Fatima Consecration

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Some of us know who Father Gruner is and that he believes that Russia - and not the world - should be consecrated to the Immaculate Heart of Mary in union with all the bishops of the world.

However, I realized the other day that the 1984 consecration was not done “in union with all the bishops of the world”. Our Lady did not specify that they be Catholic bishops, nor did she indicate whether they had to be in union with Rome. The phrase “all the bishops of the world” could include Eastern Orthodox Patriarchs and it could even include the Archbishop of Canterbury.

Any thoughts on this?
 
The Archbishop of Canterbury, according to Pope Leo XIII,
does not possess VALID Holy Orders and therefore is not even a true bishop, the fancy robes notwithstanding.

I think from the context, our Lady referred to Catholic bishops.

I am not one shilling for a re-consecration,
but if Benedict XVI wants to do a consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary, I for one would be very pleased.
It certainly couldn’t HURT.
 
If we reflect on why Jesus said why the consecration was important, he stated:
“Because I want My whole Church to recognize that Consecration as a triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, so that later on My Church will extend the devotion to the Immaculate Heart and place this devotion beside devotion to My Sacred Heart.”
This could be construed as a call for a reunion of the great schism.
 
Ay yay yay - more on Fatima! Talk about beating a dead horse!

For heaven’s sake, if Blessed Sister Lucia said that what has been done already is sufficient then why on earth are any of us dishonouring her memory by second-guessing her?
 
LilyM said:
Ay yay yay - more on Fatima! Talk about beating a dead horse!

For heaven’s sake, if Blessed Sister Lucia said that what has been done already is sufficient then why on earth are any of us dishonouring her memory by second-guessing her?
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Exactly so.
 
LilyM said:
Ay yay yay - more on Fatima! Talk about beating a dead horse!

For heaven’s sake, if Blessed Sister Lucia said that what has been done already is sufficient then why on earth are any of us dishonouring her memory by second-guessing her?
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Yep.
 
I know that Lucia has been through alot and now she’s dead (or rather alive), so we can’t have her ask the Blessed Mother to be more specific. But here is a great site on Fatima and today is a first Saturday, so here you go:

rosary-center.org/fatima.htm

If you search above, you’ll find that the five first Saturdays were for five blasphemies against the Immaculate Heart of Mary.

And strangely enough, what do you know?!?! This would be the 5th attempt of consecrating Russia! Also, there happen to be 5 decades in a rosary.

People have been whining and complaining that the 3rd secret wasn’t something spectacular. What is spectacular for me is that God knew that the PRIDE of men would assume that the only bishops of the world were Catholic.

P.S. - Did you know that Fatima was the daughter of Mohammed?
P.P.S. - Do not search for “5 blasphemies” in Yahoo or Google. One of the sites will take you to www.adishakti.org - a pagan site dedicated to the divine feminine!
 
pprimeau1976 said:
Some of us know who Father Gruner is and that he believes that Russia - and not the world - should be consecrated to the Immaculate Heart of Mary in union with all the bishops of the world.

However, I realized the other day that the 1984 consecration was not done “in union with all the bishops of the world”. Our Lady did not specify that they be Catholic bishops, nor did she indicate whether they had to be in union with Rome. The phrase “all the bishops of the world” could include Eastern Orthodox Patriarchs and it could even include the Archbishop of Canterbury.

Any thoughts on this?
Click to expand...
You should accept what Sister Lucia said and not Father Gruner. Mary did not come to him!
 
pprimeau1976 said:
I know that Lucia has been through alot and now she’s dead (or rather alive), so we can’t have her ask the Blessed Mother to be more specific. But here is a great site on Fatima and today is a first Saturday, so here you go:

rosary-center.org/fatima.htm

If you search above, you’ll find that the five first Saturdays were for five blasphemies against the Immaculate Heart of Mary.

And strangely enough, what do you know?!?! This would be the 5th attempt of consecrating Russia! Also, there happen to be 5 decades in a rosary.

People have been whining and complaining that the 3rd secret wasn’t something spectacular. What is spectacular for me is that God knew that the PRIDE of men would assume that the only bishops of the world were Catholic.

P.S. - Did you know that Fatima was the daughter of Mohammed?
P.P.S. - Do not search for “5 blasphemies” in Yahoo or Google. One of the sites will take you to www.adishakti.org - a pagan site dedicated to the divine feminine!
Click to expand...
Sr Lucia had seventy-some YEARS to ask Our Lady to ‘be more specific’ - and at least twenty since the last consecration of the world by John Paul II. If anything was wrong, she would’ve been told within those 20 years, and she would’ve told us! Instead she said THE PRECISE OPPOSITE - that what has been done is enough! I have no personal pride, nor undue pride in the Church, but I am firmly convinced Our Lady would have told us if her instructions had not been adequately attended to.

I wish you and Fr Gruner would stop beating a dead issue.
 
I disagree with Gruner! I am someone who wishes the Churches of the East and West to reunite. In a way, I am the anti-Gruner.

Gruner in a sense is a hippocrite. He insists on Russia only but ignores the fact that “bishops of the world” could mean any bishop, Catholic or Orthodox. In fact, he inserts the words “Catholic” bishop on his website. So in a sense, he is adding his own interpretation to the consecration issue, and confuses everyone in the process.

I don’t know if the consecration is necessary or not. But, considering the world we live in today, it doesn’t hurt to give it a new look with a new perspective - an ecumenical one.
 
pprimeau1976 said:
I disagree with Gruner! I am someone who wishes the Churches of the East and West to reunite. In a way, I am the anti-Gruner.

Gruner in a sense is a hippocrite. He insists on Russia only but ignores the fact that “bishops of the world” could mean any bishop, Catholic or Orthodox. In fact, he inserts the words “Catholic” bishop on his website. So in a sense, he is adding his own interpretation to the consecration issue, and confuses everyone in the process.

I don’t know if the consecration is necessary or not. But, considering the world we live in today, it doesn’t hurt to give it a new look with a new perspective - an ecumenical one.
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Of course it would hurt - do you honestly think any non-Catholic bishop worth their salt gives any credence to the Fatima apparitions? :ehh:
 
fin said:
but Russia has been consecrated to Mary, right?
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As part of a general consecration of the whole world - and I’d think the collapse of the Soviet Union less than a decade after this happened would be proof enough that it was acceptable :rolleyes:

But there are some who give new meaning to the term ‘nitpicker with too much time on their hands’
 
There is still, from what I understand, controversy surrounding what Sr. Lucia actually said and what she didn’t say. What was truth and what was fabricated. Coincidentally received a “Fatima Crusader” mag. today - haven’t received one in a long time and today it shows up! Frankly, I don’t know what to believe and what not to.🤷

I do know, however, that after the consecration of Russia we were supposed to have world peace…Well, so much for world peace.:confused:
 
Teelynn said:
There is still, from what I understand, controversy surrounding what Sr. Lucia actually said and what she didn’t say. What was truth and what was fabricated. Coincidentally received a “Fatima Crusader” mag. today - haven’t received one in a long time and today it shows up! Frankly, I don’t know what to believe and what not to.🤷

I do know, however, that after the consecration of Russia we were supposed to have world peace…Well, so much for world peace.:confused:
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I doubt that anyone fabricated Lucia’s words. The Vatican, despite what conspiracy theorists claim, is not full of Masons or anything of the such who wish to alter previous texts. If there is anyone to be suspicious of, it’s Gruner. I believe he fabricated the words of Our Lady in the “facts” section of the Fatima Network’s website:
In repeated visits to Sister Lucy, Heaven’s King and Queen have insisted that it is Russia (and Russia only) that is to be the object of this public act of obedience and prayer. In addition, Our Lord and Our Lady have indicated that the Holy Father is to be joined in the act of consecration by all the Catholic bishops of the world on the same day and at the same time in their respective dioceses.
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(bold emphasis mine)

The Fatima Network whines endlessly that the consecration must be done exactly as Our Lady requested. However, Our Lady never specified the type of bishop (Catholic or non-Catholic). She only specified that the consecration be done by “all the bishops of the world” and that all of the bishops be “in union” when they make the consecration.

I also want to make clear that I do not know if Russia has been converted both politically and spiritually. However, God’s way of doing things are not my way. It may take them hundreds of years to convert. Until then, I’ll leave it up to the Pope to decide whether another consecration is needed for Russia.
 
I understood the consecration was to prevent Russia from spreading her errors around the world. Abortion originated in Russia, and is now spreading around the world. I can see both sides of this argument. The world was consecrated but not Russia only.

Questions, questions, questions …
 
I also want to make clear that I do not know if Russia has been converted both politically and spiritually. However, God’s way of doing things are not my way. It may take them hundreds of years to convert. Until then, I’ll leave it up to the Pope to decide whether another consecration is needed for Russia.

I always include The Blessed Mother’s intentions first in my rosary. I think that’ll cover everything. At this point, that’s really all she’s asking us to do. Pray the Rosary, and Pray always.😉
 
epower said:
I understood the consecration was to prevent Russia from spreading her errors around the world. Abortion originated in Russia, and is now spreading around the world. I can see both sides of this argument. The world was consecrated but not Russia only.

Questions, questions, questions …
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Abortion did NOT originate in Russia! Whoever told you that? In different forms it’s been practiced for millennia!
 
LilyM said:
Abortion did NOT originate in Russia! Whoever told you that? In different forms it’s been practiced for millennia!
Click to expand...
I agree, abortion did not start in Russia. However Atheistic Communism did start in Russia. IMHO, I don’t think it ever died with the fall of the Berlin wall. I think it has just been given new names and has even crept its way in the United States. I won’t say what the new name is, because it will offend alot of people.🙂
 
**Headlines in the Last Week!

Friction intensifies between U.S. and Russia
May 29, 2007 - Russia test-launches new missile
May 30, 2007 - Bush, Putin to meet as rift between nations widens
May 31, 2007 - Putin accuses U.S. of starting new arms race

Why Doesn’t The Pope Call President Bush & Putin, And tell them to relax,
The Consecration of Russia has been done!

Russia is no threat!
Russia is a Strong Catholic & Peaceful Nation - they converted remember!

We are in that Great Period of Peace Our Lady Promised us!
The World has never been more Peaceful & Loving than it is today!
Wake Up People! (1+1=2)
No Peace + No Conversion = No Consecration

The Consecration has Not been done as Our Lady requested.
After a lecture at St. Peter’s Church in New York City on January 27, 1988,
the following request was made of Cardinal Ratzinger, now Pope Benedict XVI:
“Your Eminence, I would like you to ask the Holy Father, Pope John Paul II,
to consecrate Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary, immediately and in union
with all the bishops in the world.” He replied: “I know it has to be done!”…
This response is proof the Consecration has not been done.

Mother Angelica was right when she said on May 16th 2001,
“As for the Secret, well I happen to be one of those individuals
who thinks we didn’t get the whole thing. I told ya! I mean, you
have the right to your own opinion, don’t you, Father?
There, you know, that’s my opinion.
Because I think it’s scary…”

God Bless Mother Angelica!

If the Consecration of Russia had been done properly,
the world would be at Peace and Russia would be converted.
Russia is far from being the most Catholic Nation of the world!
And there is absolutely no peace at all in the world!
Do you want us to believe Our Lady broke her promise to us?

The conversion & peace would have came almost over night, so
that the world would know it came from Our Lady.
It’s been 23 years since the ‘suppossed consecration’ was done.

Either the people who are saying it has been done are lying
or Our Lady lied to us at Fatima! And Our Lady Doesn’t Lie!
So, Who’s Lying? & Why?

The smoke of Satan has blinded many in the Church to the Truth.
There are enemies within the Church trying to destroy it from within,
no they won’t prevail but, they could do a lot of damage.

I sure hope it’s not gonna take many nations to be annihilated or
American Cities to be Nuked before we Open Our Eyes to the Truth!

Is THIS the Peace Our Lady of Fatima promised we would have?
Russia, China, France, United Kingdom, India, Israel, and Pakistan
all have Nukes! Iran, Korea & many others are in the process.
Terrorism, Famine & Abortion continue to spead across the globe!
We are on the verge of Nations being Annihilated &
Russia is still spreading it’s Errors through out the world.
Mexico legalizing Abortion is another error spread.

How can you truly believe that the
Consecration of Russia has been done, properly?
All the Bishops of the world in union with the Pope
on the same day must specifically mention ‘Russia’, NOT ‘The World’.

Do not be deceived, for even the elect will be deceived.
What harm would cause to do the Consecration
again just to make sure it’s been done properly?
It would end all the controversy.
Better safe than sorry, if you ask me!

I Love EWTN & I will Pray them!
Remember, EWTN is Not God!
They could be Wrong!
Don’t let Pride get in the way of admitting it.

EWTN is wrong about Fatima & about Fr. Gruner.
Please Read & do more research.
Read Father’s books & magazines
before you persecute him.
One day his reward in Heaven will be great.

What will the punishment be for all of us when various
nations are Annihilated because we did not listen to
The Mother Of God!

Mary Pray For Us!

Lord Jesus Christ, Son of the Living God,
have mercy on me, a sinner.

:crossrc:

Peace & Love ~ Bob**
 
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