First visit to CC turns sour after women were up quoting scripture

[MontChevalier]

Today is my first, official visit to a Catholic Church. Before that, I was taken by force(Thank the parents), or not all. The church I went to is called “The Parroquia San Pedro Martir” (It translates to “The Saint Peter Martyr Parish”).

Their phone number is:
787-720-2361
And their fax is:
787-287-2833

I had an interesting time, but I feel that the women who were up talking at the podium weren’t suppose to be there. This one bit of scripture comes into my mind whenever this happens:

1 Timothy 2:12

“I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent.”

Yet, here is a place that has women doing this. (The teaching specifically)
Has things in the Catholic Church changed? Are these things okay? Is it allowed?

Then they gave this Bulletin.

It has all the names of the deacons, the priests, etc and that’s great, but when I turn it around, there’s all these…advertisements. Ads for restaurants, doctors, clinics, even refrigerators(Of all things!) and it’s got me twice as disturbed now. It makes me wonder if all of religion is just business.

Here’s a picture of the place:

http://enlaceapuertorico.com/images/002_guaynabo_iglesia.jpg

-MontChevalier

 

[GloriousOrder]

Were the women quoting the holy scriptures from the pulpit/ambo in the sanctuary beside the altar? Did it occur before the deacon read the Gospel about our Lord? If this is so, you have experienced lay readership. Lay readership is the practice of getting laypeople (men and women) to proclaim the Old Testament and/or New Testament readings for Mass that day. The deacon or celebrating priest always reads the Holy Gospel.

This tendency is (in my opinion) unfortunately part of the “spirit” of modern liturgy. We’re so obsessed with getting laypeople “involved” that the sanctuary is trampled about by every sort of unconsecrated and non-ordained person and the priests don’t read anything anymore. I can hardly get too indignant, though, since I was recruited last Thursday (against my will, I assure you! ) to read some of the readings. At least I’m not a woman…

 

[malphono]

I had an interesting time, but I feel that the women who were up talking at the podium weren’t suppose to be there. …

Are these things okay? Is it allowed?

One has to assume that this was a Novus Ordo Mass. If so, whether it’s “allowed” or not depends on exactly what was done. If these women were reading the Lessons, it is as [post=7872291]GloriousOrder[/post] said earlier. If, however, they were giving a sermon (or homily), that is not allowed.

Now, if this was Mass in the Usus Antiquior, none of it is allowed.

Then they gave this Bulletin.

It has all the names of the deacons, the priests, etc and that’s great, but when I turn it around, there’s all these…advertisements. Ads for restaurants, doctors, clinics, even refrigerators(Of all things!) and it’s got me twice as disturbed now. It makes me wonder if all of religion is just business.

That’s perfectly normal. Every parish bulletin I’ve ever seen (and I’ve seen a lot of them over a lot of years) has advertisements at the end. The revenue from the advertisers defrays the cost of printing the bulletin.

 

[MontChevalier]

Hey everyone,

Thanks for your comments.

Is this all a part of Vatican II?

I figured that the priest could at the very least do a little talking. He would stand up speak loudly and clearly, tell a few liberals to go to hell (literally) , give a few teachings with how to live the week, then give the sermon, do the bread and wine thing and sit back down. The guy just did the sermon, gave that bread and wine thing and that was it.

I guess I just expected more…although, the church was exceedingly full. So full, in fact, that people were pouring to get inside. I got there earlier though, so it was easy for me to find a seat, but MY GOD was it full. I have only seen empty churches before, but this just cuts the cake. I can take pictures next time, if anyone wants to see.

The part of the “Lay Readership” was actually quite discouraging…
Anyone else feel that way, or is it just me?

Either way, I still think I should go through with entering the Catholic Church, it can’t be that bad to do so. Can’t it?

-MontChevalier

 

[JamestheOlder]

Looks like a nice small church in Puerto Rico. They probably need the revenue from the advertisements on the back of the bulletin to pay for printing it. It’s done in a LOT of US parishes, including ours here in Georgia (US).

We have a “Spanish” Mass said at our parish in the Ordinary Form (OF), which is termed the Novus Ordo (New Order). This Mass has two additional readings from Scripture beyond the older Lantin Rite (Tridentine) Mass. All four readings are done in the vernacular (Spanish, in this case), and any of the first three Scripture Readings (usually Old Testament, followed by a Psalm, followed by a New Testament Reading) may be proclaimed (note the word) by a lay Reader or Lector, either male or female. The fourth Reading is the Gospel, and this is only proclaimed by deacon, priest or Bishop, in that order of preference.

So, what you attended was probably a perfectly “normal” Novus Ordo Mass, said in the vernacular (Spanish, I would guess).

Welcome!

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

Hey everyone,

Thanks for your comments.

Is this all a part of Vatican II?

I figured that the priest could at the very least do a little talking. He would stand up speak loudly and clearly, tell a few liberals to go to hell (literally) , give a few teachings with how to live the week, then give the sermon, do the bread and wine thing and sit back down. The guy just did the sermon, gave that bread and wine thing and that was it.

I guess I just expected more…although, the church was exceedingly full. So full, in fact, that people were pouring to get inside. I got there earlier though, so it was easy for me to find a seat, but MY GOD was it full. I have only seen empty churches before, but this just cuts the cake. I can take pictures next time, if anyone wants to see.

The part of the “Lay Readership” was actually quite discouraging…
Anyone else feel that way, or is it just me?

Either way, I still think I should go through with entering the Catholic Church, it can’t be that bad to do so. Can’t it?

-MontChevalier

Women reading the OT or Epistle reading is not teaching, the teaching is the homily.

I also find your tone, especially the “bread and wine thing”, very disrespectful.

 

[dixieagle]

Your tone is flip, disrespectful and grossly immature (“bread and wine” thing? Really?)

I suggest you enroll in an RCIA program and learn about the Catholic Church before you make any further posts.

 

[LemonAndLime]

I know exactly what you mean! They shouldn’t let the women approach the altar at all!

I mean, who served Christ and stood by him at the original sacrifice at the Cross? Mary Mother of God, Mary Magadeline… yeah sure, women shouldn’t be preaching or near the altar.

Who did he first appear to? A woman, who went to proclaim he has risen to the rest of the disciples.

You’re right - us women should be silent. Why even bother to teach us how to read the Bible? It is better that we are taught it by superior men, Christ certainly did not value women’s ability to read scripture or preach on his behalf. In fact, women should not even read, write, or speak in public at all! Best that they are kept indoors and leave such things to men with greater intellectual ability.

Perhaps you should take a look at Saudi Arabia, I think you’ll fit in there with their views on women.

 

[GloriousOrder]

You’re right - us women should be silent. Why even bother to teach us how to read the Bible? It is better that we are taught it by superior men, Christ certainly did not value women’s ability to read scripture or preach on his behalf. In fact, women should not even read, write, or speak in public at all! Best that they are kept indoors and leave such things to men with greater intellectual ability.

Perhaps you should take a look at Saudi Arabia, I think you’ll fit in there with their views on women.

There’s no need to be flippant, dear lady. Do you think the holy, blessed Apostle St. Paul, who is currently in the heights of Heaven, would be comfortable in dictatorial Saudi Arabia, too? What do you make of the quote from the Epistle to Timothy, in all your righteous feminist indignation?

 

[LemonAndLime]

There’s no need to be flippant, dear lady. Do you think the holy, blessed Apostle St. Paul, who is currently in the heights of Heaven, would be comfortable in dictatorial Saudi Arabia, too? What do you make of the quote from the Epistle to Timothy, in all your righteous feminist indignation?

I’m sure you do object to my “feminist indignation”, you certainly don’t like the sanctuary being “trampled” by us unclean women.

I’ll answer your question with another, what do you think of the quote which says men should call no one else Father?

The lesson to learn is this - You cannot take one verse of the Bible and take it to have absolute authority. According to that verse, women should not be permitted to teach. So I ask you another question - Why is it that we do NOT adhere to this teaching in the Bible? I think I’m correct in thinking that Catholics do not adhere to it literally, so does that make the rest of us righteous feminists?

St. Paul would not be comfortable in Saudi Arabia, but the OP is implying that St Paul would be comfortable with the Saudi view on women teaching/preaching.

 

[Ruth_Catherine]

Today is my first, official visit to a Catholic Church. Before that, I was taken by force(Thank the parents), or not all. The church I went to is called “The Parroquia San Pedro Martir” (It translates to “The Saint Peter Martyr Parish”).

Their phone number is:
787-720-2361
And their fax is:
787-287-2833

I had an interesting time, but I feel that the women who were up talking at the podium weren’t suppose to be there. This one bit of scripture comes into my mind whenever this happens:

1 Timothy 2:12

“I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent.”

Yet, here is a place that has women doing this. (The teaching specifically)
Has things in the Catholic Church changed? Are these things okay? Is it allowed?

Then they gave this Bulletin.

It has all the names of the deacons, the priests, etc and that’s great, but when I turn it around, there’s all these…advertisements. Ads for restaurants, doctors, clinics, even refrigerators(Of all things!) and it’s got me twice as disturbed now. It makes me wonder if all of religion is just business.

Here’s a picture of the place:

http://enlaceapuertorico.com/images/002_guaynabo_iglesia.jpg

-MontChevalier

Coming into the Catholic church after being in a protestant church can be very confusing. I’ve been there.

In a Catholic church the bread and wine are turned into the body, blood, soul and divinity of Jesus Christ.

In order to completely understand what is going on and join the Church, this fall start an RCIA class. That way you can completely join the Church and partake in the Holy Eucharist. Also, helpful is to get a Baltimore catechism. One that is in question, answer format for teens to adults. These books explain the teachings of the Church and what is going on during Mass.

 

[Thomas_Casey]

DISRESPECT TOWARD THE HOLY EUCHARIST OR TOWARD ANY FORM OF THE LITURGY IS PROHIBITED.

If you have a question or problem with my position, send me a PM. This is not negotiable.

THOMAS CASEY