Female Apostles mentioned in Scripture?

[Janet1983]

I just had to ask this one because I just found it and it kind of blew my mind… It never occurred to me, but there is was, right in front of me:

Romans 16:7 - Salute Andronicus and Junia, my kinsmen, and my fellow-prisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.

This passage talks about two people known to Paul who were apostles and fellow-prisoners with him at some point in time. Some translations translate them as Andronicus and Junia and others call them Andronicus and Junias.
Taking a closer look it might be more likely to be Junias, but still there is a problem with that name:
Junias is a noun… (obviously)
Junias is accusative… (well ok, Junias is the direct object)
Junias is singular… (well of course)
Junias is feminine…

Is this passage telling us that we are talking about a female apostle and historical bias has tried to erase it???

Just trying to figure this out…

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all.

In Him,
Janet

 

[DihydrogenOxide]

There has been some debate about that for quite a long time. It could be that it was just misspelled from Junius.

At any rate, the fact that it was female or male is irrelevant. This person is not an apostle, but rather a disciple. Jesus did not name him/her one of His 12. There were several female disciples named in the Bible.

Even though it considers her “outstanding among the apostles” doesn’t mean she was one. She could have been an outstanding disciple among the apostles, i.e. learning from the apostles.

 

[PJM]

=Janet1983;6271014]I just had to ask this one because I just found it and it kind of blew my mind… It never occurred to me, but there is was, right in front of me:

Romans 16:7 - Salute Andronicus and Junia, my kinsmen, and my fellow-prisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.

This passage talks about two people known to Paul who were apostles and fellow-prisoners with him at some point in time. Some translations translate them as Andronicus and Junia and others call them Andronicus and Junias.
Taking a closer look it might be more likely to be Junias, but still there is a problem with that name:
Junias is a noun… (obviously)
Junias is accusative… (well ok, Junias is the direct object)
Junias is singular… (well of course)
Junias is feminine…

Is this passage telling us that we are talking about a female apostle and historical bias has tried to erase it???

Just trying to figure this out…

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all.

In Him,
Janet

***From the RVS Bible Rm. 16: 7 "Greet Androni’cus and Ju’nias, **my kinsmen ***and my fellow prisoners; **they are men of note among the apostles, and they were in Christ before me.

DR Bible “Salute Andronicus and Junias, my kinsmen and fellow prisoners: who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me”.

KJ Bible "Salute Andronicus and Junia, my kinsmen, and my fellow-prisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.

***One can plainly see from all thee BIBLE versions that “MEN / as in MALE GENDER” are clearly specified.

Hope your fishin is better next time ***

 

[Fidelis]

Is this passage telling us that we are talking about a female apostle and historical bias *has tried to erase it??? *

Hi Janet.

Not directing this at you, of course, but there are many out there that, if they were of a frame of mind to suspect the Church would perpetuate a 2000 year cover-up of early female Apostles (with a capital ‘A’) or bishops, that person would also tend to pooh-pooh any explanation one might give in answer to this. The thing about conspiracy theories is that they are circular and DaVinci Code-self authenticating ---- “You don’t recognize this as a conspiracy because there’s a conspiracy to hide the conspiracy.”

 

[Timbothefiveth]

who are of note among the apostles,

Of note can also mean different things. For instance, Osama bin Laden is of note among the CIA, while Abraham Lincoln is of note among presidents.

 

[Evan]

***From the RVS Bible Rm. 16: 7 "Greet Androni’cus and Ju’nias, **my kinsmen *****and my fellow prisoners; **they are men **of note among the apostles, and they were in Christ before me.

DR Bible “Salute Andronicus and Junias, my kinsmen and fellow prisoners: who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me”.

KJ Bible "Salute Andronicus and Junia, my kinsmen, and my fellow-prisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.

***One can plainly see from all thee BIBLE versions that “MEN / as in MALE GENDER” are clearly specified.

Hope your fishin is better next time ***

In English and in Latin when a collection of people include both male and female members, the male form of the plural is use. The gender of kinsmen is irrelevant to this discussion. Only the gender of Junias. Are there examples of feminine gendered names for males? I know there are occupations occupied solely by males that are described by feminine nouns (eg: agricola fem… farmer)

If Junias were established as feminine, would this imply he was female?

 

[edwest2]

Hi Janet.

Not directing this at you, of course, but there are many out there that, if they were of a frame of mind to suspect the Church would perpetuate a 2000 year cover-up of early female Apostles (with a capital ‘A’) or bishops, that person would also tend to pooh-pooh any explanation one might give in answer to this. The thing about conspiracy theories is that they are circular and DaVinci Code-self authenticating ---- “You don’t recognize this as a conspiracy because there’s a conspiracy to hide the conspiracy.”

Uh, I wouldn’t be so dismissive of conspiracies in general. Things like that do get uncovered from time to time. But back to the OP, Jesus chose the twelve. That’s it.

Peace,
Ed

 

[PeterK]

I always heard the Apostles were the guys and the Epistles were the girls.

PeterK

 

[Fidelis]

Uh, I wouldn’t be so dismissive of conspiracies in general. Things like that do get uncovered from time to time.

There are such things as real conspiracies, of course, but to believe in one with so little evidence as one might consider this to be would be would be just plain ludicrous.

 

[peary1]

I just had to ask this one because I just found it and it kind of blew my mind… It never occurred to me, but there is was, right in front of me:

Romans 16:7 - Salute Andronicus and Junia, my kinsmen, and my fellow-prisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.

This passage talks about two people known to Paul who were apostles and fellow-prisoners with him at some point in time. Some translations translate them as Andronicus and Junia and others call them Andronicus and Junias.
Taking a closer look it might be more likely to be Junias, but still there is a problem with that name:
Junias is a noun… (obviously)
Junias is accusative… (well ok, Junias is the direct object)
Junias is singular… (well of course)
Junias is feminine…

Is this passage telling us that we are talking about a female apostle and historical bias has tried to erase it???

Just trying to figure this out…

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all.

In Him,
Janet

The name Junia is a woman’s name. One ancient Greek manuscript and a number of ancient versions read the name “Julia.” Most editors have interpreted it as a man’s name, Junias.

The text alludes to what the general meaning of ‘apostle’ is, meaning any one of the early followers of Jesus who carried the Christian message into the world. It would not have the same context as ‘Apostle’ used to denote the original 12. Even if it were a woman, she would have been involved in missionary work with Adronicus if that was his wife. We too are apostles of the Word, by the way.

 

[Pawel_J]

Uh, I wouldn’t be so dismissive of conspiracies in general. Things like that do get uncovered from time to time. But back to the OP, Jesus chose the twelve. That’s it.
Peace,
Ed

What about Paul? He was not among the 12, but he was also an apostle.
Junia’s gender as female is seldom questioned among Christian theologians nowadays. The question is only if we can say she was also an apostle. It seems Paul considered her to be one. An apostle, by definition, is a disciple of the Christ or his follower, who has a missionary task to convert a nation or people. Paul was such an apostle and he could consider Junia and her husband to be apostles = disciples with a missionary task.

 

[inkaneer]

What about Paul? He was not among the 12, but he was also an apostle.
Junia’s gender as female is seldom questioned among Christian theologians nowadays. The question is only if we can say she was also an apostle. It seems Paul considered her to be one. An apostle, by definition, is a disciple of the Christ or his follower, who has a missionary task to convert a nation or people. Paul was such an apostle and he could consider Junia and her husband to be apostles = disciples with a missionary task.

In scripture the word Apostle means one who is sent [referring to being sent by Jesus]. When it comes to naming the Apostles the scripture say there were twelve. In the book of Revelation the 24 elders are thought of as being the fathers of the 12 OT tribes and the twelve Apostles. Now the question becomes just who is an Apostle. We have no question on eleven of them but then we come to Judas, Matthias and Paul. I maintain that Paul is the 12th Apostle. Judas died before the Great Commission at which time the Apostles were sent by Jesus. So Judas was never sent and therefore is no Apostle. Paul was sent by Jesus [Acts 9:15]. Matthias was elected to serve in Judas’ place but Judas was never sent. Still scripture says that Matthias was, “…numbered with the eleven apostles” [Ac 1:26] It doesn’t say he was the twelth Apostle only that he was numbered with the ELEVEN Apostles. If he was an Apostle shouldn’t he be numbered with the TWELVE Apostles? What I think the sentence means is that the Apostles,in addition to being Apostles, were also bishops and Matthias was ordained as a bishop and thus would be “numbered with the eleven apostles”. Furthermore notice what Peter says in Acts 1:20:

" For it is written in the book of Psalms: Let their habitation become desolate, and let there be none to dwell therein. And his bishopric let another take." [Acts 1:20]

So Matthias takes over the bishop’s office that Judas forfeited but since Judas forfeited his office before the Apostles were sent he was never ‘sent’ as were the other eleven.

As for Junia being an apostle, although it is common in some Eastern Churches to call the 72 disciples sent out by Jesus in Luke 10:1 as minor apostles and the term can technically be applied to anyone who is sent, the term in scipture is reserved for those followers of Jesus picked by Him and sent by Him. Therefore, neither Andronicus nor Junia(s) are apostles. Instead I think the key to the passage is in the words, “…who are of note among the apostles” Paul is writing to the Romans and telling them to salute Andronicus and Junia(s). Therefore, if the Romans were to tell them of Paul’s greeting both individuals would have to be in Rome. Paul apparently is not in Rome thus his writing to them. The words *who are of note among the apostles * could mean that Paul mentioned Andronicus and Junia(s) by name to the other Apostles. So to say these two were actual Apostles is a real stretch.

 

[Fidelis]

Junia’s gender as female is seldom questioned among Christian theologians nowadays.

Most Scripture scholars that I’ve seen (theologians are not necessarily Scripture scholars) are silent on this.

Do you have any reliable sources (i.e. citations from orthodox preferably Catholic --Scripture scholars) you can provide us on this? Thanks!

 

[FCEGM]

Janet, this has been discussed on a number of threads over the years.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=5146401&postcount=132

 

[Janet1983]

Janet, this has been discussed on a number of threads over the years.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=5146401&postcount=132

I didn’t read those and I actually never realized that there had been a discussion going on… I just found that verse and a hint and looked into the Greek and it blew my mind…