Fiance's Masturbation

[BigBlueCane]

Recently, I asked my fiancé if he ever masturbated, and he said that he does daily. However, he does not think this is a sin. He doesn’t see why God would care about that. Does anyone have any advice on how to help see that it is wrong?

We are both Catholic, but a while ago, I had a deepening of my faith and a really strong desire for chastity. I decided that we had to stop sleeping together. He didn’t like that decision, but he has accepted it. But now that I’m talking to him about his masturbating, he’s upset that “I’m trying to take that away from him too.”

Men masturbate less and less when we’re getting sex. When we aren’t then whatever built up semen there is will find a way to get out. Biologically it must be expelled one way or another so sometimes the urge to do that is great.

Now you’ve made a personal decision and he seems to respect it but you should also respect his decisions. You can’t pound him over the head with it otherwise he just won’t tell you things in the future. IMO masturbation is a problem if it is abused. Believe it or not many men do it just to be able to go to sleep.

If the worst that he’s doing is masturbating then you’re doing ok.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Men masturbate less and less when we’re getting sex. When we aren’t then whatever built up semen there is will find a way to get out. Biologically it must be expelled one way or another so sometimes the urge to do that is great.

Now you’ve made a personal decision and he seems to respect it but you should also respect his decisions. You can’t pound him over the head with it otherwise he just won’t tell you things in the future. IMO masturbation is a problem if it is abused. Believe it or not many men do it just to be able to go to sleep.

If the worst that he’s doing is masturbating then you’re doing ok.

Men masturbate less and less when we’re getting sex. When we aren’t then whatever built up semen there is will find a way to get out.

This is not necessarily true. What you are mistakenly believing is that if a man is sexually satisfied he will not be sexually immoral (masturbate) I know plenty of men who masturbate MORE because they are sexually active. The OP’s fiancee is called to chastity even more so that they are not married. Using your logic, it would be almost a medical necessity for priests to masturbate. Or for a man who’s wife was suffering and could not perform the marital act to fall into sin just because he is a “man”

Now you’ve made a personal decision and he seems to respect it but you should also respect his decisions.

No, one should not “respect” the decision of one’s future spouse to be in unrepentant grave sin. That is not a good idea for marriage.

You can’t pound him over the head with it otherwise he just won’t tell you things in the future.

Accept it and leave him alone about it or he will lie to you later? That is not what a husband and wife should do! It is our job to help the other person achieve heaven and be holy.

IMO masturbation is a problem if it is abused.

If you wish to be a Catholic in good standing and receive the Eucharist you need to drop the “if it is abused” off of the end of that sentence.

If the worst that he’s doing is masturbating then you’re doing ok

This is the biggest problem I have with your post. So, if when one is discerning the type of man to marry, one finds out that the man is in the habit of committing sexual sin and finds nothing wrong with it then you think that they are doing “ok” and that the future relationship is nothing to worry about? If the person is not understanding the morality of sex with himself then how about when NFP is hard to practice. Or when his wife has a tough pregnancy and needs a close chaste husband to sacrifice his own urges and needs for her and her family? How about when the marriage is struggling and an opportunity presents itself to the man who may be in a moment of weakness? Shouldn’t he have a moral reference and track record that helps him make a harder decision than “should I relieve myself?” No sir, I think you are quite wrong that potential mortal sin and not understanding basic sexuality is “doing ok” for a spouse.

 

[BigBlueCane]

This is not necessarily true. What you are mistakenly believing is that if a man is sexually satisfied he will not be sexually immoral (masturbate) I know plenty of men who masturbate MORE because they are sexually active. The OP’s fiancee is called to chastity even more so that they are not married. Using your logic, it would be almost a medical necessity for priests to masturbate. Or for a man who’s wife was suffering and could not perform the marital act to fall into sin just because he is a “man”

Really? I’d like to meet the men who admitted to you that they are sexually active and because of that masturbate more. Men don’t like to admit that they masturbate. Sure plenty of men still masturbate even while getting sex but it becomes less and less. Its physically difficult to masturbate and get stimulated when you are sexually active and have nothing left in your body.

Either way its going to come out. That is a medical and biological fact. Now you can do it yourself or the body will do it for you but its coming out.

No, one should not “respect” the decision of one’s future spouse to be in unrepentant grave sin. That is not a good idea for marriage.

Really? So you should just pound them over the head with what YOU think they should be doing? Oh ok gotcha. It seems to me thats the worse idea for marriage…don’t respect the other person for what you believe religiously. The only thing that matters is what YOU think right? Yup good recipe for marriage.

Accept it and leave him alone about it or he will lie to you later? That is not what a husband and wife should do! It is our job to help the other person achieve heaven and be holy.

I didn’t say that. I said if you start being like Vladimir Putin and try to tell him what he can do privately by forcing it on him then next time around he will just lie to you because he doesn’t want to hear you complain about it. You aren’t going to know if he masturbated or not so the easier thing to do is say “yeah honey don’t worry I don’t do it anymore.”

If you want to make someone “holy and achieve heaven” then the best way is to convince them and not to force them into it. Of course thats accepting the notion that you can’t achieve heaven because gasp…you masturbate!!

If you wish to be a Catholic in good standing and receive the Eucharist you need to drop the “if it is abused” off of the end of that sentence.

There is a difference between masturbating and completely abusing masturbation. Thankfully you aren’t the one judging anyone else. You need to accept the fact that close to 100% of catholic males masturbate at one time or another. That doesn’t make them any less catholic.

This is the biggest problem I have with your post. So, if when one is discerning the type of man to marry, one finds out that the man is in the habit of committing sexual sin and finds nothing wrong with it then you think that they are doing “ok” and that the future relationship is nothing to worry about? If the person is not understanding the morality of sex with himself then how about when NFP is hard to practice. Or when his wife has a tough pregnancy and needs a close chaste husband to sacrifice his own urges and needs for her and her family? How about when the marriage is struggling and an opportunity presents itself to the man who may be in a moment of weakness? Shouldn’t he have a moral reference and track record that helps him make a harder decision than “should I relieve myself?” No sir, I think you are quite wrong that potential mortal sin and not understanding basic sexuality is “doing ok” for a spouse.

No I think you are just quite unrealistic and dictatorial in your approach not to mention have a bad lack of priorities. If the worse thing a husband does is masturbate every so often and he is ideal in every other category then thats a lucky woman. You seem to act like someone can be perfect. People will make mistakes, people will sin, spouses will have flaws and if you’re a spouse I would think you’d rather have your husband masturbate and not go out and have an affair. Of course like I said if there is a healthy sexual relationship then the need to masturbate will be lessened.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Really? I’d like to meet the men who admitted to you that they are sexually active and because of that masturbate more. Men don’t like to admit that they masturbate. Sure plenty of men still masturbate even while getting sex but it becomes less and less. Its physically difficult to masturbate and get stimulated when you are sexually active and have nothing left in your body.

Either way its going to come out. That is a medical and biological fact. Now you can do it yourself or the body will do it for you but its coming out.

Really? So you should just pound them over the head with what YOU think they should be doing? Oh ok gotcha. It seems to me thats the worse idea for marriage…don’t respect the other person for what you believe religiously. The only thing that matters is what YOU think right? Yup good recipe for marriage.

I didn’t say that. I said if you start being like Vladimir Putin and try to tell him what he can do privately by forcing it on him then next time around he will just lie to you because he doesn’t want to hear you complain about it. You aren’t going to know if he masturbated or not so the easier thing to do is say “yeah honey don’t worry I don’t do it anymore.”

If you want to make someone “holy and achieve heaven” then the best way is to convince them and not to force them into it. Of course thats accepting the notion that you can’t achieve heaven because gasp…you masturbate!!

There is a difference between masturbating and completely abusing masturbation. Thankfully you aren’t the one judging anyone else. You need to accept the fact that close to 100% of catholic males masturbate at one time or another. That doesn’t make them any less catholic.

No I think you are just quite unrealistic and dictatorial in your approach not to mention have a bad lack of priorities. If the worse thing a husband does is masturbate every so often and he is ideal in every other category then thats a lucky woman. You seem to act like someone can be perfect. People will make mistakes, people will sin, spouses will have flaws and if you’re a spouse I would think you’d rather have your husband masturbate and not go out and have an affair. Of course like I said if there is a healthy sexual relationship then the need to masturbate will be lessened.

Do you agree with the Church and God Himself that masturbation is grave matter and can constitute mortal sin which not repented of leads to hell? Do you agree with the Church that Chastity is a virtue and should be observed? Do you agree that masturbation and not trying to change it equals sin?

Or do you just like to justify a sin that is hard to quit?

No matter what your problem with the idea of marital fidelity you should at least acknowledge that the OP should be on the same page as her fiance and that it can be a red flag for a healthy marriage.

There are many masturbation threads on here and you might benefit from reading up on the issue. You seem to be mistaken on a few things.

 

[Aaron_Brrr]

I will caveat this by stating that I am not Catholic, but if this is a grave a matter as represented on this forum, then heaven will be 95% female.

 

[SuperLuigi]

I will caveat this by stating that I am not Catholic, but if this is a grave a matter as represented on this forum, then heaven will be 95% female.

1. Grave matter is not enough to condemn someone to hell.
2. There is also Purgatory

 

[SuperLuigi]

To elaborate:

If the original writer on this thread wants to suspend the marriage, that is her choice, and I do not believe that any of us are better qualified to make that decision for her, especially if she is thinking this through, seeing a priest and getting informed.

The point I am making is that delaying a wedding and making an engagement last longer has the potential for trouble, even ending the relationship.

It boils down to a matter of personal preference. Certainly, there are women on here who do not like the idea of their partner masturbating. Well, I’m a guy and I wouldn’t want that at all either.

 

[irishlass3399]

Wow. This became a far more heated debate than I had anticipated when I posted this.

I think it needs to be said that there is not, nor was there ever, any thought of leaving my fiancé or postponing our wedding. While I can understand the concern of those members suggesting such a thing, I find it rather presumptuous that they would suggest leaving him while only knowing this one, very small portion of our relationship. He is a wonderfully caring person, and if I did not think he could stay faithful to me no matter what the circumstances, I would not have said yes!

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Wow. This became a far more heated debate than I had anticipated when I posted this.

I think it needs to be said that there is not, nor was there ever, any thought of leaving my fiancé or postponing our wedding. While I can understand the concern of those members suggesting such a thing, I find it rather presumptuous that they would suggest leaving him while only knowing this one, very small portion of our relationship. He is a wonderfully caring person, and if I did not think he could stay faithful to me no matter what the circumstances, I would not have said yes!

The only reason it is even brought up is not because anyone is saying “don’t marry a sinner” because then no one would get married. But I can tell you, and it is evident from several threads on this site that there are many women who find out about this later, or find out it is more severe than they thought, or find out that it can lead to far more troubling things and they are devastated. The pain many marriages and families feel is tremendous and should not be taken lightly. But if you feel that you are ok with this and it does not raise questions and doubts in your head and that you know the extent of it. Go right ahead!

Just please don’t stop trying to lead him to Holiness. And please discuss the extent of this as it will pertain to your sex life. Discuss NFP, discuss abstinence and discuss the Church and God. You absolutely MUST feel confident about these things or you could be in mortal jeopardy as well as marital misery.

You did not elaborate more on any conversations or future conversations you plan on having. There have been some questions and WE DEMAND ANSWERS!

Remember that not I nor anyone on these forums know anything about your relationship except what you have shared. I know this. And I accept that only you and this man are privy to the innerworkings and feelings involved.

Just please please be the one that posts in five years that they have a wonderful family and the husband is amazing and the kids are cute and he is a great dad! Don’t be the one who is posting that they wonder if a lingering difference in sexual morality is a problem in their marriage and they are at their wits end!

 

[Maine52]

The only reason it is even brought up is not because anyone is saying “don’t marry a sinner” because then no one would get married. But I can tell you, and it is evident from several threads on this site that there are many women who find out about this later, or find out it is more severe than they thought, or find out that it can lead to far more troubling things and they are devastated. The pain many marriages and families feel is tremendous and should not be taken lightly. But if you feel that you are ok with this and it does not raise questions and doubts in your head and that you know the extent of it. Go right ahead!

Just please don’t stop trying to lead him to Holiness. And please discuss the extent of this as it will pertain to your sex life. Discuss NFP, discuss abstinence and discuss the Church and God. You absolutely MUST feel confident about these things or you could be in mortal jeopardy as well as marital misery.

You did not elaborate more on any conversations or future conversations you plan on having. There have been some questions and WE DEMAND ANSWERS!

Remember that not I nor anyone on these forums know anything about your relationship except what you have shared. I know this. And I accept that only you and this man are privy to the innerworkings and feelings involved.

Just please please be the one that posts in five years that they have a wonderful family and the husband is amazing and the kids are cute and he is a great dad! Don’t be the one who is posting that they wonder if a lingering difference in sexual morality is a problem in their marriage and they are at their wits end!

Beautifully said!

 

[faber7]

God Bless everyone on this thread - lots of thoughtful comments. There is nothing “normal” about masturbating daily and there’s no science confirming the old guy adage/excuse “Deadly Sperm Buildup”. The pull is strong; we fail and we continue to try but we should never try to justify with “guys NEED to come often”. We aren’t animals and it’s not at all “healthy” as I’ve heard from so many. That statement speaks more about those saying it than it does about the act. The Catechism is so very clear on this as with other habits that lead down certain paths. That our current culture “celebrates” this behavior should be a clear warning to people of faith.

These habits progress like other addictions or as CS Lewis put it: “An ever increasing desire with an ever decreasing satisfaction.” As some eloquently stated earlier, “you can’t force anyone to do anything”, but a man in true love with a woman does not need or require a release of sperm via fantasy. It’s simply not true. Yes, we fail and often, but please don’t pretend that it’s “ok”. Sin is never “ok”. Loving honesty with your Fiancee now will pay tremendous dividends down the road. All marriages involve two “fallen souls”; we know this, but we shouldn’t pretend the behavior above is normal and wish it away. This is a fight. What does your Fiancee think about the catechism’s treatment of masturbation? If daily maturation is ok, is twice daily masturbation ok as well? Is it also ok to use porn or others outside the marriage to excite oneself? Is it really just a personal preference depending on libido? Of course not; it’s an inordinate love of pleasure and inordinate love of oneself - an insidious habit that leads to worse. I remind myself daily “With God all things are possible.” - And I remind myself that this DOES NOT mean “With God, anything goes”. God grant you and your Fiancee peace, wisdom and the courage to face these challenges.

 

[Maine52]

Wow. This became a far more heated debate than I had anticipated when I posted this.

I think it needs to be said that there is not, nor was there ever, any thought of leaving my fiancé or postponing our wedding. While I can understand the concern of those members suggesting such a thing, I find it rather presumptuous that they would suggest leaving him while only knowing this one, very small portion of our relationship. He is a wonderfully caring person, and if I did not think he could stay faithful to me no matter what the circumstances, I would not have said yes!

There are a great number of wonderfully caring individuals out there who are great to be friends with and have in your life but would not be a good choice of a spouse simply because they don’t share your values. I personally know several gentleman who are great to talk to, vent to, share a meal with (all in the presence of my husband, of course ), etc. But I couldn’t see myself married to any of them because they do not share my values. They think premarital sex and contraception are ok. That is something that would not work for me because I will not compromise my adherence to the Church’s teachings.

What are your views on NFP? Do you wish to practice it once married? If so, I will warn you that it is not easy. Although a woman’s true fertile phase is very short, most systems of NFP that carry a 99% effectiveness rating usually require abstinence that extends beyond the true fertile window just to be safe. If you wish to use NFP to space children after the birth of a baby, it becomes even more of a challenge. While your hormones are readjusting post partum, your body will throw out fertile signals almost continuously and you are not sure whether you are truly fertile or not, so you will just have to abstain for months - yes, months - at a time. My husband and I were lucky if we had two days once every two months to be intimate after our baby was born. Will your fiancé be able to handle this?

I am incredibly blessed with a husband who is faithful to all of the Church’s teachings, believes in them, and wants to follow them because he agrees with them. He is one of the most unselfish people I know, always putting me and our child before himself. He never demands sex of me, even in marriage. During the long fertile phases, he finds other ways to be close to me and adheres to the abstinence without complaining.

Even if you don’t agree with/wish to practice NFP, there will inevitably be times when sex is not possible. After you have a child, the doctors will require that you abstain for at least 6 - 8 weeks after the baby is born so you can heal. How would your fiancé handle this? How would your fiancé handle things if you, God forbid, acquired a medical problem that required total abstinence from sex for an indefinite period of time?

I’m sure he would stay true to you no matter what - that is, he would not divorce you. I’m sure he wouldn’t divorce you under and circumstances. That doesn’t mean your marriage will not be, well frankly, a living hell. As HoosierDaddy pointed out, there are many threads on here about people who are miserable in their marriages because their spouse does not share their beliefs and turns to things such s masturbation and pornography, making them feel humiliated and degraded. My parents stayed true to each other no matter what, but their marriage was a living hell due to certain issues (not sexual, but serious nonetheless). Not to mention it was a living hell for me, the child.

You say he is a wonderfully caring person, and I believe you. I’m sure he is a great person who is kind, thoughtful, generous, caring, and wonderful. The question is not whether he is a great person. The question is ARE YOU COMPATIBLE ENOUGH TO BE HUSBAND AND WIFE?

 

[Sugabee43]

There are a great number of wonderfully caring individuals out there who are great to be friends with and have in your life but would not be a good choice of a spouse simply because they don’t share your values. I personally know several gentleman who are great to talk to, vent to, share a meal with (all in the presence of my husband, of course ), etc. But I couldn’t see myself married to any of them because they do not share my values. They think premarital sex and contraception are ok. That is something that would not work for me because I will not compromise my adherence to the Church’s teachings.

What are your views on NFP? Do you wish to practice it once married? If so, I will warn you that it is not easy. Although a woman’s true fertile phase is very short, most systems of NFP that carry a 99% effectiveness rating usually require abstinence that extends beyond the true fertile window just to be safe. If you wish to use NFP to space children after the birth of a baby, it becomes even more of a challenge. While your hormones are readjusting post partum, your body will throw out fertile signals almost continuously and you are not sure whether you are truly fertile or not, so you will just have to abstain for months - yes, months - at a time. My husband and I were lucky if we had two days once every two months to be intimate after our baby was born. Will your fiancé be able to handle this?

I am incredibly blessed with a husband who is faithful to all of the Church’s teachings, believes in them, and wants to follow them because he agrees with them. He is one of the most unselfish people I know, always putting me and our child before himself. He never demands sex of me, even in marriage. During the long fertile phases, he finds other ways to be close to me and adheres to the abstinence without complaining.

Even if you don’t agree with/wish to practice NFP, there will inevitably be times when sex is not possible. After you have a child, the doctors will require that you abstain for at least 6 - 8 weeks after the baby is born so you can heal. How would your fiancé handle this? How would your fiancé handle things if you, God forbid, acquired a medical problem that required total abstinence from sex for an indefinite period of time?

I’m sure he would stay true to you no matter what - that is, he would not divorce you. I’m sure he wouldn’t divorce you under and circumstances. That doesn’t mean your marriage will not be, well frankly, a living hell. As HoosierDaddy pointed out, there are many threads on here about people who are miserable in their marriages because their spouse does not share their beliefs and turns to things such s masturbation and pornography, making them feel humiliated and degraded. My parents stayed true to each other no matter what, but their marriage was a living hell due to certain issues (not sexual, but serious nonetheless). Not to mention it was a living hell for me, the child.

You say he is a wonderfully caring person, and I believe you. I’m sure he is a great person who is kind, thoughtful, generous, caring, and wonderful. The question is not whether he is a great person. The question is ARE YOU COMPATIBLE ENOUGH TO BE HUSBAND AND WIFE?

Hear, Hear!! A very good reply. I have zero to add to that, other than I speak from personal experience on this very issue. Would that I had known ahead of time, rather than after!!

 

[irishlass3399]

The only reason it is even brought up is not because anyone is saying “don’t marry a sinner” because then no one would get married. But I can tell you, and it is evident from several threads on this site that there are many women who find out about this later, or find out it is more severe than they thought, or find out that it can lead to far more troubling things and they are devastated. The pain many marriages and families feel is tremendous and should not be taken lightly. But if you feel that you are ok with this and it does not raise questions and doubts in your head and that you know the extent of it. Go right ahead!

Just please don’t stop trying to lead him to Holiness. And please discuss the extent of this as it will pertain to your sex life. Discuss NFP, discuss abstinence and discuss the Church and God. You absolutely MUST feel confident about these things or you could be in mortal jeopardy as well as marital misery.

You did not elaborate more on any conversations or future conversations you plan on having. There have been some questions and WE DEMAND ANSWERS!

Remember that not I nor anyone on these forums know anything about your relationship except what you have shared. I know this. And I accept that only you and this man are privy to the innerworkings and feelings involved.

Just please please be the one that posts in five years that they have a wonderful family and the husband is amazing and the kids are cute and he is a great dad! Don’t be the one who is posting that they wonder if a lingering difference in sexual morality is a problem in their marriage and they are at their wits end!

Thank you for your advice! We have talked about it, and I decided that I had to let him figure this one out on his own. He has only just started coming back to the Church, and I think I was doing more harm than good by pushing him. I won’t stop trying to lead him deeper in faith, but I need to let him do it at his own pace. He will get there!

We still have some things to talk about, but we will be ready when our wedding comes! And I know that he is going to be wonderful husband, and father when the time comes.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Thank you for your advice! We have talked about it, and I decided that I had to let him figure this one out on his own. He has only just started coming back to the Church, and I think I was doing more harm than good by pushing him. I won’t stop trying to lead him deeper in faith, but I need to let him do it at his own pace. He will get there!

We still have some things to talk about, but we will be ready when our wedding comes! And I know that he is going to be wonderful husband, and father when the time comes.

 

[PumpkinPies37]

This is not necessarily true. What you are mistakenly believing is that if a man is sexually satisfied he will not be sexually immoral (masturbate) I know plenty of men who masturbate MORE because they are sexually active. The OP’s fiancee is called to chastity even more so that they are not married. Using your logic, it would be almost a medical necessity for priests to masturbate. Or for a man who’s wife was suffering and could not perform the marital act to fall into sin just because he is a “man”

No, one should not “respect” the decision of one’s future spouse to be in unrepentant grave sin. That is not a good idea for marriage.

Accept it and leave him alone about it or he will lie to you later? That is not what a husband and wife should do! It is our job to help the other person achieve heaven and be holy.

If you wish to be a Catholic in good standing and receive the Eucharist you need to drop the “if it is abused” off of the end of that sentence.

This is the biggest problem I have with your post. So, if when one is discerning the type of man to marry, one finds out that the man is in the habit of committing sexual sin and finds nothing wrong with it then you think that they are doing “ok” and that the future relationship is nothing to worry about? If the person is not understanding the morality of sex with himself then how about when NFP is hard to practice. Or when his wife has a tough pregnancy and needs a close chaste husband to sacrifice his own urges and needs for her and her family? How about when the marriage is struggling and an opportunity presents itself to the man who may be in a moment of weakness? Shouldn’t he have a moral reference and track record that helps him make a harder decision than “should I relieve myself?” No sir, I think you are quite wrong that potential mortal sin and not understanding basic sexuality is “doing ok” for a spouse.

I, for one, really appreciate your’s and Bucket’s stance. I was reading a thread of a similar topic from a few years ago and it was relativism and hogwash all over the place. On behalf of the many people who are silently cheering when you stand up for The Faith, I’d like to say THANK YOU.