Fertile on the Wedding Night

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WeddNiteDilemma

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Hey, all. I’m a semi-regular at CAF, but I made this throwaway because, while I’m happy to debate apologetics under my real name, I’d rather not post the intimate deals of my sex life on the internet for all to see.

Anyway. After six years dating the most wonderful woman in my life, I’m getting married on Dec 29th. We’ve done the Catholic thing and (if I may say so) we’ve done it well: we’re still both virgins, and we are using Creighton Model NFP. While we are open to God’s will in our marriage, and will joyfully cooperate in whatever he sends us, we both believe that it is not quite time for us to start raising children. We will be using the method to avoid pregnancy for a little while while she finishes graduate school.

Unfortunately, my bride is fertile right now and has not yet had her Peak day. That means that, even if she has her Peak tomorrow, Dec 26th (which is by no means a sure thing), Dec 29 will still be her Peak+3 – the final day of fertility. According to the method, that is her last day of fertility, and therefore we should abstain.

I have two questions for the family experts here:

(1) Does anyone know what the odds are that we would get pregnant from a single act of intercourse on a Peak+3 day? We would hate to start our marriage by violating the method on the very first night, and we will not do it if it would seriously compromise the plan we’ve prayed over and agreed upon. But, if this one act of intercourse would be a very small risk, we might consider making this single exception for an exceptional day. (And then follow the method perfectly after that forever.)

(2) Our presumption right now, however, is that we are going to abstain from intercourse on our wedding night. This is a huge bummer for both of us, since we’ve both seen intercourse as the culmination of the wedding day and the fulfillment of our wedding vows for months now, and we have really been anticipating it. I’m worried it will put a bit of a pall over our wedding, and that it will lead to a very awkward and difficult end of the night, when we both get in the same bed at a swanky hotel for the first time in our lives and proceed to do… absolutely nothing. It just strikes me right now as unutterably disappointing, and I know my fiancee feels the same way. Do you guys have any advice for us for making the abstinent wedding night bearable, or even fun? I’m sure that we’re not the first NFP users in history to encounter this problem!

Thanks very much for your advice. And if you could spare an ave for us on the occasion of our nuptials, it would be much appreciated!
 
My wife says “You’re just scared, dude. Jump on in.”

Seriously, after six years you’re not ready for kids? There’s never a time when we think we’re “ready”. You still have the illusion that you’re in control. You say that you’re “open to God’s will in our marriage, and will joyfully cooperate in whatever he sends us”. Well, in that case be open to it and joyfully cooperate in it. A loving Catholic couple will end up having a ton of kids if they are both healthy and fertile. That’s just the way it is. They will come when they will come. When you are older, you could well be wishing you had more kids. With eight, we still wish we had another baby.

I have serious concerns that you are starting your marriage with a stance that children need to wait for you to get all of your ducks in a row. If you’re getting married, you should already be ready for the children who will inevitably result, and often sooner than you want them too. My wife and I wanted to delay children. Thank God they came right away. Our oldest two are great people! I would hate to think how my life would have been if my puny little plans had worked out. You’re getting married. Make love on your wedding night. If you don’t, I have several uncharitable things that I will refrain from typing. :eek:😛
 
Be open to God’s will for your life, and trust in what ever the Lord may have planned for either of you. I’m fairly confident in saying that nobody here, despite claims of omniscience, can know let alone predict whether or not your wife has a chance of pregnancy. May God Bless you abundantly in these upcoming days as you prepare to celebrate such a beautiful Sacrament, and also . . .

 
mdleagedguy said:
Seriously, after six years you’re not ready for kids?.. A loving Catholic couple will end up having a ton of kids if they are both healthy and fertile. That’s just the way it is… Make love on your wedding night. If you don’t, I have several uncharitable things that I will refrain from typing. :eek:😛
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This is why I never post in Family Life. It seems there is a huge contingent of people here who are do not just question the prudential judgement of another couple they’ve never met (which is fair enough, and which I would do if I read a post like mine from somebody else), but are happy to chuck that prudential judgement completely out the window, instruct the couple to start makin’ babies, and damn the consequences! Otherwise they’ll think uncharitable things about you!

Using Natural Family Planning to avoid pregnancy, when “just reasons” exist, is cooperating in God’s will. That’s why Catholics are permitted to use it. Catholics have been blessed with the special gift of right reason (a gift of the Holy Spirit!), and it is the holy duty of spouses to use it. It may be a cross at times, just as having kids may be a cross at times. If it’s a cross on my wedding night, so be it. I’m not asking you to prove to me the cross doesn’t exist; I’m asking you how I can make it lighter to bear.

A larger point: I know many big Catholic families, and many of them are very happy. It’s wonderful, and I wish big families were not so scorned by our mainstream culture. Other big Catholic families of my acquaintance, however, are deeply dysfunctional, deeply miserable, and (after many years) now deeply alienated from the Church. They were brought into the world by parents who, presumptuously, believed it would all work out just because they really wanted to have sex with each other. And it assuredly did not. They believed themselves to be having so many children because of generosity – but it was really a form of unchastity. They abandoned reason to overindulge their licit marital desires, and, rather than raising six saints, raised twelve fierce enemies of the Church.

So, yes, some are called to parent big families. But some, assuredly, are not. The prejudice leveled against small Catholic families (for prejudice is what it has become in forums like this) has got to end.

My wife-to-be and I are not in control of our fertility. If we are given a child in a time of expected infertility, then it was God’s will and nothing could be better. If He believes our plans are ill-made, He will shatter them, and I look forward to whatever He decides. But we are in control of our genitals, and we will not rashly ask for children with them if, after prayerful consideration, we consider it unwise. We will not “jump on in.”

All the same, thank you (and your wife) for your honest advice.

EDIT: Thanks also to CallMeCatholic. I love Papa Bene, but boy do I miss JPII.
 
God bless you and make your marriage long and happy.

There is this thought: after a long and tiring day preparing for the wedding, celebrating it, going to the reception (don’t know what you plan, but I’ve been to some that went on forever- like to 2 AM), and forgetting to eat, you and your lovely bride may be exhausted. You might consider resting up the first night, so that you’re actually rested and conscious the second.
P.S. Don’t forget to eat, and not just wedding cake!
 
WeddNiteDilemma said:
Hey, all. I’m a semi-regular at CAF, but I made this throwaway because, while I’m happy to debate apologetics under my real name, I’d rather not post the intimate deals of my sex life on the internet for all to see.

Anyway. After six years dating the most wonderful woman in my life, I’m getting married on Dec 29th. We’ve done the Catholic thing and (if I may say so) we’ve done it well: we’re still both virgins, and we are using Creighton Model NFP. While we are open to God’s will in our marriage, and will joyfully cooperate in whatever he sends us, we both believe that it is not quite time for us to start raising children. We will be using the method to avoid pregnancy for a little while while she finishes graduate school.

Unfortunately, my bride is fertile right now and has not yet had her Peak day. That means that, even if she has her Peak tomorrow, Dec 26th (which is by no means a sure thing), Dec 29 will still be her Peak+3 – the final day of fertility. According to the method, that is her last day of fertility, and therefore we should abstain.

I have two questions for the family experts here:

(1) Does anyone know what the odds are that we would get pregnant from a single act of intercourse on a Peak+3 day? We would hate to start our marriage by violating the method on the very first night, and we will not do it if it would seriously compromise the plan we’ve prayed over and agreed upon. But, if this one act of intercourse would be a very small risk, we might consider making this single exception for an exceptional day. (And then follow the method perfectly after that forever.)

(2) Our presumption right now, however, is that we are going to abstain from intercourse on our wedding night. This is a huge bummer for both of us, since we’ve both seen intercourse as the culmination of the wedding day and the fulfillment of our wedding vows for months now, and we have really been anticipating it. I’m worried it will put a bit of a pall over our wedding, and that it will lead to a very awkward and difficult end of the night, when we both get in the same bed at a swanky hotel for the first time in our lives and proceed to do… absolutely nothing. It just strikes me right now as unutterably disappointing, and I know my fiancee feels the same way. Do you guys have any advice for us for making the abstinent wedding night bearable, or even fun? I’m sure that we’re not the first NFP users in history to encounter this problem!

Thanks very much for your advice. And if you could spare an ave for us on the occasion of our nuptials, it would be much appreciated!
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My wife and I didn’t ahem on our wedding night. We were both too tired from all the activities of the day. Just plan a fun busy day. You’ve waited 6 years, a few more days shouldn’t ruin anything. Just make the focus of the few days something else (like getting an early start on your joint tax return, government paperwork has a way of killing the “mood.”)
 
Honestly…from my experience…the chances of conceiving on peak +3 is very low

I practice sympto-themal and took the home class course…from my understanding, and from what the book teaches, it’s to cover the possibility of a second ovulation. A woman’s egg is only alive for 24 hours when she ovulates. Theoretically, you’d be okay by the second day after peak day…but it’s there to cover your bases.

I have my own personal opinion, now, about marriage and children. Personally I don’t think your entirely ready to get married unless your entirely open to having children from day one…but that is my opinion. That is not what the church teaches. Therefore, here is my story and my experience…

Hubby and I have practiced STM for almost a year now. We haven’t been following all of the rules and while we’ve gone ahead and had marital relations are soon as the morning after peak day…I still haven’t gotten pregnant yet.
I know I’m fertile but I suppose God isn’t ready us to have another.

I went into my wedding night with the same apprehension as you…but an entirely different situation.
I was literally 7 weeks Postpartum on our wedding night and my cycles had returned at 5 weeks (LO didn’t take to BF despite a monumental effort on my part).
My doctor had given us the green light but I only had just learned the method of STM and had never practiced it. I had no idea if I was fertile or not…for all I knew we would be having a wedding night on peak day…barely two months after I had given birth.
Besides, it was my first night away from our daughter and I cried the entire way over to the hotel after leaving her at my parents house (at a hotel that was only ten minutes away).

My husband stopped the car and asked me if I was ready for this. He was prepared to turn around and go back to pick up our daughter and guarantee a sexless wedding night.
But, I swallowed my fears…accepted God’s will (whatever it may be) and we checked into our hotel and had a wonderful wedding night.

Obviously, the difference here between me and you…is the fact that sex was not new to my husband and I. We had been chaste for my entire pregnancy (as we had decided to enter the church and had started RCIA) but it wasn’t new.
However, that fear was all the same.

The simple solution is you either decide you don’t want to take the chance and abstain (even if it’s your wedding night…you aren’t obligated to have sex on your wedding night, despite popular belief) or you accept God’s will and take the chance.

But that is on the two of you and God, no one else.

Sex will be new to you. It’s overwhelming. It’s an entirely new experience. You may want to just enjoy each other’s company by sleeping in the same bed together on your wedding night.

We were exhausted after our wedding. We had a new baby, just finished closing on our first house and my husband was still working overnights at a highly stressful job while I was at home caring for an infant all day and night.
We could have easily had the wedding and taken the opportunity to just sleep, in a quiet room, without interruption. We almost did. But, we said a prayer and decided to celebrate the conclusion to a very eventful year.

Like I said…the answer to the problem is if you two are that serious about not wanting children just yet…then you’ll have to abstain on your wedding night.
You can still enjoy your day and enjoy the fact that you are starting a new life together as one person.
You aren’t getting married to have sex. You are getting married to start a new life and you won’t be having sex all the time during marriage anyway.

Pray about it some more and talk to your fiance about it.
But it’s entirely okay to abstain on your wedding night.
 
Hmm…

Peak + 3 could definately conceive with Creighton. Say the 26th is not peak but the 27th, then she’d only be peak + 2. So a honeymoon baby could be a possiblility.

Also, with Creighton you should factor in stress this cycle. Weddings are stressful.

Congratulations and God bless on your upcoming marriage.
 
First, I don’t blame anyone for wanting to “get their ducks in a row” (like finishing grad school) before starting a family. Nobody can tell you that you and your soon-to-be wife are wrong because they have not walked in your shoes (just their own).

I don’t know the odds of conceiving on that particular day, but I do know from experience that you may be too tired to do anything after the reception. It’s a long, tiring day, especially if you have a late afternoon wedding and evening reception. If you are still “fresh” after the reception, you can go out for a late supper and maybe some dancing to get you too tired to want to do anything? If you are will be in the city, maybe take a nice, evening stroll around town and bask in your new status as husband and wife?

There will be times when you will not be able to “come together” once you are married and waiting will make it that much more special when you finally do come together. If you and your fiancee feel that you will be disappointed by not consummating your marriage on your wedding night, or if it is awkward or difficult to refrain from those activities, then you two will have to come to the point where you can “let go and let God.” My suggestion is for you and your new wife to pray together about this after the wedding.

:byzsoc: for your upcoming nuptials and for your marriage. May it be always blessed.
 
I have no advice for you, we had the same problem. We got married two weeks ago.
We talked about it, but decided to abstain in the end.
We missed it, but there are other ways to show affection, and we have our whole life ahead of us to make up for it.
 
Honestly, I agree with everyone else that said on your wedding day, you may be too tired for anything more than falling into bed and going to sleep! It is a tiring day, though wonderful. Congratulations and best wishes to you!
 
Irishmom2 said:
Honestly, I agree with everyone else that said on your wedding day, you may be too tired for anything more than falling into bed and going to sleep! It is a tiring day, though wonderful. Congratulations and best wishes to you!
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Agreed! And it’s your decision as to when you feel your’re ready for children, no matter how long you’ve been together. As to when you will actually have children, that is of course up to God. 🙂
 
If a couple is not ready for children, then it is not time for marriage.

Just sayin.
 
mdleagedguy said:
A loving Catholic couple will end up having a ton of kids if they are both healthy and fertile.
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No. That’s not “the way it is”, and it’s not even what the Church teaches. The OP did not ask for opinions on this personal decision. He asked for advice on how to deal with a potentially abstinent wedding night.

OP, I don’t use Creighton so I’m no help there. But I can tell you that the other posters who have described how tired you will be are right. It will be disappointing, but yes you can make it bearable and fun! You will have plenty to do. Order room service, open your cards and gifts, reminisce about the wedding day. I promise you it will still be very intimate falling asleep with your new wife. And in the morning, when you’re both rested, you can make up for lost time, provided that her cycle is regular this month. Lots of people forego sex on the wedding night, for varying reasons. It’s okay, and it won’t ruin your memories.
 
Congrats on your upcoming nuptials!

My husband and I prayed just like you before our wedding, but God gave us a different answer and we did not abstain on our wedding night (I was just passed peak, so it took 5 weeks to conceive our “honeymoon baby” 🙂 ).

I do believe some people have grave reasons for postponing children, and I trust that you have discerned them!!! So do not let others make you feel bad (people also criticize those of us who don’t wait to have children).

All that said, I have read about dedicating your wedding night to St. Joseph and I think prayer with the Holy Family could be a beautiful thing to do while abstaining.
 
May God bless both of you with a wonderful marriage.

As others have stated both of you are going to be exhausted. I know both of you have waited a long time for this night. Climb in bed and cuddle. Call her Mrs LastName a few times. Hold each other as you fall asleep. Your first time should be special. Take your time and enjoy each other. Wouldn’t you rather have really wonderful memories of your first time together instead of years later looking back and thinking why did we rush it.

As you have stated God is in control of when you have children.
 
Congrats on your upcoming wedding! I used to teach Creighton. Remember from your intro session and follow ups with your practitioner that the peak +3 rule is because ovulation has to been detected in women up to 3 days past the peak. Since the egg can live up to 24 hours after ovulation, you need to abstain until the end of the 4th day.

You asked about chances and no one can give them to you. Your intended may never ovulate that late in her cycle or she may always. I don’t know how realistic this is, but you might be able to find a doctor who you feel can reliably determine via bloodworm that she ovulated more than 24 hours prior to your wedding night. The only other way would be ultrasound to check for a ruptured follicle. Only then, I think, can you start looking at chances.

And even with that info, I would still consider it possible to get pregnant not following the rules. After all, considering it is the Christmas season, women do get pregnant even with when seemingly impossible! Look at Rachel, Sara, Elizabeth, and Mary! (And while not a holy woman like these, I have also conceived and given birth after years -more than a decade- of infertility!)

God bless and Merry Christmas!
 
WeddNiteDilemma said:
This is why I never post in Family Life. It seems there is a huge contingent of people here who are do not just question the prudential judgement of another couple they’ve never met (which is fair enough, and which I would do if I read a post like mine from somebody else), but are happy to chuck that prudential judgement completely out the window, instruct the couple to start makin’ babies, and damn the consequences! Otherwise they’ll think uncharitable things about you!

Using Natural Family Planning to avoid pregnancy, when “just reasons” exist, is cooperating in God’s will. That’s why Catholics are permitted to use it. Catholics have been blessed with the special gift of right reason (a gift of the Holy Spirit!), and it is the holy duty of spouses to use it. It may be a cross at times, just as having kids may be a cross at times. If it’s a cross on my wedding night, so be it. I’m not asking you to prove to me the cross doesn’t exist; I’m asking you how I can make it lighter to bear.

A larger point: I know many big Catholic families, and many of them are very happy. It’s wonderful, and I wish big families were not so scorned by our mainstream culture. Other big Catholic families of my acquaintance, however, are deeply dysfunctional, deeply miserable, and (after many years) now deeply alienated from the Church. They were brought into the world by parents who, presumptuously, believed it would all work out just because they really wanted to have sex with each other. And it assuredly did not. They believed themselves to be having so many children because of generosity – but it was really a form of unchastity. They abandoned reason to overindulge their licit marital desires, and, rather than raising six saints, raised twelve fierce enemies of the Church.

So, yes, some are called to parent big families. But some, assuredly, are not. The prejudice leveled against small Catholic families (for prejudice is what it has become in forums like this) has got to end.

My wife-to-be and I are not in control of our fertility. If we are given a child in a time of expected infertility, then it was God’s will and nothing could be better. If He believes our plans are ill-made, He will shatter them, and I look forward to whatever He decides. But we are in control of our genitals, and we will not rashly ask for children with them if, after prayerful consideration, we consider it unwise. We will not “jump on in.”

All the same, thank you (and your wife) for your honest advice.

EDIT: Thanks also to CallMeCatholic. I love Papa Bene, but boy do I miss JPII.
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I was not questioning your prudential judgement. I was pointing out the very obvious contradiction within your post. You said you were open to life, but then indicated you were not. Marriage is ordered to the bearing and raising of children. You very clearly indicated that you don’t want that to happen yet. The tone of your response reinforces this. At no point did I say there was anything wrong with a small family. I indicated that you should be prepared for a large family, because that often happens.

My wife and I have been married twenty-one years. We have a little bit of experience with this sort of thing. How you start a project can affect how that project proceeds later. It can take years to get over the early mistakes. I’m sure you will protest this, however by your actions you will be starting a marriage afraid of your own wife’s fertility. You can protest about “prudential judgement”, and it’s certainly good to exercise prudential judgement, but it can also become a justification for something else. That’s what you need to guard against.
 
Lorelei12 said:
No. That’s not “the way it is”, and it’s not even what the Church teaches. The OP did not ask for opinions on this personal decision. He asked for advice on how to deal with a potentially abstinent wedding night.

OP, I don’t use Creighton so I’m no help there. But I can tell you that the other posters who have described how tired you will be are right. It will be disappointing, but yes you can make it bearable and fun! You will have plenty to do. Order room service, open your cards and gifts, reminisce about the wedding day. I promise you it will still be very intimate falling asleep with your new wife. And the next day, when you’re both rested, you can make up for lost time, provided that her cycle is regular this month. Lots of people forego sex on the wedding night, for varying reasons. It’s okay, and it won’t ruin your memories.
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mdleagedguy said:
I was not questioning your prudential judgement. I was pointing out the very obvious contradiction within your post. You said you were open to life, but then indicated you were not. Marriage is ordered to the bearing and raising of children. You very clearly indicated that you don’t want that to happen yet. The tone of your response reinforces this. At no point did I say there was anything wrong with a small family. I indicated that you should be prepared for a large family, because that often happens.

My wife and I have been married twenty-one years. We have a little bit of experience with this sort of thing. How you start a project can affect how that project proceeds later. It can take years to get over the early mistakes. I’m sure you will protest this, however by your actions you will be starting a marriage afraid of your own wife’s fertility. You can protest about “prudential judgement”, and it’s certainly good to exercise prudential judgement, but it can also become a justification for something else. That’s what you need to guard against.
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This post simply reinforces the problem that WeddNiteDilemma had with your first post.

It’s hard to realize that some people can be just as right as you even if they don’t follow the path you followed.
 
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