First God Created Jesus

[TheosisM]

JeanneH,

if the person is not even using the Bible, there is no common ground for any fruitful discussion.

Firstly of course, the Bible came first and therefore must possess the advantage of being esteemed higher in reliability. That which came later has to first prove itself if it contradicts that which has been declared earlier.

Secondly, do they have the book of John? If they do show them this:

John 1: 1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning. 14The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only,[d] who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

The Bible is very clear, Jesus IS GOD.

.

As others have mentioned, Jehovah’s Witnesses use their own special translation of the Bible, called the New World Translation. They translate John 1:1 differently to deal with this issue:

**John 1:1 (New World Translation)-

1 In [the] beginning the Word was, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god**

 

[InSearchofGrace]

Just sharing this:

I used to sit down with this very nice JW lady and her sister in meetings. They told me that they are Christians because they follow the teachings of Jesus Christ. They therefore take exception to being called non-Christians. They object further to being called cult members, as some, they say, go so far to say of JWs. Funny thing is they think the labels apply to Mormons!

Then I learned about the different theology of JWs, how their teachings depart so far from Catholic and Protestant mainstream doctrines (none the least, their denial that Jesus is God), their very short history as a religious organization, starting with unenlightened founders, the crude liberty the Watchtower Governing Body took in instituting alterations to bible verses to fit their theology, and the vise grip the WT has over its ‘faithful and discreet slaves’.

I scratched my head, wondering how seemingly intelligent, very upstanding people bought into such a religion. How can they and their families accept this kind of spiritual imprisonment? After a while, it pained me to see such zeal, such ardor in their faces. I understood I could do nothing but pray for a life changing situation for them. And I pray they would turn to our beautiful Catholic faith.

What did St. Paul write to the Romans in Chapter 10? 1 Brethren, the will of my heart, indeed, and my prayer to God, is for them unto salvation. 2 For I bear them witness, that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge …

 

[peary]

Hi,
How can I answer a JW who says that first God created Jesus then through Jesus all other things. The NWT adds other to Colossians 1:15 and following.? They believe that Jesus while in heaven is Michael. When Jesus was born of Mary he is called Jesus. Now that he is back in heaven is he Jesus or Michael? Very confusing.

Thanks Jeanne

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came to be through him, and without him nothing came to be. What came to be through him was life, and this life was the light of the human race; the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
(John 1:1-5).

According to the Gospel of John - and John is VERY EXPLICIT - the Word is Christ. He existed at the very beginning, having no beginning or end. He was with God because He was God. Having said that, John goes on to say that ALL things came through God and nothing was created without God, meaning that the Trinity existed in equality and because the Trinity is God, everything can be considered created by God. And what came through creation? LIFE. And what was the culmination of life? The Light of the human race: Christ. He came amidst the darkness of the human condition and the darkness has not overcome Him.

That shouldn’t be confusing to you. It might be for a JW, but for the Christian, not at all.

 

[choy]

peary, you’d be surprised how many other “Christian” sects deny Jesus is God

most of them are restorationists, or those who believed the True Church was apostatized commonly believed after John died. their founder claims that he spoke with God the Father/Jesus/an angel that told them they will be the one to restore the True Church of Jesus Christ and that the end is near

and commonly most of them see the Catholic Church as the evil institution that replaced the True Church and forced the True Church to disappear from around 100AD til the day their sect was born

 

[JeanneH]

Ah, I wasn’t aware of that. Thanks for the info!

My pleasure.

 

[JeanneH]

I would recommend reading “Surprised by Christ” which is written by a guy who is currently an Orthodox priest, but converted from Judaism to JW to some Protestant (I cant remember, sorry) to Orthodoxy. He spends entire chapters talking about why he realized JW theology was incompatible with the Bible, not even from an Orthodox perspective, but from a generic Christian perspective.

I have read several books on the subject but not this one. I will see if I can locate one.
thanks
Jeanne

 

[JeanneH]

Hi Peary, TheosisM. Mosacked

John 1:1 has been discussed to death on this forum. The Witnesses have their own convoluted teaching on this and they will not budge. More is the pity.
Jeanne