Fatima 3rd Secret

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Since Fatima has the church’s stamp of approved Marian apparitions can someone explain to me why the 3rd secret is still a secret? Has the church given a valid reason why they have delayed in its release since Our Lady requested its release in 1960? I heard reasons given include masons in the vatican to Pope Benedict XVI does not believe in Fatima? Any insight would be appreciated…Also…one more thing on the topic of Marian apparitions: I know its not allowed to promote unapproved apparitions on this forum but I don’t think my next question would violate the rules: I believe we aren’t allowed to discuss unapproved apparitions because they could be from the demonic, correct? How could satan be behind the apparitions that aren’t approved if the messages speak of repentence, sacrifice to The One Triune God, prayer, conversion, ect? I was always under the impression satan and his minions hate our Blessed Mother and her office of reconciling mankind to her Son. The messeges that come from some of the more popular unapproved apparitions seem to contradict what satan would be after. If this question is not allowed to be answered my apologies, just know I am not promoting anything, just looking for a little insight, thank you.
If the dead could come to life again, what would they not do for eternal life? And I - What am I doing? ~ St. Camillus de Lellis, C.
 
jackson3997 said:
Since Fatima has the church’s stamp of approved Marian apparitions can someone explain to me why the 3rd secret is still a secret? Has the church given a valid reason why they have delayed in its release since Our Lady requested its release in 1960? I heard reasons given include masons in the vatican to Pope Benedict XVI does not believe in Fatima? Any insight would be appreciated…Also…one more thing on the topic of Marian apparitions: I know its not allowed to promote unapproved apparitions on this forum but I don’t think my next question would violate the rules: I believe we aren’t allowed to discuss unapproved apparitions because they could be from the demonic, correct? How could satan be behind the apparitions that aren’t approved if the messages speak of repentence, sacrifice to The One Triune God, prayer, conversion, ect? I was always under the impression satan and his minions hate our Blessed Mother and her office of reconciling mankind to her Son. The messeges that come from some of the more popular unapproved apparitions seem to contradict what satan would be after. If this question is not allowed to be answered my apologies, just know I am not promoting anything, just looking for a little insight, thank you.
If the dead could come to life again, what would they not do for eternal life? And I - What am I doing? ~ St. Camillus de Lellis, C.
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First and foremost, I never read your thread all the way. However, I highly recommend this book to you and to anyone who doesn’t understand The Third Secret or any of The Secrets of Fatima

" John Paul II the Pope who understood Fatima" Mr. Eduardo Sigüenza

CAF user Edward Henry the person who recommended this faithful book has a thread and discusses a few quotes here:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=245442

Sorry for not reading your full thread…

God bless,

goforgoal
 
I am not trying to stir anything up…this subject happens to interest me but I can’t seem to find solid information. If this $#%! as you call it has been discussed before so sorry to inflame your old wounds. Although Im not exactly sure what I asked illicited that reply :confused:
 
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jackson3997 said:
Since Fatima has the church’s stamp of approved Marian apparitions can someone explain to me why the 3rd secret is still a secret? Has the church given a valid reason why they have delayed in its release since Our Lady requested its release in 1960? I heard reasons given include masons in the vatican to Pope Benedict XVI does not believe in Fatima?
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A very tiny bit of research would have told you that none of this is true. Google is your friend, as is the search function on these forums.
The 3rd secret was released years ago. And His Holiness the Pope will be very surprised when you inform him that he doesn’t believe in Fatima. :eek:
 
agnes_therese said:
A very tiny bit of research would have told you that none of this is true. Google is your friend, as is the search function on these forums.
The 3rd secret was released years ago. And His Holiness the Pope will be very surprised when you inform him that he doesn’t believe in Fatima. :eek:
Click to expand...
A huge misunderstanding here…I did read that part of the secret, but I listened to Fr. Gruner give this hour long talk and he says how it hasn’t been released in full, ect. My error for not researching this guy to see if he was excommunicated or what his status is with the church. I will post the link below. I would never tell His Holiness he doesn’t believe in Fatima. Listen, I just want the truth, and to be a good Catholic. I am not a conspiracy theorist or trying to stir up trouble. I’ve come back to the church after being away for a while and I am trying to learn all I can. I read all on Fatima that has been released. If that’s all the Church has come out with then so be it, but I heard this Fr. Gruner and got a bit confused. Sorry for the misunderstanding…

m.youtube.com/results?q=fatima%203rd%20secret#/watch?v=0NkyQcyQXog
 
jackson3997 said:
A huge misunderstanding here…I did read that part of the secret, but I listened to Fr. Gruner give this hour long talk and he says how it hasn’t been released in full, ect. My error for not researching this guy to see if he was excommunicated or what his status is with the church. I will post the link below. I would never tell His Holiness he doesn’t believe in Fatima. Listen, I just want the truth, and to be a good Catholic. I am not a conspiracy theorist or trying to stir up trouble. I’ve come back to the church after being away for a while and I am trying to learn all I can. I read all on Fatima that has been released. If that’s all the Church has come out with then so be it, but I heard this Fr. Gruner and got a bit confused. Sorry for the misunderstanding…

m.youtube.com/results?q=fatima%203rd%20secret#/watch?v=0NkyQcyQXog
Click to expand...
No problem, everyone can be troubled by doubts and questions at times.

Fr. Gruner is not the most reliable source of information.

At the moment, the best I can say is:
  1. The Third Secret has been released. (Official Church statement.)
  2. Like many passages of Scripture, it has both literal and allegorical interpretations. (My interpretation, but backed by point 4.)
  3. The Church has officially linked the literal meaning to the attempted assassination of Bl. Pope John Paul II. The late Pope himself said that “Our Lady saved his life” that day. (Official Church statement, and words of Bl. John Paul II.)
  4. However, Pope Benedict XVI has clearly stated that the message of Fatima has future applications. Given this, the vision can also be interpreted allegorically as referring to the trials and tribulations that the Church will face in the world, and perhaps a specific persecution at a future date, or at the end of time. (Words of Pope Benedict XVI, and one possible interpretation of them.)
I trust there’s nothing controversial in what I’ve said so far. Anything beyond this, at least to me, is either idle speculation or conspiracy theory. If someone claims to have worked out the exact date of the End Times from his private interpretation of Fatima, run, don’t walk, away from him. 😉
 
RPRPsych said:
No problem, everyone can be troubled by doubts and questions at times.

Fr. Gruner is not the most reliable source of information.

At the moment, the best I can say is:
  1. The Third Secret has been released. (Official Church statement.)
  2. Like many passages of Scripture, it has both literal and allegorical interpretations. (My interpretation, but backed by point 4.)
  3. The Church has officially linked the literal meaning to the attempted assassination of Bl. Pope John Paul II. The late Pope himself said that “Our Lady saved his life” that day. (Official Church statement, and words of Bl. John Paul II.)
  4. However, Pope Benedict XVI has clearly stated that the message of Fatima has future applications. Given this, the vision can also be interpreted allegorically as referring to the trials and tribulations that the Church will face in the world, and perhaps a specific persecution at a future date, or at the end of time. (Words of Pope Benedict XVI, and one possible interpretation of them.)
I trust there’s nothing controversial in what I’ve said so far. Anything beyond this, at least to me, is either idle speculation or conspiracy theory. If someone claims to have worked out the exact date of the End Times from his private interpretation of Fatima, run, don’t walk, away from h

Thanks a lot…I appreciate it. I feel a bit dumb now. 😊
I would point out though I did do my research (read the secret) its just that Fr. Gruner made me think we are all still missing something vital contained within. And it was someone else I heard (possibly Kathleen Keating) in my “hurry up and catechize myself” frenzy that claimed Pope Benedict XVI doesn’t believe in Fatima. Not my words.
Click to expand...
 
jackson3997 said:
Thanks a lot…I appreciate it. I feel a bit dumb now. 😊
I would point out though I did do my research (read the secret) its just that Fr. Gruner made me think we are all still missing something vital contained within. And it was someone else I heard (possibly Kathleen Keating) in my “hurry up and catechize myself” frenzy that claimed Pope Benedict XVI doesn’t believe in Fatima. Not my words.
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No need to feel dumb, it is great that you are sincerely searching! 🙂

Maybe this can help:
Sister Lucia’s Last Message for the World: No more secrets!
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On November 17, 2001 it was considered necessary by the Vatican for Archbishop Tarsciso Bertone to go personally to meet with Sister Lucia to clarify and to obtain information from her. This was necessary because of the onset of rumors of suspicion that the Holy See had not published the entire text of the third secret. The meeting lasted more than two hours. Sister Lucia replied,* “Everything has been published; there are no more secrets. If I had received new revelations, I would not have communicated them to anyone, but I would have told them directly to the Holy Father.”*
Click to expand...
Sister Maria Celina, the Convent‘s superior said that Sister Lucia always denied any talk of a “fourth secret of Fatima.” She declared that Sister Lucia would say of people who spread rumors of the alleged secret that *“they are never satisfied; that they should do what Our Lady asked, that this is the most important thing.” *When someone would say: „Sister Lucia, they say there is another secret’ …] she would look at them ironically. *‘If there is one,’ *she would say, *‘I wish they would tell it to me: I know of no other secrets.’" *
Click to expand...
Let us not be deceived by dissenting people who argue that Russia is not yet converted. Let us remember that our free Western world is not converted yet either, regardless of all the blessings it has received. God has not forced His will on the West; He will not force it on the Russian people. Let‘s not forget that it took nearly eighty years of atrocities and abuse to destroy the faith of many in those nations. Healing those memories will not happen overnight, but God is working! (Page 48)
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http://www.spiritdaily.com/bklgjpfatima.jpg
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John Paul II, The Pope Who Understood Fatima
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Regarding Pope Benedict’s belief in Fatima, in his homily during his May 13th 2010’s visit to Fatima he pronounced: "We would be mistaken to think that Fatima’s prophetic mission is complete." (Vatican Site)

He does believe!! 🙂
 
jackson3997 said:
RPRPsych;10097003:
No problem, everyone can be troubled by doubts and questions at times.

Fr. Gruner is not the most reliable source of information.

At the moment, the best I can say is:
  1. The Third Secret has been released. (Official Church statement.)
  2. Like many passages of Scripture, it has both literal and allegorical interpretations. (My interpretation, but backed by point 4.)
  3. The Church has officially linked the literal meaning to the attempted assassination of Bl. Pope John Paul II. The late Pope himself said that “Our Lady saved his life” that day. (Official Church statement, and words of Bl. John Paul II.)
  4. However, Pope Benedict XVI has clearly stated that the message of Fatima has future applications. Given this, the vision can also be interpreted allegorically as referring to the trials and tribulations that the Church will face in the world, and perhaps a specific persecution at a future date, or at the end of time. (Words of Pope Benedict XVI, and one possible interpretation of them.)
I trust there’s nothing controversial in what I’ve said so far. Anything beyond this, at least to me, is either idle speculation or conspiracy theory. If someone claims to have worked out the exact date of the End Times from his private interpretation of Fatima, run, don’t walk, away from h

Thanks a lot…I appreciate it. I feel a bit dumb now. 😊
I would point out though I did do my research (read the secret) its just that Fr. Gruner made me think we are all still missing something vital contained within. And it was someone else I heard (possibly Kathleen Keating) in my “hurry up and catechize myself” frenzy that claimed Pope Benedict XVI doesn’t believe in Fatima. Not my words.
Click to expand...
I would not recommend reading anything from Fr. Nicholas Gruner or his company – not even to my worse enemies.

For years, my family and I have been receiving his rubbish. The red flags started going up when he referred to both Pope John Paul II and Pope Benedict XVI as Anti-Popes and the red flags went up when he accused my family and I of not believing in God nor Praying. However, do not take my word for it there are several CAF Members who can attest to this and on the other hand there are many people on CAF and offline who will read this and totally disagree with me.
However, the apostolic nuncio, Archbishop Gabriel Montalvo Higuera, in an August 10, 2004 clarification on his priestly status specifically stated that Gruner is “not a priest in good standing with the Roman Catholic Church.”
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quoted from en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicholas_Gruner
Finally, in recent years there has been a certain lack of clarity regarding the priestly status of Fr. Gruner. According to the the Congregation for the Clergy, his priestly faculties (jurisdiction permitting celebration of the sacraments) have been suspended and his appeal of that suspension rejected by the highest Church court, the Apostolic Signature. However, I understand that he continues to publicly celebrant the sacraments, justifying it by arguments for the canonical invalidity of his suspension. What efforts he is making to settle this matter is not known.
Click to expand...
ewtn.com/expert/answers/fr_gruner.htm

I also read on a CAF thread that St. Padre Pio was suspended and was told not celebrate the sacraments publically St. Padre Pio obeyed unlike Fr. Nicholas Gruner who still continues to celebrates the sacraments.
“1333 §1, : 1° all or some of the acts of the power of order; 2° all or some of the acts of the power of governance; [and] 3° the exercise of all or some of the rights or functions attaching to an office.”
Click to expand...
vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/_P4X.HTM

I do keep Fr. Nicholas Gruner and his company in my Prayers though.

Do yourself a favor and purchase the book, " John Paul II the Pope who understood Fatima" Mr. Eduardo Sigüenza

God bless,

goforgoal
Click to expand...
 
jackson3997 said:
A huge misunderstanding here…I did read that part of the secret, but I listened to Fr. Gruner give this hour long talk and he says how it hasn’t been released in full, ect. My error for not researching this guy to see if he was excommunicated or what his status is with the church. I will post the link below. I would never tell His Holiness he doesn’t believe in Fatima. Listen, I just want the truth, and to be a good Catholic. I am not a conspiracy theorist or trying to stir up trouble. I’ve come back to the church after being away for a while and I am trying to learn all I can. I read all on Fatima that has been released. If that’s all the Church has come out with then so be it, but I heard this Fr. Gruner and got a bit confused. Sorry for the misunderstanding…

m.youtube.com/results?q=fatima%203rd%20secret#/watch?v=0NkyQcyQXog
Click to expand...
I would not recommend reading, viewing, listening or anything from Fr. Nicholas Gruner or his company – not even to my worse enemies.

For years, my family and I have been receiving his rubbish. The red flags started going up when he referred to both Pope John Paul II and Pope Benedict XVI as Anti-Popes and the red flags went up when he accused my family and I of not believing in God nor Praying. However, do not take my word for it there are several CAF Members who can attest to this and on the other hand there are many people on CAF and offline who will read this and totally disagree with me.
However, the apostolic nuncio, Archbishop Gabriel Montalvo Higuera, in an August 10, 2004 clarification on his priestly status specifically stated that Gruner is “not a priest in good standing with the Roman Catholic Church.”
Click to expand...
quoted from en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicholas_Gruner
Finally, in recent years there has been a certain lack of clarity regarding the priestly status of Fr. Gruner. According to the the Congregation for the Clergy, his priestly faculties (jurisdiction permitting celebration of the sacraments) have been suspended and his appeal of that suspension rejected by the highest Church court, the Apostolic Signature. However, I understand that he continues to publicly celebrant the sacraments, justifying it by arguments for the canonical invalidity of his suspension. What efforts he is making to settle this matter is not known.
Click to expand...
ewtn.com/expert/answers/fr_gruner.htm

I also read on a CAF thread that St. Padre Pio was suspended and was told not celebrate the sacraments publically St. Padre Pio obeyed unlike Fr. Nicholas Gruner who still continues to celebrates the sacraments.
“1333 §1, : 1° all or some of the acts of the power of order; 2° all or some of the acts of the power of governance; [and] 3° the exercise of all or some of the rights or functions attaching to an office.”
Click to expand...
vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/_P4X.HTM

I do keep Fr. Nicholas Gruner and his company in my Prayers though.

Do yourself a favor and purchase the book, " John Paul II the Pope who understood Fatima" Mr. Eduardo Sigüenza

God bless,

goforgoal
 
jackson3997 said:
Since Fatima has the church’s stamp of approved Marian apparitions can someone explain to me why the 3rd secret is still a secret? Has the church given a valid reason why they have delayed in its release since Our Lady requested its release in 1960? I heard reasons given include masons in the vatican to Pope Benedict XVI does not believe in Fatima? Any insight would be appreciated…Also…one more thing on the topic of Marian apparitions: I know its not allowed to promote unapproved apparitions on this forum but I don’t think my next question would violate the rules: I believe we aren’t allowed to discuss unapproved apparitions because they could be from the demonic, correct? How could satan be behind the apparitions that aren’t approved if the messages speak of repentence, sacrifice to The One Triune God, prayer, conversion, ect? I was always under the impression satan and his minions hate our Blessed Mother and her office of reconciling mankind to her Son. The messeges that come from some of the more popular unapproved apparitions seem to contradict what satan would be after. If this question is not allowed to be answered my apologies, just know I am not promoting anything, just looking for a little insight, thank you.
If the dead could come to life again, what would they not do for eternal life? And I - What am I doing? ~ St. Camillus de Lellis, C.
Click to expand...
It is not a secret. It was revealed already.

Father Gruner is suspended and is not in good standing with the Church.
 
jackson3997 said:
A huge misunderstanding here…I did read that part of the secret, but I listened to Fr. Gruner give this hour long talk and he says how it hasn’t been released in full, ect.
Click to expand...
Listen to His Holiness, not Fr. Gruner. Fr. Gruner has made a career and been suspended over convincing others that the Holy Father is a liar.

This is why we had the palmface early in this thread. Conspiracy theories and defiance of the Pope don’t go over well here.
 
pnewton said:
Listen to His Holiness, not Fr. Gruner. Fr. Gruner has made a career and been suspended over convincing others that the Holy Father is a liar.

This is why we had the palmface early in this thread. Conspiracy theories and defiance of the Pope don’t go over well here.
Click to expand...
Point taken…I feel humbled and a bit stupid as I said before. Our first mission here on earth is to learn and know the truth, and then spread it. I stumbled on Fr. Gruner by accident (also a few others, Malachi Martin was another) and should have checked him out before posting. Again, he made it sound as if we weren’t getting the whole story or that it hadn’t been released at all. Thank you all for informing me, although the palmface wasn’t helpful I got it now…I will stick with the Pope in these mattters.
 
I believe we aren’t allowed to discuss unapproved apparitions because they could be from the demonic, correct? How could satan be behind the apparitions that aren’t approved if the messages speak of repentence, sacrifice to The One Triune God, prayer, conversion, ect? I was always under the impression satan and his minions hate our Blessed Mother and her office of reconciling mankind to her Son. The messeges that come from some of the more popular unapproved apparitions seem to contradict what satan would be after. If this question is not allowed to be answered my apologies, just know I am not promoting anything, just looking for a little insight, thank you.

Third Secret of Fatima aside, I’m also interested in reading replies to this part of the O.P.'s question. Without discussing any particular apparitions, why would Satan promote repentance, sacrifice, prayer, conversion, etc.? Or does he do this to fool people, all the while sneaking in little things that are not in line with Church teaching or the Bible?
 
Veronica97 said:
I believe we aren’t allowed to discuss unapproved apparitions because they could be from the demonic, correct? How could satan be behind the apparitions that aren’t approved if the messages speak of repentence, sacrifice to The One Triune God, prayer, conversion, ect? I was always under the impression satan and his minions hate our Blessed Mother and her office of reconciling mankind to her Son. The messeges that come from some of the more popular unapproved apparitions seem to contradict what satan would be after. If this question is not allowed to be answered my apologies, just know I am not promoting anything, just looking for a little insight, thank you.
Click to expand...
Third Secret of Fatima aside, I’m also interested in reading replies to this part of the O.P.'s question. Without discussing any particular apparitions, why would Satan promote repentance, sacrifice, prayer, conversion, etc.? Or does he do this to fool people, all the while sneaking in little things that are not in line with Church teaching or the Bible?

Satan is the great deceiver. He will mix some truths in with his lies to make his lies sound more convincing as truths.
 
One reason I can think of re apparitions that are not approved. Perhaps Satan is inciting to rebellion against The Church - which instructs us to steer clear of apparitions that do not have approval. We set ourselves as the superior judge and over and above The Church and probably sooner or later not only as superior judge over The Church in other matters too besides unapproved apparitions.
Satan is not beyond using seeming goods with pure evil intent.
The moment I hold and advocate that The Church is wrong in one matter, then I open Church teaching to be wrong in other matters.
Apparent goods are not necessarily a good at all “man judges appearances, but The Lord knows the heart”. An apparent good can have an evil or wrongful motivation and intention. The apparent good is therefore not a good at all.
 
jackson3997 said:
Point taken…I feel humbled and a bit stupid as I said before. Our first mission here on earth is to learn and know the truth, and then spread it. I stumbled on Fr. Gruner by accident (also a few others, Malachi Martin was another) and should have checked him out before posting. Again, he made it sound as if we weren’t getting the whole story or that it hadn’t been released at all. Thank you all for informing me, although the palmface wasn’t helpful I got it now…I will stick with the Pope in these mattters.
Click to expand...
Beautifully put jackson3997, You know… your humble words:
“…he made it sound as if we weren’t getting the whole story or that it hadn’t been released at all.”
Click to expand...
brought back to mind the words of a holy priest who said "Satan does not usually invent new sins but he invents new ways to trick us into committing old sins"

Your quote reminded me that back in*** the Garden he was already using the same strategy in order to trick us into sin. He made it sound to our first parents as if they **** "were not getting the whole story"* from God and tricked them into intellectual pride. They went out looking for other answers instead of accepting the instructions that God had given them.😦 This is a sin that everyone of us in this forum has to be careful with. We do not always need to “know” every detail but to trust more in our Heavenly Father’s loving Providence.

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

I am afraid that there are too many of us, “intellectual bullies”, visiting this forum, and we need to learn from your humble admission.

Thank for your honest and humble insight 🙂

To Jesus through Mary 👍
 
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