Fish On Fridays Just During Lent or Not?

[Robert_Burns]

I have heard conflicting reports on this. I always assumed that it was just during Lent until I heard an apologist on Catholic Answers Live once say that contrary to popular belief it was originally every Friday year round, and it has never changed. It’s just that you can also do some other sacrificial act of charity in lieu of eating fish.

I told my convert friend, and he very confidently assured me, no, that is not true. It’s only during Lent.

Which one is true? Is there some documentation to support either/or?

You can abstain from Meat on every Friday and there is no Law against doing so. The obvious question is - what is required. I saw a program on EWTN and the Priest was saying that although the Practise was no longer being practised as Before the penance itself was never abrogated - Catholics were to offer a penance to replace not eating meat on Fridays if they chose to no longer do what prior had been required (Abstinence) Then under JPII - the Catholics began to offer Abtinence on Fridays during Lent but not year round. So to make a long story short - Some type of penance should be done on All Fridays whether abstinence from meat is practised or not.

As for myself and my Family - we have always Practised Abstinence from Meat on Friday so I really dont pay that much attention to what others do.

Hope this helps

Pax

 

[Ashurie]

It is every Friday in my little world…good Catholics supporting fish and chipperies everywhere. Oh yes, usually mum’s night off (cooking that is )

I did that for the whole of Easter this year, got fish and chips takeaway, and said grace before eating it.

At the moment I live with a Anglican man - not a practicing one…and yeah…I am moving in less than 2 weeks, so when I move and I will observing every Friday with fish and chips well maybe so vege on the side

 

[Robert_Burns]

You can abstain from Meat on every Friday and there is no Law against doing so. The obvious question is - what is required. I saw a program on EWTN and the Priest was saying that although the Practise was no longer being practised as Before the penance itself was never abrogated - Catholics were to offer a penance to replace not eating meat on Fridays if they chose to no longer do what prior had been required (Abstinence) Then under JPII - the Catholics began to offer Abtinence on Fridays during Lent but not year round. So to make a long story short - Some type of penance should be done on All Fridays whether abstinence from meat is practised or not.

As for myself and my Family - we have always Practised Abstinence from Meat on Friday so I really dont pay that much attention to what others do.

Hope this helps

Pax

You wrote: “As for myself and my Family - we have always Practised Abstinence from Meat on Friday so I really dont pay that much attention to what others do.”

I didn’t want to say anything in the thread to embarass you, and I really mean no offense. I am a communications major (well, actually interdisciplinary studies in Pastoral, Educational Ministry, and Communication). I’m not perfect myself, but for some reason it always bothers me when I see typos or poor grammar, like scratching a chalkboard with fingernails…especially from intelligent people in apologetic forums, professional apologists on the radio, and tv, or any professional (i.e. news reporters, etc.) (and I don’t mean to pick on you, specifically). I think it is a sad commentary on the state of our educational system.

Anyway, again, having said all that the term practice is spelled with a “c”, not an “s”, unless you are from England, Australia, or some other closely related place. But here in America it has always been spelled, “practice” vs. “practise”. If you are of one of those other places of origin, please accept my humble apology.

Again, I mean no offense. I would certainly appreciate any charitable critique of my typos, etc. Godbless.

Robert: None taken. If all you have to complain about is my grammar and spelling than thats a good thing. Perhaps a review of Luke 14 : 11 is in order.

 

[Robert_Burns]

You wrote: “As for myself and my Family - we have always Practised Abstinence from Meat on Friday so I really dont pay that much attention to what others do.”

I didn’t want to say anything in the thread to embarass you, and I really mean no offense. I am a communications major (well, actually interdisciplinary studies in Pastoral, Educational Ministry, and Communication). I’m not perfect myself, but for some reason it always bothers me when I see typos or poor grammar, like scratching a chalkboard with fingernails…especially from intelligent people in apologetic forums, professional apologists on the radio, and tv, or any professional (i.e. news reporters, etc.) (and I don’t mean to pick on you, specifically). I think it is a sad commentary on the state of our educational system.

Anyway, again, having said all that the term practice is spelled with a “c”, not an “s”, unless you are from England, Australia, or some other closely related place. But here in America it has always been spelled, “practice” vs. “practise”. If you are of one of those other places of origin, please accept my humble apology.

Again, I mean no offense. I would certainly appreciate any charitable critique of my typos, etc. Godbless.

Robert: None taken. If all you have to complain about is my grammar and spelling than thats a good thing. Perhaps a review of Luke 14 : 11 is in order.

Practise / Practice
In many parts of the English speaking world (UK, Ireland, Australia, Canada, and South Africa) “practice” is the noun, “practise” the verb. However, in the U.S.A the spelling “practice” is more often used for both the noun and the verb. Contrary to popular belief a significant minority of the American population also observe the distinction. If you are not sure about what a verb or noun is, it might be safer to just use the spelling “practice”, as many Americans do!

 

[Genesius]

Again, please accept my humble apology. If you notice in my original private message (not intending to use this thread to discuss this matter), although I mentioned the possible typo, I also explained that I was not attacking you personally, nor judging you particularly. I was simply pointing out the need for all ‘professionals’ to at least try to resemble educated people. As it turns out I was wrong about the official spelling, though the only time I ever had seen the term spelled that way was by Englanders, etc. I was never taught that in grammar school, middle school, high school, nor college.

Yes, none of us are perfect. We all make mistakes, but if we don’t try to better ourselves we don’t do much justice to honoring God with our whole being (including our minds). I know I have learned something from this by humbly accepting charitable criticism. If I let pride get in the way, I wouldn’t have lernt a thing. After all, doesn’t God deserve our best? This applies to me as well.

But, again, we are digressing from the topic at hand.

 

[white_sheep]

It’s my opinion that there is no requirement to either abstain from meat or perform penitential acts on Fridays outside of Lent. We are strongly encouraged to do so with emphasis on abstaining from meat, but it is not mandatory under pain of sin.

At least that’s what I’ve understood from my time spent reading up on this matter.

If it is otherwise, I’d say the fact that it is a secret and practically no priest or bishop says otherwise abrogates all culpability.

Here’s the statement on my diocese website:

The Church strongly encourages the observance of Friday abstinence throughout the year, but failure to do so is not regarded as sinful.

Now if it was written where after sinful there was a comma and it said “provided you offer an act of penance instead” that would change things.
and also:

On Fridays, when abstinence is not required by law, acts of penance, especially works of charity and exercises of piety are suggested. Abstinence from meat is especially recommended but under no obligation by law.

Again, after law it did not say “provided you offer an act of penance”.

 

[Genesius]

It’s good that you investigated, White Sheep…and that you are wanting to be in compliance with your diocese. I guess the question would be, is your diocese in compliance with the bishops of Rome? It very well may be. I’m not saying otherwise, but I have gotten replies in other forums implying that, and indicating that Rome has the last word.

Again, not saying I know either way.

 

[white_sheep]

It’s good that you investigated, White Sheep…and that you are wanting to be in compliance with your diocese. I guess the question would be, is your diocese in compliance with the bishops of Rome? It very well may be. I’m not saying otherwise, but I have gotten replies in other forums implying that, and indicating that Rome has the last word.

Again, not saying I know either way.

I suppose someone can think that, but when I read the Vatican documents pertaining to this matter I see clearly that they left it up to the bishop’s conference of your respective country to determine the policy. In my opinion the Vatican was very clear. So it is left up to the USCCB to determine what the discipline will be for Catholics in the U.S.

My understanding from reading the USCCB’s document on the matter is that it leaves the matter unclear but leans towards there being no requirement of any sort on Fridays outside of Lent. That understanding has been reinforced by every priest and bishop I’ve had for the last few decades as well as what is currently written on my diocese website. I’ve also asked priests on the internet this question, ones I hold in high regard, and they say that there is no requirement. They also plainly teach that we should either abstain from meat on Friday or perform a penitential act, but that it is not a requirement. The fact that we should and that our bishops, priests, and even the Vatican highly promote the idea ought to be enough for us.

There seems to be few people of real authority on the other side of the argument. At least that’s how I see it. On one hand you have virtually every cleric in the country saying there is no requirement, on the other you have ____________?

Edit to add: I don’t think my bishop has authority to change the discipline as it was left up to the USCCB, but I do believe he has the authority to relate such disciplines to his flock. Unless it is obviously contradictory I don’t believe I really have the authority to question his decision.

 

[jmcrae]

Edit to add: I don’t think my bishop has authority to change the discipline as it was left up to the USCCB, but I do believe he has the authority to relate such disciplines to his flock. Unless it is obviously contradictory I don’t believe I really have the authority to question his decision.

You should obviously follow the law as it is in your own Diocese - however, without assuming that it is the same elsewhere. It is only the case in a very, very few places (yours being one of them) that there is no law of penance on Fridays at all. In most of North America and some parts of Europe, the law is to make some kind of act of penance on Fridays - either abstaining from meat, or something else. In the rest of the world, it is to abstain from meat, except for some Spanish-speaking countries.

 

[Adeodatus]

Again, according to Canon Law the bishops’ conferences (such as the USCCB) have the authority to define appropriate forms of penance for Fridays, but it does not appear that they are given the authority to abolish Friday penance.

Of course, we live in an era of painfully vague documents and rules which are never enforced. So I understand if confusion about the matter abides in virtually anyone.

 

[Robert_Burns]

Again, please accept my humble apology. If you notice in my original private message (not intending to use this thread to discuss this matter), although I mentioned the possible typo, I also explained that I was not attacking you personally, nor judging you particularly. I was simply pointing out the need for all ‘professionals’ to at least try to resemble educated people. As it turns out I was wrong about the official spelling, though the only time I ever had seen the term spelled that way was by Englanders, etc. I was never taught that in grammar school, middle school, high school, nor college.

Yes, none of us are perfect. We all make mistakes, but if we don’t try to better ourselves we don’t do much justice to honoring God with our whole being (including our minds). I know I have learned something from this by humbly accepting charitable criticism. If I let pride get in the way, I wouldn’t have lernt a thing. After all, doesn’t God deserve our best? This applies to me as well.

But, again, we are digressing from the topic at hand.

There is no need to apologize to me , I am a mere publican and sinner , So therefore there is nothing to be forgiven. We are Catholics and ultimately it is GOD who humbles all of us from time to time for our own good.

Have a great weekend…

pax

 

[Robert_Burns]

Again, according to Canon Law the bishops’ conferences (such as the USCCB) have the authority to define appropriate forms of penance for Fridays, but it does not appear that they are given the authority to abolish Friday penance.

Of course, we live in an era of painfully vague documents and rules which are never enforced. So I understand if confusion about the matter abides in virtually anyone.

Well said The reason for Friday penance has not been abolished either - so I think it comes down to the old axiom - Lex Orandi Lex Credendi - and instead of doing the minimum out of obligation or fear of committing sin - perhaps we should be compelled to do more than that for the love of Christ and the spirit of reparation for the great sins of our day , like “Homosexual” Marriage, Abortion , Modernism and widesprea Immorality? Should we wait to be told what we must do or are we going to be proactive and do what we know is good and wholesome and beneficial to our salvation and the salvation of lost souls.

Ok , I’ll get down off my soap box now

Pax

 

[Adeodatus]

Well said The reason for Friday penance has not been abolished either - so I think it comes down to the old axiom - Lex Orandi Lex Credendi - and instead of doing the minimum out of obligation or fear of committing sin - perhaps we should be compelled to do more than that for the love of Christ and the spirit of reparation for the great sins of our day , like “Homosexual” Marriage, Abortion , Modernism and widesprea Immorality? Should we wait to be told what we must do or are we going to be proactive and do what we know is good and wholesome and beneficial to our salvation and the salvation of lost souls.

Ok , I’ll get down off my soap box now

Pax

You’re right. Folks want to end abortion? Pray and do penance. Want to reverse the tide of Modernism? Pray and do penance. Want to defend marriage? Pray and do penance. Want to end Eucharistic descration? Pray and do penance. Want to win converts to the Faith? Pray and do penance.

Sure, we can march for life and we can vote Republican and we can do all these other things… but those only go so far. Rather than sit around waiting for the Catholic Counter-Revolution, we can put our time to good use by… praying and doing penance.

 

[white_sheep]

Regardless of whether there is an actual requirement, your bishop telling you he wants you to do this should be sufficient. It really shouldn’t go farther than that. But they do, all the bishops of the country say the same, and the Vatican does as well. How many bishops need to say it before we just acquiesce?

 

[ChrisCrop]

You’re right. Folks want to end abortion? Pray and do penance. Want to reverse the tide of Modernism? Pray and do penance. Want to defend marriage? Pray and do penance. Want to end Eucharistic descration? Pray and do penance. Want to win converts to the Faith? Pray and do penance.

Sure, we can march for life and we can vote Republican and we can do all these other things… but those only go so far. Rather than sit around waiting for the Catholic Counter-Revolution, we can put our time to good use by… praying and doing penance.

Really??? that’s all you got to do is pray???
wish someone had told me AND all the other thousands of prolifers earlier!

 

[oneGODoneCHURCH]

Really??? that’s all you got to do is pray???
wish someone had told me AND all the other thousands of prolifers earlier!

NO. the prayer and penence is in addition to those other things. Pray, fast and vote the right issues. Pray, fast, and get involed in pro-life isses.

By adding Prayer and fasting we are taking the fight to the next level.

 

[Adeodatus]

Really??? that’s all you got to do is pray???
wish someone had told me AND all the other thousands of prolifers earlier!

Why react with indignation to something I didn’t even say?

I said to march for life, vote Republican, etc. We should do all the things that are necessary materially in the struggle. And yet they only go so far. We should not forget to fast and pray as well. Those have real efficacy.