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PrayingTwice
Guest
What has the Vatican said about flags in the sanctuary? My home parish has an American flag and a Vatican flag in our church and I was wondering if this was still allowed.
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yinekka
Guest
I don’t think that there is a ruling on this matter. I personally am not comfortable with flags in the church. At my church we have the Australian flag on Anzac Day and the papal flag on a day I can’t remember. 
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Annunciata
Guest
We have them in our Sanctuary…I don’t think they are supposed to be there though. Our pastor only placed them there after 9/11…?
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space_ghost
Guest
i believe in the separation of church and state… that being said though… we have old glory in our church and it is not an issue with me… if it came to a vote however, i would vote not to have it…
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Brain
Guest
we have a US and Vtican flag in the nave
and we fly the flags outside too (Vatican higher).
and we fly the flags outside too (Vatican higher).
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Andreas_Hofer
Guest
I grew up thinking that flags in the sanctuary were the norm, only to learn at college that the United States is the only country to have them there full time (I say full time because of the above Australian post). I think the flag traces back to the infancy of the nation when Catholics were held under suspicion of being loyal to Rome over and above the national gov’t. It’s actually quite fascinating to read about all the political sorts of negotiations between American Catholics and the Vatican during those early years in order to avoid even greater anti-Catholic sentiments. Most of these were conducted by John Carroll, later to become the first bishop of Baltimore.
(Bragging rights: despite anti-Catholicism, the richest man in the colonies was John’s brother Charles.)
(Bragging rights: despite anti-Catholicism, the richest man in the colonies was John’s brother Charles.)
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Digitonomy
Guest
Andreas Hofer:
Do you have a particular book or books as a source? I’d like to learn more about this period.
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catholicbudgie
Guest
yes, I think it’s one of those things where no specific ruling is required - i’ve been in churches sans flags, i’ve been in churches with flags. sometimes within 3 or 4 km of each other. quite often we fly a flag for special occaisons - recently for NAIDOC Week (National Aboriginal and Islander Day Of Commemoration) where we focus on our indigenous peoples.
I went to the memorial mass held by the Spanish community here in Melbourne after the Madrid bombings and there was a Spanish flag.
I went to the memorial mass held by the Spanish community here in Melbourne after the Madrid bombings and there was a Spanish flag.
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Faithful_2_Rome
Guest
Are we not “One Nation UNDER GOD”? Do we not say this in the Pledge? Are we not NOW fighting radical DEMONIC courts cause they wish to eliminate the Pledge in certain settings?(YES…to ALL)
Then as long as the Flag is not in the Sanctuary, there is nothing wrong with it being in a Church.
Then as long as the Flag is not in the Sanctuary, there is nothing wrong with it being in a Church.
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CMcLaurin
Guest
Speaking of flags, If one were to own both an American and Vatican flag, which would go above the other? I’d assume the American to be on the top, but I’m not sure if that would be putting America over the Church, which is also a nation.
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Debbie
Guest
From the USCCB website:
usccb.org/liturgy/q%26a/flag.htm
*The Display of Flags
in Roman Catholic Churches
in the United States of America
Surprisingly to many, there are no regulations of any kind governing the display of flags in Roman Catholic Churches. Neither the Code of Canon law, nor the liturgical books of the Roman rite comment on this practice. As a result, the question of whether and how to display the American flag in a Catholic Church is left up to the judgment of the diocesan bishop, who in turn often delegates this to the discretion of the pastor.
The origin of the display of the American flag in many parishes in the United States appears have its origins in the offering of prayers for those who served during the Second World War (1941-1945). At that time, many bishops and pastors provided a book of remembrance near the American flag, requesting prayers for loved ones – especially those serving their country in the armed forces – as a way of keeping before the attention of the faithful the needs of military families. This practice has since been confirmed in many places during the Korean, Viet Nam and Iraqi conflicts.
The Bishops’ Committee on the Liturgy has in the past encouraged pastors not to place the flag within the sanctuary itself, in order to reserve that space for the altar, the ambo, the presidential chair and the tabernacle. Instead, the suggestion has been made that the American flag be placed outside the sanctuary, or in the vestibule of the Church together with a book of prayer requests. It remains, however, for the diocesan bishop to determine regulations in this matter. *
Debbie
usccb.org/liturgy/q%26a/flag.htm
*The Display of Flags
in Roman Catholic Churches
in the United States of America
Surprisingly to many, there are no regulations of any kind governing the display of flags in Roman Catholic Churches. Neither the Code of Canon law, nor the liturgical books of the Roman rite comment on this practice. As a result, the question of whether and how to display the American flag in a Catholic Church is left up to the judgment of the diocesan bishop, who in turn often delegates this to the discretion of the pastor.
The origin of the display of the American flag in many parishes in the United States appears have its origins in the offering of prayers for those who served during the Second World War (1941-1945). At that time, many bishops and pastors provided a book of remembrance near the American flag, requesting prayers for loved ones – especially those serving their country in the armed forces – as a way of keeping before the attention of the faithful the needs of military families. This practice has since been confirmed in many places during the Korean, Viet Nam and Iraqi conflicts.
The Bishops’ Committee on the Liturgy has in the past encouraged pastors not to place the flag within the sanctuary itself, in order to reserve that space for the altar, the ambo, the presidential chair and the tabernacle. Instead, the suggestion has been made that the American flag be placed outside the sanctuary, or in the vestibule of the Church together with a book of prayer requests. It remains, however, for the diocesan bishop to determine regulations in this matter. *
Debbie
E
EENS
Guest
Putting an American flag in the Sanctuary started in WWII. It only made sense to also put the Vatican flag (so as not to make people think America is better). In any event, it was not correct to do so, since everything that is supposed to be in the Sanctuary is listed in the rubrics. Nothing extra should be added outside of necessity (e.g. a fan). Furthermore, a person cannot be an American supporter (known as Americanism) and still be Catholic, since Americanism is a heresy. It is a huge contradiction to say put an American flag in the Sanctuary.
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Math_Geek
Guest
This issue came up in my parish after 9/11.
We ended up putting the flag in the back of the church because of rules regarding the display of the American Flag. As I understand it, if an American flag is displayed in a prominent place like the sanctuary it is supposed to be the MOST prominent flag. It would have to be more prominent than the Vatican flag.
In order to show respect for both flags we decided that the sanctuary was not the best place. However we did have an American flag suspended over the opening to the church for a few weeks following 9/11 and we put that up at times of special national significance.
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Faithful_2_Rome
Guest
For ME, the Vatican Flag flies over the American one.
Reason:
It is impossible to live a life without faith/belief in God without ultimately leading one to Hell…No NATION/COUNTRY…can offer my eternal soul the promise of Salvation…EXCEPT the VATICAN… it is the ONLY (COUNTRY) on EARTH that can claim this…thru its teachings of Jesus Christ.
No matter WHAT (Nation) I was born in, the Church teaches I am a Pilgrim EXILE… put here to work on my Salvation and to head home… HEAVEN
Therefore: Vatican Flag over American for me…or for any Nation I would have been born in.
Reason:
It is impossible to live a life without faith/belief in God without ultimately leading one to Hell…No NATION/COUNTRY…can offer my eternal soul the promise of Salvation…EXCEPT the VATICAN… it is the ONLY (COUNTRY) on EARTH that can claim this…thru its teachings of Jesus Christ.
No matter WHAT (Nation) I was born in, the Church teaches I am a Pilgrim EXILE… put here to work on my Salvation and to head home… HEAVEN
Therefore: Vatican Flag over American for me…or for any Nation I would have been born in.
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catholicbudgie
Guest
I’ve just remembered something from my time in the Boy Scouts. The Vatican Flag, being as the Vatican is classed as a nation, is a soverign emblem, just as is the flag of any other country. It is a violation of protocol to have the flag of one friendly nation flying above another - it’s derived from ancient feudalism, if your flag is flying above anothers it’s a sign of a nation defeated in a military conquest.
The best allegory I can think of is recall all the flagposts outside the UN headquarters - all national symbols at the same height, to demonstrate that no one nation is superior to another.
The best allegory I can think of is recall all the flagposts outside the UN headquarters - all national symbols at the same height, to demonstrate that no one nation is superior to another.
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Fortiterinre
Guest
This is interesting since I had thought that it was no longer allowed to put flags in the sanctuary proper, and apparently while discouraged this is still allowed. I think the rule on the American flag is that it has to be to the right rather than “above” another flag, and within the U.S. this would be the best etiquette, just as in Vatican City no flag would fly to the right of the papal flag.
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