Follow jesus not people

[zz912]

Thanks church militant and Duane. Yeah id does seem like he thinks that. I think he might be thinking about the holy of holys and how only the high priest could go in. My guess is he thinks the temple veil ripping meant we don’t need priests anymore

He’s taking that verse WAAAY out of context. Inside the Temple, in the Holy of Holies, was the Ark of the Covenant, and above it would appear the presence of God. Only Levitical priests were allowed in the Temple, and only the High Priest could enter the Holy of Holies, and only on one day every year. (in fact they used to tie a rope around the High Priest when he would enter, so that if he were to die suddenly inside, they could pull his body out without anyone entering).

When God tore the veil separating the Holy of Holies from the rest of the Temple, He did so on Good Friday, at the conclusion of the Last Supper/Crucifixion (these two events are actually one long event). God was showing that with the New Covenant, all men could approach God in the Eucharist.

Jesus is the High Priest now in the New Covenant, but there are still priests in the New Covenant. The veil is torn, so that we may approach God in the Eucharist. It doesn’t mean that God threw out all authority and His Church.

 

[tomarin]

I would tell him that the Church is made up of people, it’s a community of believers, and always has been. What would he say to that?

 

[PRmerger]

I posted a quote from bishop Robert Barron talking about how the media sees the catholic church as a political thing and not a sacred institution. My brother who is Baptist decided to say this

“The true problem is that religion shouldn’t be an institution in the first place. Jesus did not found an institution. People did. And we were not taught by Jesus to follow people, but to follow him”

Please if anyone can help show that the church is an institution (of course it much nor than that), and Jesus did tell us to follow his apostles.

Well, unless Jesus appears to him in a private revelation, the ONLY way your brother can follow Jesus is through following people. That is, people who follow Jesus.

 

[dsfgsadfgsdfg]

Nor is it to “force” someone to leave their beliefs.

I want to show my brother the truth. I want him to know what he is rejecting and that the catholic faith is true and is the fullness of what God has set for him. Things like this argument he makes is one of many ideas he has that is preventing him from seeing the truth of Catholicism. I want to clear the brush. Not only for my brother but this is growing among many people who are dear to me. So I think its important to know how to deal with it

Its a little dumbfounding to me that you don’t see what is in your own words. Let me show you what I see
“I want to show my brother the truth.”
You don’t seem to like it when he degrades your beliefs, so why in the world are you doing it to him? Do you not understand that this smacks of arrogance? You are telling him—you don’t know anything but I know the truth and you’re a fool for not obeying me.

“I want him to know what he is rejecting and that the catholic faith is true and is the fullness of what God has set for him”
To someone who is not catholic, this is extremely rude. If someone walked up to you and said–I don’t get those catholics, they worship Mary—would that not blow your mind and irritate you? Its not true and its an insult to your faith or a huge misunderstanding on their part. Why do you think that its not ok for someone to insult YOUR faith but you can trample all over someone else’s faith?

You have your faith and beliefs. That is wonderful! Your brother has his faith and beliefs too.
I’m just dumbfounded that you can’t seem to find a way to just be kind and respectful to him.
Do you really think that the best example of your faith that you can show him is telling him he’s stupid?

Dude, if you walked up to me and rattled off arrogantly and insisting that I was just an idiot for not being exactly like you, I’d walk away from you. If you wanted to just have a calm discussion about different faiths, no problem.

Your choice. Kindness and being respectful to others or just keep beating on each other.

 

[Gorgias]

Its a little dumbfounding to me that you don’t see what is in your own words. Let me show you what I see
“I want to show my brother the truth.”
You don’t seem to like it when he degrades your beliefs, so why in the world are you doing it to him? Do you not understand that this smacks of arrogance? You are telling him—you don’t know anything but I know the truth and you’re a fool for not obeying me.

Interesting.

So… what you’re saying is that Shaolen is following an inexcusable path by having found something that – to Shaolen – is ‘truth’, and trying to lead another to that truth (even if that other person doesn’t see it like Shaolen does).

And yet, isn’t that precisely what you’re doing? After all, what you’re telling Shaolen is exactly what Shaolen is saying to his brother: “hey! I recognize that you’re doing what you think is best… but, trust me, you’re not! Stop doing this thing that you’re doing – since it isn’t what’s best! – and start doing this other thing that I think is best!”

The only difference between you and Shaolen isn’t one of degree, but one simply of object – Shaolen sees “the truth of the teachings of the Catholic Church” as primary, and you see “the truth of being kind of respectful of others’ beliefs” as primary.

In other words, both you and Shaolen are playing the same game… even though you’re willing to castigate Shaolen for playing the same game you are.

 

[steve_b]

My brother who is Baptist decided to say this

“The true problem is that religion shouldn’t be an institution in the first place. Jesus did not found an institution. People did. And we were not taught by Jesus to follow people, but to follow him”

He shoots himself in both feet.

1. 
   *]He’s a Baptist. **Baptist Beginnings - **From the Baptists themselves. In spite of efforts by some, we know who invented the baptists, it’s John Smyth NOT Jesus Christ. The Baptists are a 100% tradition of men started 1600 years after Jesus established HIS Church. The Church He said not even the gates of hell would prevail against it. The one He gave all His promises to.
   *]Jesus started the Catholic Church #34 Jesus said there is to be zero division in His Church John 17:20-23

 

[Frankenfurter]

My guess is he thinks the temple veil ripping meant we don’t need priests anymore

But after the veil was ripped, we have the resurrected Jesus talking to his disciples and telling them to ‘Feed my sheep’ John 21:15. And then ‘go out and baptize’ and ‘forgive sins’ etc.

Please have your brother re-read all of the scriptures of Jesus’ commands after he returned. It is impossible to read these and not come to the conclusion that Jesus was leaving us his church.

But let him discover it himself as much as possible.