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torch621
Guest
This paragraph taken from EWTN seems to indicate that the Lenten obligation to abstain from meat is dispensed because it is a solemnity. Is this information correct?
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Marie5890
Guest
That is correct.
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MarkThompson
Guest
Yes. The Code of Canon Law says:
Can. 1251 Abstinence from meat, or from some other food as determined by the Episcopal Conference, is to be observed on all Fridays, unless a solemnity should fall on a Friday.
The Annunciation is a solemnity.
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utah_rose
Guest
I thought it depended on the diocese. As far as I know, ours didn’t receive a dispensation and also most of the churches are having their traditional Fish Fry.
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Joe_Kelley
Guest
Dispensed may be a confusing term here. There isn’t any dispensation needed because there is no obligation on a Solemnity as noted in the Canon Law citations.
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ConstantineTG
Guest
Awesome! I was going to ask this question because in the Byzantine Rite there is such a “rule”. Glad that the “rule” is universal in the Church.
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TheMc
Guest
I emailed my vicar general last week about this (and other things), and he said that if a solemnity falls on a lenten friday, the solemnity “overrules” the lenten Friday. There is no dispensation needed, it is automatic. Of course, you may still attend a fish fry if you wish, but you may also attend a chicken fry.
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MarkThompson
Guest
Since you are canonically Roman, I think the canon applies to you. Nonetheless:
Can. 1 The canons of this Code regard only the Latin Church.
Our Eastern friends have, as I understand it, their own code of statutes.
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ConstantineTG
Guest
I asked the Bishop and he said that I follow the rules of the Church I attend regularly.
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MarkThompson
Guest
I assume you mean that you asked your Latin-rite bishop? I do not believe a Byzantine bishop would have the authority to dispense any of the obligations the CIC binds you to.
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ConstantineTG
Guest
No, I asked my Ukrainian Bishop. One thing I appreciate about the Eastern Rites is the small, close knit communities that its not uncommon for the Bishop to hang around after Liturgy and join in the after-Liturgy breakfast.
I’m not aware of any Canon Law that says we should follow the laws of the Church of our Canonical enrollment. But St. Ambrose did say that he follows Rome’s fasting rules when he is in Rome, “when in Rome, do as the Romans do.” Since now I’m with the Ukrainians, I’ll do as they do.
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MarkThompson
Guest
St. Ambrose did not live under the present Code of Canon Law. “Can. 12 §1: Universal laws bind everywhere all those for whom they were issued.” For whom are the universal laws of the Code issued? “Can. 1: The canons of this Code regard only the Latin Church.” You will find this to be the case if you ever have marriage issues, or have to undergo a canonical trial for some remote reason, or whatever. It will all be governed by the CIC. A Byzantine bishop cannot dispense the obligations you have as a Latin-rite Catholic.
A person in your situation is of course free to supplement those obligations by voluntarily taking on the customs and rules of an Eastern-rite church where they do not conflict. But if, for instance, some random Thursday happens to be a holy day of obligation under the CIC and not in the Eastern rite, he must still go to Mass on pain of sin. If Byzantines do not fast on Ash Wednesday, he still must. That sort of thing.
EDIT: P.S., I recognize that it’s none of my business and that you didn’t ask about it. But I thought you would want to know.
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ConstantineTG
Guest
The great thing about the Byzantine Rite is it has “stricter” observances than the RC. Ash Wednesday shouldn’t be a problem because Wednesdays and Fridays are the fast/abstinence days for the Byzantine Rite. In Canada the days of obligations are only Christmas and January 1st. In the Ukrainian Church, 7 of the 12 Great Feasts are seen as “days of obligation”, which includes Christmas/Nativity. Although January 1st isn’t, its the Feast of St. Basil the Great which is a special day in the Byzantine Rite and his Liturgy is celebrated.
I’ve always valued your posts, so its fine. But I already went through the same questions you are posting here. But I’d go with what the Bishop says. It wasn’t a short conversation and he did give me many examples, both for RCs coming into the Byzantine Rite, and Ukrainians switching to parishes and living life as RCs. In many instances, people never switch Rites formally. We can interpret Canon Law many different ways. There were earlier discussions here about Days of Obligation and which to observe when we are traveling. The answer was we observe the Days of Obligation of the territory we are in. Would territory only apply to physical location? What about jurisdiction? I go to the Ukrainian parish and my physical location is the physical territory of that Bishop, which he shares of course with the Latin Bishop. So who’s territory am I in? Canonical Enrollment? Or one whom I follow in practice?EDIT: P.S., I recognize that it’s none of my business and that you didn’t ask about it. But I thought you would want to know.
The bottom line here is spirituality. Would we let the legalism get in the way of one’s spirituality? Will God hold it against us for following one of His Bishops? Its not like I broke Canon Law in contempt of the Church. At the end of the day, I am still following the Church, since it is still one Church.
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utah_rose
Guest
Well, we had nothing in our diocesan paper OR our bulletin exempting us from this. Maybe it depends on what area of the country you live in (I live in the West).I emailed my vicar general last week about this (and other things), and he said that if a solemnity falls on a lenten friday, the solemnity “overrules” the lenten Friday. There is no dispensation needed, it is automatic. Of course, you may still attend a fish fry if you wish, but you may also attend a chicken fry.
So, I diid choose to keep the Lenten Fast (not much of meat eater anyway). But I was upset that our diocesan paper that is published each Friday chose not to say one word about this feast. Last week it ignored the Feast of St. Joseph, so I emailed them expressing my disappointment.
To tell you the truth, fasting from surfing on the computer, fasting from most TV programs and listening to music is far harder for me then abstaining from meat.
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MissRose73
Guest
I didn’t eat any meat yesterday. I just observed it like any other Lenten Friday.
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MarkThompson
Guest
For whatever it’s worth now, the Code of Canon Law has universal application (within the Latin Rite) for the worldwide Church, so it doesn’t depend on your area or on what is printed in your bulletin. The Canon says, “Can. 1251 Abstinence from meat, or from some other food as determined by the Episcopal Conference, is to be observed on all Fridays, unless a solemnity should fall on a Friday.” Therefore there was no Friday abstinence to be observed at all yesterday. Of course, everyone’s free to not eat meat if they don’t want to. Neither did I, as it turns out, though I didn’t particularly plan it that way.
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ConstantineTG
Guest
Just a comment. While its wonderful that we consciously abstain and fast during Lent to remind us of things more necessary than food, its also good to consciously not-fast during such Feasts/Solemnities to remind us that it is indeed a special day.
Just my 2 cents.
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fieldsparrow
Guest
It was kind of funny; several of my coworkers who are Catholic know that I am in RCIA (and are super-excited about it) and one of them came over to my cubicle on Friday morning to ask if I knew that abstinence was lifted because it was a Solemnity. I guess they had it printed in their bulletin, and she mentioned that she didn’t think it was common knowledge.
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