the traditional law of abstinence binding under pain of sin, as the sole prescribed means of observing Friday, we give first place to abstinence from flesh meat.We do so in the hope that the Catholic community will ordinarily continue to abstain from meat by free choice [a/k/a “voluntary”] as formerly we did in obedience to Church law. Our expectation is based on the following considerations.

I think it is a noteworthy observation that excessively scrupulous people who find mortal sin on every corner, have a strong tendency to judge everyone else like themselves - a belief that people commit mortal sins regularly.

Judith, please realize the futility and harm you are doing here, as was the case on another thread. You are not the Bishops’ superior, not even a priest, just a simple lay person who intends to bind the faithful to your principles. You live in Canada, and maybe things are different there. But for us in the US, we owe no obedience to your false ideology. Please stop.

Do whatever you feel like doing; I’m not stopping anyone.

I’m just trying to point out that #1 not everyone here is from the United States (the OP doesn’t signify his place of residence) and #2, even in the States, the Bishops still think Friday penance is important. Fine if you don’t want to - even if you live in a country where it’s required, who’s going to know if you don’t? Not me, for sure.

 

[Irish_Cabbie]

This applies only to certain regions of the United States, keep in mind. Everywhere else, penance is still required on Fridays.

This statement is false, Jmcrae, whether you choose to admit as much or not. You should be more careful in what you write, particularly when you are talking about what others are “required” to do.

 

[jmcrae]

This statement is false, Jmcrae, whether you choose to admit as much or not. You should be more careful in what you write, particularly when you are talking about what others are “required” to do.

How is it “false”? “You shall fast and do penance on the days appointed” is the Fourth Precept, is it not?

 

[AlexV]

It is hard to believe this is still going on, yet here we are.

The American bishops have not mandated penance on Friday, 27 December. That’s a simple, straightforward fact that you continue to try to distort and render something very different with the implication it’s a mortal sin to eat meat on such a day.

 

[Sirach2]

It is hard to believe this is still going on, yet here we are.

The American bishops have not mandated penance on Friday, 27 December. That’s a simple, straightforward fact that you continue to try to distort and render something very different with the implication it’s a mortal sin to eat meat on such a day.

It is also true that the UK Bishops have specifically stated that even if a person eats meat on Friday, after they reinstated as an obligation, it is not a mortal sin. I posted the exact statement earlier in this thread. Therefore Judith, in stating other countries are obligated, is not being truthful there, either,but imposing her own mind upon them.

Thomas Casey cautioned us not to follow an agenda poster down their rabbit hole, yet she has managed to suck us into an endless controversy. I’m out.

 

[jmcrae]

It is hard to believe this is still going on, yet here we are.

The American bishops have not mandated penance on Friday, 27 December. That’s a simple, straightforward fact that you continue to try to distort and render something very different with the implication it’s a mortal sin to eat meat on such a day.

They have “urged” it. Means it’s okay to do it. Saying that it’s okay to do it won’t harm anyone.

 

[Irish_Cabbie]

How is it “false”?

You falsely claimed that in certain regions of the United States, the rules on doing penance on Fridays are different than in other regions of the United States. I asked you to name one region in the United States where American Catholics are required to do penance on Fridays. You, of course, couldn’t do that. You couldn’t do that because you what you claimed is false.

 

[JM3]

usccb.org/prayer-and-worship/liturgical-resources/lent/us-bishops-pastoral-statement-on-penance-and-abstinence.cfm

1. Friday itself remains a special day of penitential observance throughout the year, a time when those who seek perfection will be mindful of their personal sins and the sins of mankind which they are called upon to help expiate in union with Christ Crucified.

1. In summary, let it not be said that by this action, implementing the spirit of renewal coming out of the Council, we have abolished Friday, repudiated the holy traditions of our fathers, or diminished the insistence of the Church on the fact of sin and the need for penance.

(Bold is mine)

 

[AlexV]

Neither quote indicates that penitential acts are mandatory on every Friday of the year, let alone that any such practice binds under pain of mortal sin.

 

[JM3]

Neither quote indicates that penitential acts are mandatory on every Friday of the year, let alone that any such practice binds under pain of mortal sin.

1. Accordingly, since the spirit of penance primarily suggests that we discipline ourselves in that which we enjoy most, to many in our day abstinence from meat no longer implies penance, while renunciation of other things would be more penitential.

1. For these and related reasons, the Catholic bishops of the United States, far from downgrading the traditional penitential observance of Friday, and motivated precisely by the desire to give the spirit of penance greater vitality, especially on Fridays, the day that Jesus died, urge our Catholic people henceforth to be guided by the following norms.

1. Friday itself remains a special day of penitential observance throughout the year

Maybe, you should read the whole document.

 

[AlexV]

I have read it. And the fact remains that in the United States, for one place, acts of penance on Friday, 27 December are not required, let alone under pain of mortal sin.

 

[JM3]

I have read it. And the fact remains that in the United States, for one place, acts of penance on Friday, 27 December are not required, let alone under pain of mortal sin.

If you read my previous posts, you will see that divine law does bind you to do penance. The Church prescibes the days of penance. If you choose not to obey, that is your choice. Whether it is mortal or not is between you and God. The Church gives you the criteria to make that judgement.

 

[AlexV]

The Church has indeed spoken. There is no obligation on Catholics in the USA to do penance on Friday, December 27. To do penance on that day, as on any other, is laudable (as ever). But to say it is sinful not to do it is absolutely false.

 

[JM3]

Daily Roman Missal (Roman Missal third edition)

Page 2273

Days of Penance

“Conversion is accomplished in daily life by gestures of reconciliation, concern for the poor, the exercise and defense of justice and right,33 by the admission of faults to one’s brethren, fraternal correction, revision of life, examination of conscience, spiritual direction, acceptance of suffering, endurance of persecution for the sake of righteousness. Taking up one’s cross each day and following Jesus is the surest way of penance.” “The seasons and days of penance in the course of the liturgical year (Lent, and each Friday in memory of the death of the Lord) are intense moments of the Church’s penitential practice.” (CCC 1435, 1438; cf. Lk. 9:23)

All members of the christian faithful are, in their own way, bound to do penance in virtue of divine law. In order that all may be joined in a common observance of penance, penitential days are prescribed in which the christian faithful, in a special way, pray; exercise works of piety and charity; and deny themselves by fulfilling their responsibilities more faithfully, and especially by observing fast and abstinence according to the following:

 The time of Lent and all Fridays of the year are, throughout the universal Church, days and times especailly appropriate for spiritual exercises; penitential liturgies; pilgrimages as signs of penance; voluntary self-denial, such as fasting and almsgiving.  

 Abstinence from meat (or some other food) or another penitential practice, according to the prescriptions of the conference of bishops, is to be observed on each Friday of the year, unless it is a solemnity. Fast and abstinence from meat are to be observed on Ash Wednesday and on Good Friday.

 

[AlexV]

You can post an entire florilegium of out of context quotes from all manner of sources to defend the erroneous position that it is required of Catholics in the USA to perform acts of penance on Friday, 27 December (the point of this thread), but it doesn’t change the clear reality that the bishops of the USA have decided that no such acts are required. They are praiseworthy; they are highly recommended; urged; of immense value. But they do not bind under pain of sin. End of story.

 

[jmcrae]

Thank you, JM3, for the words of common sense.

 

[JM3]

You can post an entire florilegium of out of context quotes from all manner of sources to defend the erroneous position that it is required of Catholics in the USA to perform acts of penance on Friday, 27 December (the point of this thread), but it doesn’t change the clear reality that the bishops of the USA have decided that no such acts are required. They are praiseworthy; they are highly recommended; urged; of immense value. But they do not bind under pain of sin. End of story.

Friday, 27 December 2013, is not a solemnity. Your contention that acts of penance are not required on Friday is not Church teaching and violates divine law. If you choose to ignore divine law, the Code of Canon Law, the USCCB, the CCC and the Roman Missal, then that’s your choice. So, end of story, as you said.

 

[AlexV]

Just to name one of your many inaccuracies, the Missale Romanum does not regulate disciplinary practices of this sort. You quoted from a hand missal for the laity that does not constitute a legislative text.

The American bishops have determined that there is no binding of penitential acts on Fridays outside Lent under pain of mortal sin. You are trying to elevate a praiseworthy devotional practice to the level of requirement under such mortal bind. That is not Church teaching.

 

[JM3]

Just to name one of your many inaccuracies, the Missale Romanum does not regulate disciplinary practices of this sort. You quoted from a hand missal for the laity that does not constitute a legislative text.

The American bishops have determined that there is no binding of penitential acts on Fridays outside Lent under pain of mortal sin. You are trying to elevate a praiseworthy devotional practice to the level of requirement under such mortal bind. That is not Church teaching.

The missal quotes the CCC and Canon Law and I did not say it was a mortal sin. I said, that distinction is between you and God. Perhaps, you should be more accurate in your accusations.

Do you believe that the missal is in error? Do you believe that divine law should be ignored? Do you believe that the Church does not have the authority to prescribe the days of penance or that you can ignore the Church and do as you please?

 

[AlexV]

What is objectively a matter of mortal sin is not between an individual and God, but defined clearly by the Church so the scrupulous don’t have to live in fear.

And the Church has made clear that this question is NOT an objectively sinful matter for the faithful of the (arch)dioceses of the United States.