Fate of the unbaptised infants

[Hesychios]

Can anyone explain to me the positon of the Roman Catholic church on the case of children who die before they can be baptised?

I would presume that this would be the same situation for those born to parents outside of the church, and those who die from miscarriage and abortion.

Thank You,
Michael

 

[SMHW]

Well, this is what is documented in the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

1261 As regards children who have died without Baptism, the Church can only entrust them to the mercy of God, as she does in her funeral rites for them. Indeed, the great mercy of God who desires that all men should be saved, and Jesus’ tenderness toward children which caused him to say: “Let the children come to me, do not hinder them,”[63] allow us to hope that there is a way of salvation for children who have died without Baptism. All the more urgent is the Church’s call not to prevent little children coming to Christ through the gift of holy Baptism.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Hesychios:

Can anyone explain to me the positon of the Roman Catholic church on the case of children who die before they can be baptised?

I would presume that this would be the same situation for those born to parents outside of the church, and those who die from miscarriage and abortion.

Thank You,
Michael

The official position is that we don’t know their fate and no one can say with any certainty where their souls are.

 

[TNT]

Br. Rich SFO:

The official position is that we don’t know their fate and no one can say with any certainty where their souls are.

The church only teaches OBJECTIVELY, not subjectively.
SUBJECTIVELY, we know nothing of the destiny of the unbaptized before the age of reason, as the above quote says.

Objectively, the Creator and Savior of us all simply states that no one enters the kingdom of heaven without being born again of water and the Spirit. Being born in the natural state is not a guarantee of heavenly destiny.
The point that Our Lord said “will not enter the Kingdom of heaven” is also clear that He does not say WHERE they will go. Therefore, it is not for us to know the destiny by any revelation. Since Dogma must be rooted in the teachings of Christ and His Apostles, we will never know their ultimate destiny until we enter eternity. Beyond that (as in the CCC) is pure sentimental speculation.

 

[brotherhrolf]

It’s an intellectual exercise until you have actually “lost” children. My wife miscarried twice. I have the “consolation” of the “limbo” of my youth or I can place my two children in the hands of an all Loving God. This is my biggest beef with the abortionists. Don’t EVER tell me that I didn’t loose two children.

 

[springbreeze]

Dear friends

Since they cannot commit sin they are not seperated from God by their own act of committing sin. Since they are too young to decide their own baptism, then it is presumed they would desire baptism and also their parents would have had them baptised had they lived, therefore they are in Heaven with their Loving and Merciful God the Father, Christ Jesus and the Holy Spirit. God does not create life for it to meet damnation but rather creates life for it to spend life with Him in eternity, such innocent souls as these should be presumed with any reasonable intelligence, to be in Heaven enjoying the Beatific Vision with the Communion of Saints and Angels.

Pray to your children in Heaven to intercede for you and your intentions and tell them you love them.

God Bless you and much love and peace to you

Teresa

 

[itsjustdave1988]

John Paul II, Evangelium Vitae

“I would now like to say a special word to women who have had an abortion.… You will come to understand that nothing is definitively lost and you will also be able to ask forgiveness from your child, who is now living in the Lord”

See more here:
Can infants be sanctified in the womb?

 

[Joe_Kelley]

If my memory holds, Pope John Paul II assked a group of theologians to revisit this question about six months ago. I expect they will have something to say in another year or so.

 

[mpav]

My mother miscarried once, and always told us that one day we would meet our sibling in the afterlife.

 

[TNT]

itsjustdave1988:

John Paul II, Evangelium Vitae

“I would now like to say a special word to women who have had an abortion.… You will come to understand that nothing is definitively lost and you will also be able to ask forgiveness from your child, who is now living in the Lord”

See more here:
Can infants be sanctified in the womb?

For all those who mistakenly believe and preach that this is actually contained in ***Evangelium Vitae ***I urgently request that you read the ACTUAL quote as emphasized by
CUF (Catholcs United for the Faith). This is a good discourse on Limbo, Infants w/out Baptism and the historical teaching of the Catholic Church.

The actual:
in the official Latin text, instead provides as follows:** “You can entrust your infant with hope to the same Father and to His Mercy”** (Infantem autem vestrum potestis Eidem Patri Eiusque misericordiae cum spe committere).

Re the CCC:
We are conceived and born (actually conceived) in a state of sin and separation from God (cf. Catechism, no. 404)
If you want to deny the actual effects of Original sin you can always join the Baptist or Church-of-Christ sects.

 

[TJD]

brotherhrolf, I am sorry for your loss. There is hope that you will meet your children in heaven. Remember with God all things are possible.

Christ’s Peace

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

springbreeze:

Dear friends

Since they cannot commit sin they are not seperated from God by their own act of committing sin. Since they are too young to decide their own baptism, then it is presumed they would desire baptism and also their parents would have had them baptised had they lived, therefore they are in Heaven with their Loving and Merciful God the Father, Christ Jesus and the Holy Spirit. God does not create life for it to meet damnation but rather creates life for it to spend life with Him in eternity, such innocent souls as these should be presumed with any reasonable intelligence, to be in Heaven enjoying the Beatific Vision with the Communion of Saints and Angels.

Pray to your children in Heaven to intercede for you and your intentions and tell them you love them.

God Bless you and much love and peace to you

Teresa

There are three ways of looking at this.

This is what the person believes the Churches teaching is or this is what the person wants the Churches teaching to be or they simply don’t want to accept what the Churches teaching really is so they make up their own version.

 

[itsjustdave1988]

TNT:

For all those who mistakenly believe and preach that this is actually contained in ***Evangelium Vitae ***I urgently request that you read the ACTUAL quote as emphasized by
CUF (Catholcs United for the Faith). This is a good discourse on Limbo, Infants w/out Baptism and the historical teaching of the Catholic Church.

The actual:
in the official Latin text, instead provides as follows:** “You can entrust your infant with hope to the same Father and to His Mercy”** (Infantem autem vestrum potestis Eidem Patri Eiusque misericordiae cum spe committere).

Thank you TNT, for the Latin text.

I too believe that all who die in a state of original sin shall not possess the gift of eternal life, but will instead be separated from the Beatific Vision of God (hell) forever and ever. Eternal life is, afterall, a gratuitous gift which no creature deserves (in the sense of condign merit). I believe in the Catholic understanding of *limbus infantium *(see here: CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Limbo)

Yet, I also believe in St. Bernard’s view that there is a means in which God can extra-sacramentally sanctify infants such that they may not die in original sin, despite the lack of sacramental baptism. This theology is pre-Trent and is in accord with Catholic doctrine, as described in Dr. Ludwig Ott’s pre-Vatican II source on Catholic dogmatic theology. I don’t contend this is automatic, as if God is obliged to sanctify every infant, but I agree that we can have hopeful confidence. This hope can at times be no less certain to me than the hope that John Paul II is with our Heavenly Father. Catholicism rejects the false doctrine of eternal security for those sacramentally baptized or not.

James Likoudis of CUF writes,

The Catholic Church teaches that “God has bound salvation to the Sacrament of Baptism, but He Himself is not bound by His sacraments” (CCC n. 1257). God can make whatever exceptions He wishes as regards unbaptized infants. Perhaps those unborn children killed by abortion in odium fidei (in real hatred of Christ and His teachings) may have the status of martyrs (like the Holy Innocents). It is true that Limbo cannot be taught as certain Catholic doctrine proposed by the Magisterium, but it has not been definitively rejected by the Magisterium either.

 

[Catholic2003]

This is another good example of the development of Church doctrine over time. From the ecumenical council of Basel-Ferrara-Florence (1431-1445):

Also, the souls of those who have incurred no stain of sin whatsoever after baptism, as well as souls who after incurring the stain of sin have been cleansed whether in their bodies or outside their bodies, as was stated above, are straightaway received into heaven and clearly behold the triune God as he is, yet one person more perfectly than another according to the difference of their merits. But the souls of those who depart this life in actual mortal sin, or in original sin alone, go down straightaway to hell to be punished, but with unequal pains. We also define that the holy apostolic see and the Roman pontiff holds the primacy over the whole world and the Roman pontiff is the successor of blessed Peter prince of the apostles, and that he is the true vicar of Christ, the head of the whole church and the father and teacher of all Christians, and to him was committed in blessed Peter the full power of tending, ruling and governing the whole church, as is contained also in the acts of ecumenical councils and in the sacred canons.

…

With regard to children, since the danger of death is often present and the only remedy available to them is the sacrament of baptism by which they are snatched away from the dominion of the devil and adopted as children of God, it admonishes that sacred baptism is not to be deferred for forty or eighty days or any other period of time in accordance with the usage of some people, but it should be conferred as soon as it conveniently can; and if there is imminent danger of death, the child should be baptized straightaway without any delay, even by a lay man or a woman in the form of the church, if there is no priest, as is contained more fully in the decree on the Armenians.

Now we realize that God is not limited by the actions of man, and that God, if He chooses, can impart the sacramental grace of baptism to forgive original sin even when mortal men fail to perform the actual baptismal ritual.

 

[TJD]

CCC 1261 tells us that hope remains for children who have died without Baptism. That hope is based on God’s Mercy and Jesus’ love and tenderness. Unfortunately, the Church itself can only offer kind words.

CCC1260 actually seems to imply that hope also exist for the good person who through ignorance does not know Christ.

I also base my hope for the unbaptized on my understanding that Moses and Elijah are in heaven, as are those fortunate saints who were raised on Good Friday.

Remember what is impossible for human beings is possible for God.

Christ’s Peace,

 

[streetcar]

My brother died when he was only 4 days old - I’d like to think he is in heaven.