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trth_skr
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A Fatima Soliloquy
Based on a Famous Scene from Shakespeare’s *Hamlet
*Mark J. Wyatt
To consecrate or not to: that is the question:
Whether ‘tis wiser to pander to Russia,
And continue a stalemate, nay, a threat increasing,
Or armed with faith and Mary’s assistance,
Oppose the error and convert them? Act not: to concede;
No out; and by concede to say we end
The separation ecumenism desires to repair
The solution of man, ‘tis a consummation
Naively to be wish’d. Act not: to concede;
To concede: perchance to bear fruit: ay, there’s the rub;
In that concession of lies what chaff may be rife
When we have relinquished this consecration,
Must give us pause: An act of faith
That can bear great effect if acted upon;
For who would bear the threats and actions of error,
Those errors of Russia, the atheist’s materialism,
The pangs of rejected offers, the law’s delay,
The Pharisee’s hypocrisy and rejection
Christ’s Church continually abides with love,
When compromise may be enacted
With a simple concession? Why consecrate Russia,
Reversing pacts sweated and wearied for,
But for the prophecy of continued aggrandizement,
The further coneyance of errors from whose seed,
The world will knowingly suffer, these forcing the will
And leading to the revealed belated consecration
Than compromise further and lose yet more souls?
Thus uncertainty makes for hesitation;
And fear of acting in a manner unsound,
Drains the courage needful to act with simple faith,
And occasions granted from heaven,
Slip away like sand, and through delay and refusal,
Abate the favors to be obtained. – Hail thee, Mary!
Sinless Virgin! Our Mother, in thy prayers,
Remember we sinners and our Vicar.
Commentary on “A Fatima Soliloquy”
Mark Wyatt
www.veritas-catholic.blogspot.com
Based on a Famous Scene from Shakespeare’s *Hamlet
*Mark J. Wyatt
To consecrate or not to: that is the question:
Whether ‘tis wiser to pander to Russia,
And continue a stalemate, nay, a threat increasing,
Or armed with faith and Mary’s assistance,
Oppose the error and convert them? Act not: to concede;
No out; and by concede to say we end
The separation ecumenism desires to repair
The solution of man, ‘tis a consummation
Naively to be wish’d. Act not: to concede;
To concede: perchance to bear fruit: ay, there’s the rub;
In that concession of lies what chaff may be rife
When we have relinquished this consecration,
Must give us pause: An act of faith
That can bear great effect if acted upon;
For who would bear the threats and actions of error,
Those errors of Russia, the atheist’s materialism,
The pangs of rejected offers, the law’s delay,
The Pharisee’s hypocrisy and rejection
Christ’s Church continually abides with love,
When compromise may be enacted
With a simple concession? Why consecrate Russia,
Reversing pacts sweated and wearied for,
But for the prophecy of continued aggrandizement,
The further coneyance of errors from whose seed,
The world will knowingly suffer, these forcing the will
And leading to the revealed belated consecration
Than compromise further and lose yet more souls?
Thus uncertainty makes for hesitation;
And fear of acting in a manner unsound,
Drains the courage needful to act with simple faith,
And occasions granted from heaven,
Slip away like sand, and through delay and refusal,
Abate the favors to be obtained. – Hail thee, Mary!
Sinless Virgin! Our Mother, in thy prayers,
Remember we sinners and our Vicar.
Commentary on “A Fatima Soliloquy”
Mark Wyatt
www.veritas-catholic.blogspot.com
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LilyM
Guest
And here’s my problem Simon - you are almost certainly failing as a servant of Christ and God by not giving Mary that level of honour which was granted her by God himself.
As if we can ever be more or should ever be less respectful and honoring of her than Christ and the Father themselves have been!
How on earth can you not heed Christ’s command of ‘love one another as I have loved you’ - to think that it doesn’t mean we should love Mary in the same degree as he did? Which was completely - since he chose her above all women to be his mother and his vessel through which to come to us?
How can you not see that loving God ‘with your whole heart, mind and strength’ doesn’t mean loving and honouring to an incredibly high degree all the people connected with him too! Seriously?
Did Christ not love his mother, not to mention his friends and gift them with everything he had, including many of his own and the Father’s powers (the power to forgive sins? The Holy Spirit itself? The power to confer that same Holy Spirit by the laying on of hands? The Holy The very KEYS TO THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN and the power to bind and loose it?
How dare you do less than your utmost in honouring them for love of Him if not love of themselves as the holy and uniquely blessed people they were? You seriously should be grovelling in the dust and begging their forgiveness and Christ’s for having so shamefully neglected to honour them as He did and as He commands us to.
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hoosierdaddy
Guest
The only thing I will say John is…you’re wrong. I was right. You really need to read your Bible. … I know that the Lord is able…
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hoosierdaddy
Guest
(Please use appropriate usernames or abrevaitions) That line of yours is a whopper! Is there a book somewhere (or website you’re familiar with) that lists all of the devil’s “generalized predictions.”
Also, remember that many “generalized predictions” are given through astrology, tarot cards, ouija boards, etc. Surely you aren’t telling me that God would be the source of those “predictions”? I didn’t think so.
Also, remember that many “generalized predictions” are given through astrology, tarot cards, ouija boards, etc. Surely you aren’t telling me that God would be the source of those “predictions”? I didn’t think so.
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JaneFrances
Guest
I know I’m not Lily, but I’d like to respond to this as well.
Who? Really, Simon, who has given Mary that which is God’s. The Catholic Church? Or various misguided people? And how does the message of Fatima contribute to these unnamed peoples’ who may be giving Mary that which is God’s?
In what way have “they” (we still don’t know who “they” are) built Mary up through the visions at FATIMA? No doubt, there are demonic spirits throughout the world who will use whatever resources they have to cause man to abandon Christ, but what is it about FATIMA (which is the topic of this thread) that makes you think it is the work of Satan.
Satan can twist and manipulate even the word of God in effort to achieve his evil end. No one would doubt that he would do the same with a message of the Blessed Mother, but just as we do not throw out Scripture (which Satan uses to his own devices), we do not throw out the message of Fatima.
Publicity does not equal Satanic. To be drawn to Mary is to be led to Christ.
So, are you asserting that the Mary of Fatima, Our Lady of the Rosary, in her message to the children at Fatima to sacrifice to Christ, reflect upon the Life, Death and Resurrection of her Son, and to pray for the salvation of sinners through Christ is somehow contributing to this “burying” of “the true Mary”?
Likewise, it should be down right frightful to you to think how Satan can and DOES use the very Word of God, Sacred Scripture, to get millions to bow at the alter of self. Yet, we as Christians, do not reject or doubt Scripture even when it is twisted and used for evil. Likewise, we as Christians, do not reject or doubt the message of the Blessed Mother at Fatima which leads us to Christ.
You have provided no proof or example of any situation in which someone with a devotion to the Immaculate Heart of Mary prays to her “instead of praying forthright willingly and honestly to God our Creator.” Instead, you have made assertions you have not supported and assumptions based on partial and biased information.
Which is precisely why the Church went through years of testing, scrutiny, and analysis to determine if Fatima was truly the message of Our Lady.
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Tony_B
Guest
Fatima:
A mission was presented to young people… they chose to accept the mission from the mysterious lady, whom they later discovered was Mary. Many are given similar missions… like the apostles who did not know who Jesus was, only on promises of becoming “fishers of men”… it’s up to us to follow our Mission or not.
In scripture Mary gives the servants at the Cana Wedding a mission, “Do whatever he (Jesus) tells you.” They were lead to Christ and witnessed his powerful love. Would you think the Mother of Christ would just disappear after Christ’s death?
I would suggest to read, watch, discuss a little more in depth into Fatima. There’s good multi-media info out there. (edited by Moderator)
Vatican & Fatima: Simply states “Worthy of belief.”
(edited by Moderator)
God Bless. Excellent Post. Keep em coming.
A mission was presented to young people… they chose to accept the mission from the mysterious lady, whom they later discovered was Mary. Many are given similar missions… like the apostles who did not know who Jesus was, only on promises of becoming “fishers of men”… it’s up to us to follow our Mission or not.
In scripture Mary gives the servants at the Cana Wedding a mission, “Do whatever he (Jesus) tells you.” They were lead to Christ and witnessed his powerful love. Would you think the Mother of Christ would just disappear after Christ’s death?
I would suggest to read, watch, discuss a little more in depth into Fatima. There’s good multi-media info out there. (edited by Moderator)
Vatican & Fatima: Simply states “Worthy of belief.”
(edited by Moderator)
God Bless. Excellent Post. Keep em coming.
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thistle
Guest
Actually Medjugorie is not still being investigated. Three Bishops Commissions have declared there is no evidence of any supernatural appearances of Mary. They have said the visionaries are fakes. It did not pass the first step in the approval process and consequently has NOT gone to Rome for any further steps.
However this thread is on Fatima and not Medjugorie (which being unapproved cannot be discussed in the forums).
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Mintaka
Guest
Re: my earlier testimony about fruits of Fatima in my own life
Perhaps I didn’t express myself clearly. Fatima taught me that it was important for me to pray daily and contemplate Christ’s life, as well as just going to church on Sunday and doing normal stuff. Habits of daily prayer, habits of knowing the scripture, and the graces that come from such things because one is listening to Jesus is what helped and saved me through many troubles.
I thought Protestants were all about the personal testimonies of what helped them. But clearly, it’s okay to credit C.S. Lewis or Dorothy L. Sayers as a teacher, but not our Blessed Mother.
Sheesh.
Well, I’m sorry you don’t like it, but that’s what happened. I’m not going to lie about it.
Perhaps I didn’t express myself clearly. Fatima taught me that it was important for me to pray daily and contemplate Christ’s life, as well as just going to church on Sunday and doing normal stuff. Habits of daily prayer, habits of knowing the scripture, and the graces that come from such things because one is listening to Jesus is what helped and saved me through many troubles.
I thought Protestants were all about the personal testimonies of what helped them. But clearly, it’s okay to credit C.S. Lewis or Dorothy L. Sayers as a teacher, but not our Blessed Mother.
Sheesh.
Well, I’m sorry you don’t like it, but that’s what happened. I’m not going to lie about it.
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Axion
Guest
The clear thing about Fatima:
Mary in her apparition called on people to repent of their sins, pray and obey the Lord.
Scripture tells us that Satan **cannot **do these things. None can say jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit. Satan cannot divide his house against himself.
Scripture also tells us to judge the spiritual by its fruits. The fruits of fatima have been healing, the growth of Christianity and a deepening of Faith. They may also have included the fall of atheistic communism in eastern europe.
Therefore the case is made. End of argument. There is no way fatima is not of God.
Mary in her apparition called on people to repent of their sins, pray and obey the Lord.
Scripture tells us that Satan **cannot **do these things. None can say jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit. Satan cannot divide his house against himself.
Scripture also tells us to judge the spiritual by its fruits. The fruits of fatima have been healing, the growth of Christianity and a deepening of Faith. They may also have included the fall of atheistic communism in eastern europe.
Therefore the case is made. End of argument. There is no way fatima is not of God.
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mich2
Guest
I have no problems accepting it as being a revelation from Heaven.But I would like to quote from hoosierdaddy
The way I look at it is if it was from God, I may reject it and God won’t be happy with me but He knows I am acting according to what I know from Scripture and am trying to honour my Lord.
I fully agree with this statement.
** It is not a sin to doubt if it was Mary. **
If it was truly Mary, then, yes it is a sin not to acklowledge her and her message from Heaven.
It is hardly on the level of the unpardonable sin, that being stating that the miracles of Jesus were done by satanic power.
I personally agree that, someone, who, by reason of being cautious, disregards the event and does not acknowledge it"s message on the grounds that it could be a deception from Satan, is not commiting a sin incapable of being forgiven.However, for those who truly believe within their heart, the vision is indeed a deception, to the point where such a person develops a** hatred** for our Lady and it’s message, then, it’s seems that we have the very same thing happening where our Lord performed miracles which was claimed by some to be the works of Satan.
** But if it is from Satan and I accept it…well then that would be a problem.**
While I agree, my question would be why would this be a problem more than for one rejecting it? Was it not a problem for people who refused to accept the gosple of resurrected Jesus? I’m certain that many chose not to believe for the reason that it could have been a deception of Satan, eventhough they believed that it could also have been
from the powers of God.In however manner such people are going to be judged, we know they have decided not
to become christians, nevertheless, for the reason of simply being cautious.
Better to be safe than sorry…especially when the Church says it’s not even required to believe it.
In my opinion, it boils down to whether someone develops a hatred towards the Lady or not.** If** the vision is authentic, then,people not accepting the vision will be lacking of the grace being promissed. As for those who come to accept within their hearts the Lady is ** indeed a deception from Satan, then God will be their Judge.
Now, if** the vision is a deception of Satan, then I agree that we, who have put full confidence in the vision, will be guilty of sin, and God will be** our **judge for this.
Andre
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JaneFrances
Guest
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Mannyfit75
Guest
I don’t think its a work of Satan, and I don’t believe in the Fatima message. Fatima message is mainly asking for the faithful to repent, pray, and come back to God.
It reminds us of our duty and commitment to God. As a Catholic, I can decide to believe it, but I choose not to.
The Sacrament of the Church is all that is necessary for Catholic. Obey God’s commandments, if one commits sin, go to confession, and attend Mass once a week, and preach the Gospel. That’s my two cents.
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JonathanKinsman
Guest
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myfavoritmartin
Guest
You have the gall to judge me?
Scripture tells us not to Judge in the condemn sense of the word, but to be fruit inspectors of the vine.
You should be very uncomfortable with this statement, as I am for you!
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JonathanKinsman
Guest
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myfavoritmartin
Guest
WASPISH?
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myfavoritmartin
Guest
I feigned no hurt, I said she should be concerned.
Its like water off my back.
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myfavoritmartin
Guest
She said I was failing as a servant of Christ!
WOW! brave judgement.
I know differently.
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JaneFrances
Guest
Great! Then, we can move on. . .
I had asked the same question twice now. Thrice is nice.
If you now admit that the message of Fatima recognizes Jesus as our Savior, as Scripture prescribes, has your opinion of Fatima changed? And if not, what is your present concern?
And I’d love some interaction with my questions to you in post #729.
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