First Confession ok outside of confessional?

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Weezir

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Our parish recently hired a nun to run our religious education program. My friend, who is the 2nd grade teacher, will be leading this class through first confession, which is Dec 12. She had an argument with the sister because the sister is insisting that first confession be done with two chairs on the altar in front of parents. She is insisting that it not only be face to face, but that it be on the altar. I believe Canon law says a confessional. Shouldn’t these children have a choice if nothing else? My friend, who has a daughter in her class, has said this is not what she has prepared the students for and her daughter will not participate. It is not a good situation, but what is correct? There have been alot of changes in our religion ed program, some good, but most are questionable and we do not have a strong priest that will say THIS ISN’T THE WAY IT IS SUPPOSE TO BE. He has told both sides that each way is ok.
Any thoughts? How should the teacher approach this? Because as of right now, she doesn’t want to continue teaching something she doesn’t believe in.
~Weezir
 
I haven’t been there yet, but my first confession is most likely going to be in the priest’s office, not in a confessional. However, I am concerned about the presence of the parents and how that impacts on the seal of the confessional.

DaveBj
 
Yes, I’m sorry. I do understand that a confession can really be heard anywhere. Here is what Canon Law states:

Can. 964 §1 The proper place for hearing sacramental confessions is a church or oratory.

§2 As far as the confessional is concerned, norms are to be issued by the Episcopal Conference, with the proviso however that confessionals, which the faithful who so wish may freely use, are located in an open place, and fitted with a fixed grille between the penitent and the confessor.

***§3 Except for a just reason, confessions are not to be heard elsewhere than in a confessional. ***

***~Weezir
 
I think it is an awful idea to force kids to confess face to face. Kids at that age are unlikely to be able to buck their parents and their teachers to say No Way. So it is effectively forcing face to face confession on the kids.

Confession at one end of a large room with people at the other end does not mean the confession is not private in content. Anyway, if anyone should happen to overhear a confession, they are obliged to keep it secret. The priest is under the seal even if there is another person nearby (like an interpreter). What would happen in an American secular court, were a priest to say it was sealed and yet there was another person there, I don’t know. But the priest still can’t tell.
 
My first question is whether the Church has a confessional. If it does than the burden of proof is on this sister as to what are the just reasons that the confessional is not being used.

We have one Church near us that does not have confessionals. The First Communion class last year only had a communal pennance service. The DRE tried to say that this was mandated by the Veritas (aka Protecting God’s Children etc) program which it wasn’t.

If sister is successful in proving the just cause, then just ask her what provision is being made for the children who chose, as is thier right, to have an anonymous confession.

There is no reason the kids have to participate in first Confession this way. I have known of people who, once they are assured that the child is prepared, just put them in line at a regular Confession time. They tell Father it’s their First Confession and then ask Father later for the certificate. If the child has been through preparation, the sacrament can’t be denied.
 
Wow, I can’t imagine going to confession in such a public manner! I’ve usually ended up crying at confession, even when I was a child, and I can’t imagine doing that on an altar in front of my parents and anyone else in the church. It’s setting the children up for humiliation, IMHO, and totally unnecessary. If some of the children are comfortable with that, that’s fine, but the option needs to be there for using a confessional, as weezir said.
 
Sometimes at our parish when the line for the confessional is long, (as well as at Penance services), another priest will place a chair and kneeler in the sanctuary area and hear confessions there. Although you can be seen, you can not be heard. Nevertheless, for a first confession service, the confessional should be used, as it is the norm.
 
there is enough nervousness about first confession (usually communicated to the child by parents or older siblings, despite the best efforts of catechists) that anything coercive or disprespectful of the penitent’s rights under the norms for the sacrament of reconciliation should be avoided at all costs. This whole “ownership” thing of the sacraments that we DREs tend to struggle with as an occupational hazard is a real disease.

Some modern churches have been built without confessionals. In my opinion that whole 70s thing with the reconciliation room permitting face to face confession was a huge mistake, seriously undercut the theology of the sacrament regarding confidentiality and anonymity, and contributed to “occasions of sin” for predatory priest. It is in no small part a contributing cause the the decline in those going to confession, and in the abuse scandal.

Whew, got that off my chest.

In our parish we give families the option of taking their child over to Church after the parent meetings and preparation for confession, where their pastor, whom they know because he has been speaking to their class, hears confessions in the proper way. They have already visited the confessional to reduce anxiety levels. Parents also have the option to take their child to a nearby Shrine that has multiple priests available for confessions in several languages, or any other surrounding parish. They just bring back a card signed by the priest, which they can keep as soon as I make not of the fact that they have had the opportunity for confession before first communion.

We do have communal penance services in Lent and Advent, for CCD children, youth and families and for the parish, followed by individual confession.
 
Canon Law requires that the Sacrament of Reconciliation take place in the confessional. (or Reconciliation room, the place set aside specifically for this Sacrament)

The Penitent can remain totally anonymous if they so choose. The Confessor can allow face to face if he wishes and the penitent can chose this if it is offered. It is a violation of Canon Law if face to face is forced.

Additionally the Sacrament of Reconciliation is a private matter. Children should be prepared and given many opportunities to receive this Sacrament. They cannot be required to “go to Confession” before they will be allowed to receive Holy Communion. The “State of Grace” should be explained and they should be encouraged, but never required or forced to do so. It is never to be a public event. When it comes to First Reconciliation no one is to take attendance!

If there are 20 kids in the class and Father hears 18 confessions there should not be any way of knowing who did or who didn’t!
 
I agree completely with Brother, but we are required to attest that every child has had the opportunity for confession before first communion, because of abuses. the first year I was here I was appalled at the practice of taking attendance, for the reasons you give, and was called on the carpet for not keeping records and giving certificates. It is an example were over-zealousness in doing the right thing results in unwitting abuses in another area.
 
In our parish we require that every child attend one of the Confession sessions and sign in. If they don’t actually go to Confession or go in and tell Father they aren’t ready, so be it. But if we didn’t make coming mandetory, there are too many parents who wouldn’t bother bringing their kids. It breaks my heart when the kids tell me that they ask to go to Mass on Sunday but their parents won’t bring them.

As far as the opportunity to go to Confession, it isn’t just the teachers/priests who have to make the oportunity available, it’s the parents too. Sometimes the parents need a little push. 😉
 
My two girls each went through a first reconciliation at our parish just like the one described by Weezir–where the children went up on the altar one at a time and faced the priest while families were in the pews.

It was a beautiful, family-centered ceremony and no one was able to over-hear the confessions. Althought there was nervousness on the part of the children it had much more to do with the universal trepidation of revealing a sin–not the presence of the audience. Quite to the contrary, both of my girls were very reassured to know we would be right there and were actually rather horrified to learn, when we discussed our own history with them, that we had to be “closed in the dark box” with the priest (their words not ours.) While I agree that the option of meeting the priest in the confessional should be offered to children, my own seemed view that as a very spooky option. Frankly, these days, I’m amazed anyone would object to priests and young children interacting out in the open as opposed to being isolated in a small, confined space.
 
Island Oak:
My two girls each went through a first reconciliation at our parish just like the one described by Weezir–where the children went up on the altar one at a time and faced the priest while families were in the pews.

It was a beautiful, family-centered ceremony and no one was able to over-hear the confessions. Althought there was nervousness on the part of the children it had much more to do with the universal trepidation of revealing a sin–not the presence of the audience. Quite to the contrary, both of my girls were very reassured to know we would be right there and were actually rather horrified to learn, when we discussed our own history with them, that we had to be “closed in the dark box” with the priest (their words not ours.) While I agree that the option of meeting the priest in the confessional should be offered to children, my own seemed view that as a very spooky option. Frankly, these days, I’m amazed anyone would object to priests and young children interacting out in the open as opposed to being isolated in a small, confined space.
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I believe Canon Law says they should have the choice to have a behind the screen confession or not. That should apply to everyone, not only adults.

Funny, I came away with a different opinion of the First Penance Service. It didn’t seem right to have the children have to confess in front of a big crowd and I’m sorry that my parish did it that way. In our case, there were confessionals, but with parents and First Penitents using them (those were the longest lines), many of the kids gave up and went to one of the open tables or up on the altar to confess. In my view, the set-up detracted from the “sense” of sacredness which can be important in getting the children to return. Fo many candidates for confirmation, their first confession was the last one until just before confirmation.
 
I was recently told that the parents went into the confessional and then the child discussed the sins with the parents and the priest.

Supposedly a letter was sent from our Bishop saying this must be an available option for first penance.
 
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buffalo:
I was recently told that the parents went into the confessional and then the child discussed the sins with the parents and the priest.

Supposedly a letter was sent from our Bishop saying this must be an available option for first penance.
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That is just plain wrong on so many levels.

There is no way, I would let one of my kids participate in that kind of innovative activity. Are they skipping over the part about the seal of the Confessional and confidentiality when they teach these kids or are they ok with the contradiction.

I don’t think the Church even allows another person to be IN the Confessional when there is a language barrier. Let alone a parent!!! :eek:
 
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kmktexas:
I don’t think the Church even allows another person to be IN the Confessional for purposes of translation or deafness. Let alone a parent!!! :eek:
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Can. 983 §1. The sacramental seal is inviolable; therefore it is absolutely forbidden for a confessor to betray in any way a penitent in words or in any manner and for any reason.

§2. The interpreter, if there is one, and all others who in any way have knowledge of sins from confession are also obliged to observe secrecy.
 
Thanks Pug, all I could find was a reference to sign language translators (that’s why I edited the deaf out of my post).

I still do not believe that having a parent in the Confessional is appropriate. Asking that parents maintain the strict seal of the Confessional is hard enough, but getting 7 year olds to understand that their parent is bound by the seal is nearly impossible. I have a 7 year old and I have taught the second grade CCE.

This looks like another one of those law-suit-phobic reactions. If the Church had regular confessionals with fixed screens (as required by Cannon law), they wouldn’t have to worry.

How do they possibly justify the part about the child discussing the sins with the priest AND the parents.
 
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kmktexas:
How do they possibly justify the part about the child discussing the sins with the priest AND the parents.
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Discussing, wow. Beats me. :confused:

If kids were adults, they’d be outraged at having to let the parents listen in. I agree, I don’t think you could get a kid to understand restrictions on what their parent could do with info about the sins they tell. If I were the kid, I’d figure if I told about the time I lit the cat on fire during the confession, then I’d be in for it later at home no matter what. I’d probably then lie during confession by concealing the cat incident. What a stupid precedent to encourage.
 
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buffalo:
I was recently told that the parents went into the confessional and then the child discussed the sins with the parents and the priest.

Supposedly a letter was sent from our Bishop saying this must be an available option for first penance.
Click to expand...
Wow, that’s unreal.

When my son had his first confession, he was very happy to know that no matter what sins he told, the priest couldn’t tell anyone.

He said he wouldn’t go to confession if he thought I would find out what he said.
 
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