Filioque??

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Allyson: Just prior to that portion of the Council of Florence there is an explanatory statement that pretty much rules out the notion that the Latins are conflating “procedit” and “ekporousis”.

The Council states:
The Latins asserted that they say the holy Spirit proceeds from the Father and the Son not with the intention of excluding the Father from being the source and principle of all deity, that is of the Son and of the holy Spirit, nor to imply that the Son does not receive from the Father, because the holy Spirit proceeds from the Son, nor that they posit two principles or two spirations
Since “ekporousis” refers to the Father being “source”, and the Latins (without necessarily understanding the linguistic issues at hand) state that their expression and definition is not meant to make anyone but the Father the Source of all Deity, the later technical definition can’t be understood as placing the Son as Source (ekporousis). Everything written after that point must read in the context of this clarifier.

Peace and God bless!
 
Ghosty,

Agreed. However, I think that Florence is still a bit of a mess. Two things:
  1. Earlier, if I remember correctly, you said there was a distinction between “origin” and “principle”. This distinction is the only way that I can see Florence not contradicting itself. I understand the example about the spring (Father), river (Son), and lake (Holy Spirit), but I’m still not quite getting the distinction. Could you give another explanation of this distinction?
  2. I am under the impression that “subsistence” means “hypostasis.” One of the problems that the Byzantines have with the filioque is that they think it means that the Holy Spirit proceeds hypostatically from both the Father and the Son. Florence appears to support this.
Any clarifications you can give are appreciated.

In Christ through Mary
 
Ghosty,

Agreed. However, I think that Florence is still a bit of a mess. Two things:
  1. Earlier, if I remember correctly, you said there was a distinction between “origin” and “principle”. This distinction is the only way that I can see Florence not contradicting itself. I understand the example about the spring (Father), river (Son), and lake (Holy Spirit), but I’m still not quite getting the distinction. Could you give another explanation of this distinction?
Sure, I’ll give you one that was used to explain the meaning of “principle” in the Summa course I took from the local Dominicans.

If you consider ground coffee and the bag it comes in, when you pour the coffee out of the bag the bag is the principle of the coffee. It is the “from”, but it is not the absolute origin. Principle refers to the beginning of a particular movement, without reference to origin of the movement; so when considering my moving from my bed to the living-room, the bed is the principle, but not my absolute origin (I got to the bed from elsewhere).

In the case of the filioque, we have one principle because there is a single eternal movement; the Father and the Son, in terms of the Holy Spirit’s procession, can’t be distinguished on the grounds of principle because the Holy Spirit doesn’t exist first, and then move through the Son, but rather exists automatically and all at once “through the Son”. If time was involved, we could say that the movement of the Holy Spirit through the Son has its principle in the Father, but since the movement is eternal and singular we can only distinguish between the Father and Son by speaking of “source” and “recipient of the power of Spirating”. In other words, the Holy Spirit doesn’t pass from Father, to Son, to Himself, but rather passes from the Father (as source) and the Son (as participator) to Himself; it’s only “Point A to Point B”, but the Father and Son have different roles in “Point A”.
  1. I am under the impression that “subsistence” means “hypostasis.” One of the problems that the Byzantines have with the filioque is that they think it means that the Holy Spirit proceeds hypostatically from both the Father and the Son. Florence appears to support this.
Any clarifications you can give are appreciated.

In Christ through Mary
The main problem here is that in later theology “hypostatically” apparently became synonymous with “from the Source” (at least that’s what appears from what I’ve seen in arguments against the filioque), but this is not supported by the Early Fathers. St. Gregory of Nyssa, for example, stated that the Person (hypostasis) of the Holy Spirit is from the Father through the Son. Now, the source of His Personhood is only the Father, as Florence states, but the Person of the Holy Spirit proceeds (moves out from) both the Father and the Son, but from the Father principally (not to be confused with principle) since the Son is a participant in the motion, not the source of it.

To say that the Hypostasis of the Holy Spirit doesn’t proceed from the Son, but that the Holy Spirit does proceed in some way through the Son, makes no sense in Latin theology. The Holy Spirit is always a Person, so if He proceeds in any way from the Son He proceeds as a Person, a subsistence, and so Florence says that His subsistence is “from the Son”, not as the source, but as a principle from which He proceeds.

Peace and God bless!
 
Ghosty,

Thanks for the clarification on origin and principle; it was quite helpful.

As for proceeding hypostatically from the Son, I’m still not sure. I’ll take your word for it that it works in Latin theology (who am I to say it doesn’t?), but if my understanding of Byzantine theology is correct it cannot work. What the solution is I’m not quite sure. Perhaps another ecumenical council for the union of the churches during the pontificate of Benedict XVI. 😃 Nah, wishful thinking. 😉

I, myself, like St. Palamas’s approach to the filioque and I think it fits very well with the clarification on the filioque (he’s footnoted). However, he lived one hundred years before Florence and Florence isn’t mentioned in the clarification.

Thanks again.

In Christ through Mary
 
I would Imagine that the particular quote of which you speak is never mentioned because there is no contradiction, and therefore no one saw the need to specifically discuss it. I believe that the article to which I linked above does exaplain it, as well as your other concerns. If you’re one of the lucky ones capable of reading St. Thomas Aquinas without getting dizzy (his language and thought processes really do seem unnecessarily complicated :eek:), then I recommend getting his take on it as well.
Fuerza,

I’m not so sure it’s that simple.

The Fourth Lateran Council which is cited in the clarification on the filioque simply says that the Spirit proceeds from the Father and Son: “The Father is from none, the Son from the Father alone, and the holy Spirit from both equally, eternally without beginning or end.” The Second Council of Lyon which is also cited in the clarification decrees that the Spirit proceeds from the Father and Son as from one principle and one spiration, not two: “We profess faithfully and devotedly that the holy Spirit proceeds eternally from the Father and the Son, not as from two principles, but as from one principle; not by two spirations, but by one single spiration.” True, Orthodox have issues with these, but the clarification on the filioque does an excellent job of, well, clarifying what is meant by these two counciliar decrees.

More than these though, the Orthodox have a problem with the Council of Florence. It didn’t just say “from the Son” or affirm one principle and one spiration; it said that the Spirit receives His subsistence from both the Father and the Son. This is very problematic, and because Florence is not mentioned in the clarification this issue is not, well, again, clarified.

Florence gives the most detailed and explicit conciliar decree of what is meant by the filioque. It is no small thing to exclude it from the clarification. One of the very good things about the clarification though is that it helps to show the proper way in which Florence is to be understood.

In Christ through Mary
 
Hey all,
I am going out of town for the weekend for a baptism. So I will return to the thread Tues.
Feruesa(sorry if its spelled wrong I am not using normal internets where I can check by going back): I will be looking at that link.

God bless,
R.
 
As for proceeding hypostatically from the Son, I’m still not sure. I’ll take your word for it that it works in Latin theology (who am I to say it doesn’t?), but if my understanding of Byzantine theology is correct it cannot work.
If that is the case, and I don’t know that it certainly is, then Byzantine theology has certainly deviated from Patristic theology (I’m saying this with the caveat that I don’t think this view is necessary in Byzantine theology, and certainly it is not held by the Byzantine Churches in Communion with Rome). The quote from St. Gregory of Nyssa can be found earlier in the thread, but I’ll repost it here:
If, however, any one cavils at our argument, on the ground that by not admitting the difference of nature it leads to a mixture and confusion of the Persons, we shall make to such a charge this answer;— that while we confess the invariable character of the nature, we do not deny the difference in respect of cause, and that which is caused, by which alone we apprehend that one Person is distinguished from another;— by our belief, that is, that one is the Cause, and another is of the Cause; and again in that which is of the Cause we recognize another distinction. For one is directly from the first Cause, and another by that which is directly from the first Cause; so that the attribute of being Only-begotten abides without doubt in the Son, and the interposition of the Son, while it guards His attribute of being Only-begotten, does not shut out the Spirit from His relation by way of nature to the Father.
Here he is clearly referring to personal (hypostatic) procession, since he’s using this as the measure for distinguishing Divine Persons. This is just one quote of many that can and have been presented, but I use it because it is the clearest example of Greek theology supporting the filioque in the early centuries. If anything St. Gregory’s statement is harder than the Latin wording. 🤷

Peace and God bless!
 
Fuerza,

I’m not so sure it’s that simple.

The Fourth Lateran Council which is cited in the clarification on the filioque simply says that the Spirit proceeds from the Father and Son: “The Father is from none, the Son from the Father alone, and the holy Spirit from both equally, eternally without beginning or end.” The Second Council of Lyon which is also cited in the clarification decrees that the Spirit proceeds from the Father and Son as from one principle and one spiration, not two: “We profess faithfully and devotedly that the holy Spirit proceeds eternally from the Father and the Son, not as from two principles, but as from one principle; not by two spirations, but by one single spiration.” True, Orthodox have issues with these, but the clarification on the filioque does an excellent job of, well, clarifying what is meant by these two counciliar decrees.

More than these though, the Orthodox have a problem with the Council of Florence. It didn’t just say “from the Son” or affirm one principle and one spiration; it said that the Spirit receives His subsistence from both the Father and the Son. This is very problematic, and because Florence is not mentioned in the clarification this issue is not, well, again, clarified.

Florence gives the most detailed and explicit conciliar decree of what is meant by the filioque. It is no small thing to exclude it from the clarification. One of the very good things about the clarification though is that it helps to show the proper way in which Florence is to be understood.

In Christ through Mary
Florence also explicitly states that the Father is the the source of the Spirit. That must be kept in mind when reading any other comments from the council. The idea that the Latin bishops would make such a statement, in writing no less, only to contradict it 2 sentences later implies that they are either stupid or dishonest. When you take that into account, it become clear that statements about the procession from the Son must have at least a slightly different meaning. The Latin Church, while perfectly aware of Florence, has maintained repeatedly that the Father is the source. Why should there be any further doubt? Why can’t the Greeks give the benefit of the doubt that the Latins understand their own language better than the East does?
 
Thank you, you’ve given me a lot to think about and a real good amount of investigating to do. :eek:

In Christ through Mary
 
This essay is worth reading through in its entirety. It’s very thorough in explaining the history behind the filioque controversy and it has many quotes from Eastern and Western theologians.

catholic-legate.com/articles/filioque.html
Anthony;

Thanks for this excellent article. My impression is that the current block to reunification is not the word, “filioque”, but rather the issue of the primacy of the Pope. What do you know about this?

The Chancellor
 
If that is the case, and I don’t know that it certainly is, then Byzantine theology has certainly deviated from Patristic theology (I’m saying this with the caveat that I don’t think this view is necessary in Byzantine theology, and certainly it is not held by the Byzantine Churches in Communion with Rome). The quote from St. Gregory of Nyssa can be found earlier in the thread, but I’ll repost it here:

Here he is clearly referring to personal (hypostatic) procession,
how so does this relate to filioque?
since he’s using this as the measure for distinguishing Divine Persons. This is just one quote of many that can and have been presented, but I use it because it is the clearest example of Greek theology supporting the filioque in the early centuries. If anything St. Gregory’s statement is harder than the Latin wording. 🤷
Only an interpretation of St. Gregory stating dual procession would support that.
 
Grace and Peace Ghosty,

I’ve been following this discussion, particularly the quote of St. Gregory…
Code:
 	 		 If, however, any one cavils at our argument, on the ground that by not admitting the difference of nature it leads to a mixture and confusion of the Persons, we shall make to such a charge this answer;— that while we confess the invariable character of the nature, we do not deny the difference in respect of [cause](http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/03459a.htm), and that which is caused, by which alone we apprehend that one Person is distinguished from another;— by our belief, that is, that one is the Cause, and another is of the Cause; and again in that which is of the Cause we recognize another distinction. For one is directly from the first Cause, and another by that which is directly from the first Cause; so that the attribute of being Only-begotten abides without [doubt](http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/05141a.htm) in the [Son](http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14142b.htm), and the interposition of the [Son](http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14142b.htm), while it guards His attribute of being Only-begotten, does not shut out the Spirit from His relation by way of nature to the Father.
Ghosty, could you ‘break’ this down a little for us as to where St. Gregory is speaking about procession? I see it basically in the later half of the paragraph but I’ll ask you to break it down for us if you will.

Thanks.
 
I’ll break the quote down piece by piece, something I usually don’t do, because I think it will help in displaying why I think St. Gregory of Nyssa’s point is so relevant.
If, however, any one cavils at our argument, on the ground that by not admitting the difference of nature it leads to a mixture and confusion of the Persons
He’s responding to the objection that having three persons share a single nature leads to Sabellianism. It’s an understandable objection on its face, but it misses the point of how we distinguish Divine Persons.
we shall make to such a charge this answer;— that while we confess the invariable character of the nature, we do not deny the difference in respect of
cause, and that which is caused, by which alone we apprehend that one Person is distinguished from another;
The Divine Nature is singular, and not different between the Divine Persons, so we don’t distinguish between the Divine Persons because of a difference in Divine Nature, but rather we distinguish them by reason of relations of origin. One Nature is shared, but this Person is the Cause, and that Person is the caused, and that suffices to distinguish between Divine Persons without at all needing a distinct Nature for each individual.
— by our belief, that is, that one is the Cause, and another is of the Cause; and again in that which is of the Cause we recognize another distinction. For one is directly from the first Cause, and another by that which is directly from the first Cause;
This is where we run deep into filioque territory. We have the distinction of Cause and Caused, but the distinctions don’t stop there; if it did we’d have two “Sons” (as addressed next in the quote). Instead we have a distinction within the “Caused”, one being directly from the Cause, and another being “by” that one who is directly from the Cause. In other words, the distinction between the Holy Spirit and the Son, in terms of origin, is that the Son is only from the Father, while the Holy Spirit has His being in some way “by the Son” as well as from the Cause (the Father).
so that the attribute of being Only-begotten abides without
doubt in the Son, and the interposition of the Son, while it guards His attribute of being Only-begotten, does not shut out the Spirit from His relation by way of nature to the Father.
Here we have an explicit affirmation of the filioque, as understood in Latin theology at least. The Son is “Only-Begotten” and not “first-Begotten” precisely because He is interposed in a certain sense between the Father and the Holy Spirit. If the Holy Spirit were directly from the Father alone, just as the Son is, then the Son could not be called “only-Begotten”. We would then have two perfect Persons, direct images of the Father, with no distinction between them (no distinction of Nature, because they have an identical, and really singular, Divine Nature along with the Father, and no distinction with relation to the Cause, as they would both simply be “from the Cause” with no modifier added to either).

St. Gregory of Nyssa is interposing the Son, not as an obstacle between the Father and the Holy Spirit, and not to remove the Father from alone being the ultimate Cause, but in order to establish the third “identifier” in terms of origin. We have the Divinity which is Cause (Father), the Divinity which is from the Cause (Son), and the Divinity which is by that which is from the Cause (that is, the Holy Spirit is by the Son).

I don’t have the Greek version of this text, but I do find it noteworthy that in the English translation it is not said that the Holy Spirit is “***from ***that which is from the Cause”, but rather “by that which is from the Cause”, which could indicate a different term than “ek” being used there. If so, the Greek “from”, with its implications of Source, is being reserved for the Father, but the Son is still put in a position of putting forth the Person of the Holy Spirit in some manner (St. Gregory even uses the term “interposed”, at least in the translation, which is stronger than the Latin theology would typically put it). Indeed, St. Gregory of Nyssa is using this as the manner of distinguishing Divine Persons, so it can’t be argued that he’s not refering to the Personal procession of the Holy Spirit (he even says that it is only by these relations that the Divine Persons themselves are distinguished).

I’m not saying that this is the quote that locks up the debate on the filioque, but I am saying that it shows that there is plenty of room for filioque-like theology in Greek Patristic thought, even as it regards hypostatic procession. In fact, I would argue that this quote shows that the later Scholastic Latin theological formula of “relations of opposition” defining the Divine Persons actually has its basis in Greek theological tradition, as opposed to the Augustinian model of “Lover, Loved, and Love”, or “Thinker, Thought, and Communication”.

continued…
 
So when it comes to the filioque, I basically take the position of Bp. Bessarion, a Greek Bishop who agreed to the Union of Florence and stuck with it even after it had fallen apart for all practical purposes. The Latin case for the filioque is solid, Patristically speaking, and it in no way interferes with the Truth that the Byzantine tradition has worked so hard to maintain. I don’t think the Latin theological tradition should be adopted by Byzantines, or other Eastern Catholics (and therefore I don’t think the filioque as such really has a place in our traditions), but I don’t view it as contrary to our traditions at all, and in fact I see it being rooted in some of our greatest Church Fathers.

For our tradition, the focus is on the Father as the Source of Divinity, and the Son and Holy Spirit as true and perfect receivers of that Divinity, and the filioque just doesn’t need to enter into that picture despite St. Gregory of Nyssa’s clear claims that the interposition of the Son is necessary in order to preserve the identity of the Son as the “Only-Begotten Son of the Father” (an argument I’m sympathetic to, but one which I ultimately find to not be absolutely necessary in practical reality). I do think, however, that it’s an error to eliminate the Son from the procession of the Person of the Holy Spirit all-together, and I think that error has been pushed mostly for polemical reasons, and not because of solid theology.

As a side note, I find one of the most telling examples of this commonality in belief in the very “rejection” of the filioque by the Ukrainians in the Union of Brest. The text reads:
Since there is a quarrel between the Romans and Greeks about the procession of the Holy Spirit, which greatly impede unity really for no other reason than that we do not wish to understand one another - we ask that we should not be compelled to any other creed but that we should remain with that which was handed down to us in the Holy Scriptures, in the Gospel, and in the writings of the holy Greek Doctors, that is, that the Holy Spirit proceeds, not from two sources and not by a double procession, but from one origin, from the Father through the Son.
They asked that they not be compelled to add anything to the Creed, while at the same time insisting that what had been “handed down” was that the Holy Spirit’s single origin was “from the Father, through the Son”. If Orthodox bishops could say that then, even after debacle of Florence, then there is no reason to view such a position as “non-Orthodox” today, IMO.

Peace and God bless!
 
how so does this relate to filioque?
Isa Almisry,

The reason the problem of hypostatic procession from the Son is related to the filioque is because of its consequences in Byzantine theological approaches. Byzantines (for lack of a better way to say it:( ) place existence with hypostasis, not nature. The Father exists as Father, the Son exists as Son, and the Holy Spirit exists as Spirit. For this reason, if the Holy Spirit were to proceed from the Son hypostatically then one of two things is compromised: 1) the Father as sole source/origin of the Trinity because of duel procession; or 2) the distinction between Father and Son because they would be un-hypostatic.

I agree with Ghosty when he cited what the Ukrainian bishop said after the Union of Brest. The West and the Byzantines have different but legitimate theological approaches to the Mystery, God. What each says needs to be interpreted and understood in the tradition from which it came. At least, that is how I understood the quote.

As for the Western approach, I have difficulty understanding it and, therefore, I have difficulty understanding its saying the Spirit proceeds hypostatically from the Son. However, I would be a fool to reject it simply because I don’t get it.
Only an interpretation of St. Gregory stating dual procession would support that.
I agree. In fact, my translation is even stronger than Ghosty’s which says, “by.” My translation says, "There is that which depends on the first cause and that which is derived from (my emphasis) what immediately depends on the first cause.

I also agree with Ghosty that we are working with translations and the Greek text would probably be more revealing. One of the difficulties of translations is not only the differences in language, but also that it is not uncommon for translators to translate according to their interpretation of what the text means. :mad:

In Christ through Mary
 
Concerning the text in question from St. Gregory of Nyssa:

First, if anyone who has not read it in context would like to it can be found on page 266 of Christology of the Later Fathers edited by Edward R. Hardy at the end of his letter to Ablabius: “That We Should Not Think of Saying There Are Three Gods.” This is either Gregory’s 6th or 21st epistle and can probably be found on www.newadvent.com was well.

Second, as Ghosty said, Nyssa’s primary concern is to affirm the distinction between Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and he does this by appealing to causality. The Father is Uncaused Cause; the Son is Caused Cause; and the Holy Spirit, well, he’s just Caused (poor guy, but I guess He gets His day as Cause at the Incarnation). Gregory continues his emphasis on the distinction of persons by their causal relationships to the end of the letter, but it is significant that that quote is the only time he mentions the Holy Spirit. After that quote to the end of the letter (all two paragraphs) he only speaks of the distinction between uncaused and caused. Gregory’s mention of the Holy Spirit is pretty much in passing and he is definitely not aiming to give any examination to His procession.
 
Hey Everyone,
I have the greek/latin/ and another english text of Session VI of Florence. It will take me some time to type and especially to read it. I am not a strong reader of Greek or Latin, so I will post the text when I have it typed with a few cursory comments. It will be the two main paragraphs on the filioque clause.

Because this session of the Council of Basel-Ferra-Florence-Rome deals with the issues between the Greek speaking East and the Latin West, it has two versions of the text from the time of the council. Since it is evident that fluent users of Greek and those knowledgeable Eastern theology were present at the council (especially since this text is supposed to be an agreement between them:p ), it is revealing to see what they would have accepted in the Greek text. They would have know the meaning of ekporeusis, and so how it is used in the text will be important. (Yes, it does appear in the text). Also, it appears that, for the sentence where it is said that the Son is to “be signified, according to the Greeks indeed as cause,” the word “aitían” is used in Greek (“causam” in Latin if you are curious). I will examine the grammar to the best of my ability to make sure that that word aitían] is linked, as I believe it is, to the Son.

God Bless,
R.
 
Remember, just because the text is in Greek doesn’t mean that the writers were fluent in Greek, let alone Greek theological language. In fact, the session records indicate that the Latins had very little understanding of Byzantine theology; Fr. Joseph Gill S.J.'s work is very good in illustrating this point.

Specifically, the fact that the writers were not clear on the Greek meanings is that they say the Father is the Source, but then have the Son sharing in ekporousis, a contradiction in terms. What they knew was that ekporousis is translated into Latin with the term procedit, but they did not understand that there was actually a difference in specific meanings (there is no term in Latin which can properly translate ekporousis, so the closest word is used).

Peace and God bless!
 
Remember, just because the text is in Greek doesn’t mean that the writers were fluent in Greek, let alone Greek theological language. In fact, the session records indicate that the Latins had very little understanding of Byzantine theology; Fr. Joseph Gill S.J.'s work is very good in illustrating this point.

Specifically, the fact that the writers were not clear on the Greek meanings is that they say the Father is the Source, but then have the Son sharing in ekporousis, a contradiction in terms. What they knew was that ekporousis is translated into Latin with the term procedit, but they did not understand that there was actually a difference in specific meanings (there is no term in Latin which can properly translate ekporousis, so the closest word is used).

Peace and God bless!
What is this title of the work you reference? Thanks. 🙂

So there were absolutely no Greek speakers at the council?:confused: Who were the Eastern Bishops or representatives who came into an agreement with the Latins in this text; A bunch of Latins posing as Easterners?😃 If there was nobody at the council representing the East, then the text sounds like a hubristic, self-glorifying text (Note that I don’t think it is). Who was there? Who was composing/translating the parallel texts?

Why would an Easterner take a Greek text back without pointing out the flaws? Would not the problem of translation come up then?

It’s not that I doubt that things might be as you say, but it doesn’t make much sense. Of course, it might explain Florence’s utter failure to cement ties with the East and the final dissolution of communion. :eek:

God Bless,
R.
 
What is this title of the work you reference? Thanks. 🙂

So there were absolutely no Greek speakers at the council?:confused: Who were the Eastern Bishops or representatives who came into an agreement with the Latins in this text; A bunch of Latins posing as Easterners?😃 If there was nobody at the council representing the East, then the text sounds like a hubristic, self-glorifying text (Note that I don’t think it is). Who was there? Who was composing/translating the parallel texts?

Why would an Easterner take a Greek text back without pointing out the flaws? Would not the problem of translation come up then?

It’s not that I doubt that things might be as you say, but it doesn’t make much sense. Of course, it might explain Florence’s utter failure to cement ties with the East and the final dissolution of communion. :eek:

God Bless,
R.
There were of course translators, but that doesn’t mean they were particularily fluent, nor that they understood the nuances of the languages. At the very least, the Latins never seemed to grasp the distinction between proinai and ekporousis, which is understandable since both words are translated into Latin as “procedit”, or proceeds.

As for the document, it was viewed as problematic by the East, which is why it was generally rejected. Folks who accepted it, like Bp. Bessarion, usually had a pretty firm grasp of the nuances of the languages, and accepted the Latin explainations of the theology (he was a Greek Bishop who went on to become a Cardinal, and was also instrumental in translating Greek texts into Western tongues, helping to spawn the Renaisance), but ultimately these people were the exceptions rather than the rule.

The Council of Florence was extremely flawed for these reasons, and couldn’t stand as a Reunion Council, though I do think it expresses the filioque in a manner that is non-problematic, at least when understood through the Latin and not the Greek translation.

Peace and God bless!
 
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