For all married Catholics and single Catholics considering marriage

[eyesopening]

Your reading me wrong

I’m saying that just because they are not Catholic doesn’t mean we should cross them off of our list, that’s like saying “I refuse to date someone who doesn’t know that 2+2=4 or is admit that 2+2=5.”

My sister dated a devout protestant, who is now converting to Catholcisim, she didn’t date him in order to convert him, but she didn’t refuse to date him because he was a devout protestant either.

My father was a devout protestant who married my Catholic mum, in his efforts to prove my mother wrong in Catholicism, he ended up proving her right and became a roman catholic. He was also not content with “agree to disagree” and knew that it’s important to be on a united front in marriage, which is what I want to emphasise in this thread.

I’m saying that what ever the religious differences, people should work through them, it’s no different to any other issue, both husband and wife should be on a united front when going into any marriage or currently in any marriage.

God Bless

Thank you for reading
Josh

Josh,

Thanks for clarifying! Yes, I’m sure that works out a lot. Unfortunately I’m afraid that it works out the other way a lot of the time too. I teach a young lady piano lessons. I have known the family for years. They attend a big Southern Baptist church in Houston and they would come have their lessons at the Presbyterian Church that I used to play in. When I was leaving the Presbyterian Church for the Catholic Church I needed to inform them that we’d no longer use the facility at the Pres. Church for our lessons but would go back to having them at my residence. When I informed them, her mother looked noticeably concerned and asked me what brought about my conversion. I briefly explained that theological reasons had led me to the Catholic Church. She explained to me that she actually had been raised Catholic and that she had her daughter (my student) baptized in the Catholic Church, but that her husband really hated the Catholic Church so they eventually just started attending a Baptist Church. She also mentioned that she never bothered to have her son baptized at all since many fundamentalists do not think baptism is necessary. Well, although I didn’t show her, I was quite shocked because I’d known this girl since she was 7 and now she’s 16, and never once had there been any indication that they had ever been other than protestant.

Being a protestant for many many years, I have met dozens of people who have left the Catholic Church for their protestant husband or wife. When I was a die hard reformed theology fan, I even talked a Catholic lady into leaving the Church to be with her protestant boyfriend. She is now in an irregular marriage (at my urging; her husband was previously married) and considers herself thoroughly Presbyterian. When I converted to Catholicism she acted quite disgusted with me.

Although I agree with you that we should not discriminate against a person because they are protestant, I’m just not sure its a good idea to get romantically involved. As I stated before, the Church has good reason for suggesting that Catholics only marry other Catholics. I wonder what earlier Catholics would have thought about Catholics marrying Arianists or Docetists, or Gnostics? Protestantism is a heresy. We can love them, and hopefully bring them back to the church, but I think they compromise our Catholic faith.

I’m positive I’m going to get a lot of disagreement on this, but I am stating the more consistent historical viewpoint of the Church.

 

[_Angelino]

Josh -

I’ve tried to respond to all of your questions to the best of my ability below. Please let me know if you need further clarification.

I must have pushed all the right buttons than, haha

No buttons were pushed for me when reading this thread. I just wanted to add my experiences to the discussion. I’m coming from a place of love and compassion when I post here.

If you granfather was studying to be a Methodist minister, why did he raise his kids Catholic?

There are a ton of reasons, but here are a few: Because he loved my grandmother. Because the Protestant doctrine of “salvation by faith alone” doesn’t necessarily exclude Catholics from heaven. Because he recognized that brothers and sisters in Christ (regardless of denomination) share a common bond that is greater than their differences. Because he and my grandmother agreed to do so when they were married in the Church.

Yes, that matters, but religion also matters alot, if religion doesn’t matter alot, my first question would be why? so I wouldn’t downplay it.

I don’t think I ever downplayed it. If I came off that way, I apoligize. I just wanted to point out that it is not a “deal breaker” for many happily married couples

I would simply ask, do you settle with “agree to disagree” on important matters such as religion with your spouse? are you content with religious division?

While dogmatically our religions differ, the way they manifest themselves in our daily actions are remarkably the same. We both place a strong emphasis on compassion, love for our neighbor, social justice, etc. Think of it this way: even if one were not Christian, the Beatitudes would still ring true on a purely secular reading of them. I place a greater emphasis on this - how our daily actions are impacted and guided by our faith - over doctrinal debates. I have been heartened to see indications that Pope Francis seems to feel the same way.

As I said before, we all have the same book (Bible) so someone is right and someone is wrong, we can’t all be right with completely different interpretations of the same book.

Firstly, Unitarians don’t limit themselves to the Bible for sacred scripture. That said, as I stated above, how one’s faith impacts their daily decisions is more important to me than proving ones “rightness” or “wrongness.”

If both your parents studied the same mathematics text book and one of your parents said 2+2=4 and the other said 2+2=5, What would you think of learning mathematics? because even your parents who are apparently educated on mathematics can’t agree.

Science and religion are not the same. They are two ways at finding truth. So I would contend that this analogy is inapplicable to the topic at hand.

I think with any issue, it’s very important for parents to be on a united front when raising their kids, if your not on a united front it presents all kinds of difficulties and the kids will play on your division.

Agreed as to the united front part.

I would like to ask, how does religious practice work? do you go to a Catholic Church and your husband goes to another Church?

My wife and I attend both services.

than what Church will your kids go to?

Catholic church. I made an oath to this effect during our pre-marital counseling and paperwork with our parish.

and if your husband goes to your Church, than he cannot participate in recieving the Holy Eucharist, that enourmous gift where Christ comes down and feeds us with his body, blood, soul and divinity, so than he is missing out

That would be the Catholic position. Conversely one of a different faith would not feel they were missing out on anything.

Also as others have said, marriage is a sacrament,

Mine isn’t.

so if you both believe different things about marriage, than you are both signing completely different contracts.

Marriage is a covenant, not a contract. There is a tremendous difference between the two.

Now in saying all of this, I am not trying to have a shot or anything like that,

Thank you.

If he is protestant, I strongly recommend him listening to Scott Hahn’s conversion story on youtube here - youtube.com/watch?v=FrQN8LHYg5g

Unitarians are not Christian, Protestant or otherwise.

I simply want to encourage you not to be content with “agree to disagree” on matters as important as religion, because there is much more fulfilment in a united marriage than a mixed marriage. I know many people will probably take exception to this, but I think it’s absolutely true and very important.

How do you know this? I make the assumption that you have not been in both a mixed marriage as well as a purely Catholic marriage. If that’s not the case, please let me know the circumstances, I would be interested in hearing them. If you make this assertion based on a text (scriptural or otherwise) please cite the sources and I would be happy to continue this dialogue with them in mind.

God Bless

Thank you for reading
Josh

God bless you too and thank you for your thoughtful questions.

 

[josh987654321]

Josh -

I’ve tried to respond to all of your questions to the best of my ability below. Please let me know if you need further clarification.

No buttons were pushed for me when reading this thread. I just wanted to add my experiences to the discussion. I’m coming from a place of love and compassion when I post here.

I was only joking about “pushing buttons” to come here, I also try my best to always post out of love and compassion when I post here.

There are a ton of reasons, but here are a few: Because he loved my grandmother. Because the Protestant doctrine of “salvation by faith alone” doesn’t necessarily exclude Catholics from heaven. Because he recognized that brothers and sisters in Christ (regardless of denomination) share a common bond that is greater than their differences. Because he and my grandmother agreed to do so when they were married in the Church.

I’ll explain below when I relate to you and your wife.

I don’t think I ever downplayed it. If I came off that way, I apoligize. I just wanted to point out that it is not a “deal breaker” for many happily married couples

Oh absolutely, my apologies, I read too much into it.

While dogmatically our religions differ, the way they manifest themselves in our daily actions are remarkably the same. We both place a strong emphasis on compassion, love for our neighbor, social justice, etc. Think of it this way: even if one were not Christian, the Beatitudes would still ring true on a purely secular reading of them. I place a greater emphasis on this - how our daily actions are impacted and guided by our faith - over doctrinal debates. I have been heartened to see indications that Pope Francis seems to feel the same way.

The main point I was trying to make is over the Holy Eucharist, because while there is similarities as you have pointed out, the Holy Eucharist is a fundamental difference.

Christ comes down and feeds us with his body, blood, soul and divinity at every mass with his enourmous gift of the Holy Eucharist that he instituted at the last supper and explained in detail in John 6.

The point I wish to emphasise is to not ever be content with “agree to disagree” when it comes to religion as ultimately if you do, your wife will be the one missing out on that enourmous gift and the absolute truth of the Holy Eucharist.

Firstly, Unitarians don’t limit themselves to the Bible for sacred scripture. That said, as I stated above, how one’s faith impacts their daily decisions is more important to me than proving ones “rightness” or “wrongness.”

There are two facts that you should consider -

1. If the Holy Eucharist is true (which it is, if you ever question the truth to the Holy Eucharist please let me know as I have much to say on it), your wife is missing out on that enourmous gift where Christ comes down and feeds us with his body, blood, soul and divinity, where we have constant resource to him.
2. If the Holy Eucharist isn’t true, than we are all commiting idolatry at every mass

The fact of whether the Holy Eucharist is true or not, would make a large difference to how it impacts someones daily life wouldn’t it?

Science and religion are not the same. They are two ways at finding truth. So I would contend that this analogy is inapplicable to the topic at hand.

You can’t both be right with completely different contradictory beliefs though. So someone is right and someone is wrong. I’m just saying that we shouldn’t be content with “agree to disagree” when it come to religion.

Agreed as to the united front part.

My wife and I attend both services.

My apologies for assuming vice versa.

Catholic church. I made an oath to this effect during our pre-marital counseling and paperwork with our parish.

What does your wife think about this? because I know if I married a protestant and she made an oath to raise our kids Protestant, I would be in disagreement.

That would be the Catholic position. Conversely one of a different faith would not feel they were missing out on anything.

That’s true, but as I said, you know that she is missing out on it. Just because she doesn’t believe in it doesn’t make it any less real or true.

Mine isn’t.

What is it?

Marriage is a covenant, not a contract. There is a tremendous difference between the two.

The “contract” bit was a figure of speech. What is marriage to you and what is it to your wife?

Thank you.

Likewise.

Unitarians are not Christian, Protestant or otherwise.

Okay, I have never heard of Unitarians.

How do you know this? I make the assumption that you have not been in both a mixed marriage as well as a purely Catholic marriage. If that’s not the case, please let me know the circumstances, I would be interested in hearing them. If you make this assertion based on a text (scriptural or otherwise) please cite the sources and I would be happy to continue this dialogue with them in mind.

I’m not married, I didn’t cite a scriptural or otherwise source.

Isn’t it obvious though? how much more fulfillment in your marriage will there be when you both share in the same sacraments (holy eucharist) and share the same beleifs? when you both have resource to Christ’s body, blood, soul and divinity?

God bless you too and thank you for your thoughtful questions.

Thank you.

God Bless

Josh.

 

[josh987654321]

Josh,

Thanks for clarifying! Yes, I’m sure that works out a lot. Unfortunately I’m afraid that it works out the other way a lot of the time too. I teach a young lady piano lessons. I have known the family for years. They attend a big Southern Baptist church in Houston and they would come have their lessons at the Presbyterian Church that I used to play in. When I was leaving the Presbyterian Church for the Catholic Church I needed to inform them that we’d no longer use the facility at the Pres. Church for our lessons but would go back to having them at my residence. When I informed them, her mother looked noticeably concerned and asked me what brought about my conversion. I briefly explained that theological reasons had led me to the Catholic Church. She explained to me that she actually had been raised Catholic and that she had her daughter (my student) baptized in the Catholic Church, but that her husband really hated the Catholic Church so they eventually just started attending a Baptist Church. She also mentioned that she never bothered to have her son baptized at all since many fundamentalists do not think baptism is necessary. Well, although I didn’t show her, I was quite shocked because I’d known this girl since she was 7 and now she’s 16, and never once had there been any indication that they had ever been other than protestant.

Being a protestant for many many years, I have met dozens of people who have left the Catholic Church for their protestant husband or wife. When I was a die hard reformed theology fan, I even talked a Catholic lady into leaving the Church to be with her protestant boyfriend. She is now in an irregular marriage (at my urging; her husband was previously married) and considers herself thoroughly Presbyterian. When I converted to Catholicism she acted quite disgusted with me.

Although I agree with you that we should not discriminate against a person because they are protestant, I’m just not sure its a good idea to get romantically involved. As I stated before, the Church has good reason for suggesting that Catholics only marry other Catholics. I wonder what earlier Catholics would have thought about Catholics marrying Arianists or Docetists, or Gnostics? Protestantism is a heresy. We can love them, and hopefully bring them back to the church, but I think they compromise our Catholic faith.

I’m positive I’m going to get a lot of disagreement on this, but I am stating the more consistent historical viewpoint of the Church.

I’m actually very inclined to agree with you on “Catholics shouldn’t marry non-Catholics” the only reason I didn’t is because it can go either way and you are absolutely right, it could be just as likely to go the opposite way. So Id say I agree with you there, it’s far better if they can sort out their religious differences before marriage.

On the other hand though, those Catholics who converted for their spouse probably would have done it anyway for some other reason, Id be surprised if they knew the truth to the Catholic Church and gave it up for what they knew to be incorrect for their spouses.

Anyway you make some really good points, I mainly just disagree about the part of not getting romantically involved with someone of another faith, because many have simply never heard of the Catholic Church or just have many misconceptions about the Catholic Church.

Thank you for your reply eyesopening

God Bless

Thank you for reading
Josh

 

[_Angelino]

_Angelino_;11000955:

While dogmatically our religions differ, the way they manifest themselves in our daily actions are remarkably the same. We both place a strong emphasis on compassion, love for our neighbor, social justice, etc.

The main point I was trying to make is over the Holy Eucharist, because while there is similarities as you have pointed out, the Holy Eucharist is a fundamental difference.

Yes. This is a fundamental difference.

The fact of whether the Holy Eucharist is true or not, would make a large difference to how it impacts someones daily life wouldn’t it?

You seem to be implying that a spouse’s non-belief in the Real Presence undermines the viability of a marriage. This is simply not true as evidenced by the numerous people who have posted here in happy and morally good interfaith marriages.

You can’t both be right with completely different contradictory beliefs though. So someone is right and someone is wrong. I’m just saying that we shouldn’t be content with “agree to disagree” when it come to religion.

By your reference to “completely different contradictory beliefs” I assume you refer to the Eucharist. To be sure, the Holy Eucharist is a tremendously important tenet of our Catholic faith. But to reduce all of Catholicism to the Eucharist is to trivialize the other sacraments, dogmas, and beliefs that Catholic’s hold dear.

Moreover, the reduction of the entire Catholic faith to solely the Eucharist is to deny the clear teaching of the Church. I point to Nostra Aetate:

“The Catholic Church rejects nothing that is true and holy in these religions. She regards with sincere reverence those ways of conduct and of life, those precepts and teachings which, though differing in many aspects from the ones she holds and sets forth, nonetheless often reflect a ray of that Truth which enlightens all men.”

Viewing Catholicism properly as it’s whole, my wife and I have substantially more commonalities than differences. To list a few: We believe in one God. We believe that we are called to love God and to love our neighbor. We believe in the dignity of the human being. And we believe in our shared calling to serve the poor, feed the hungry, and clothe the naked.

I find yesterday’s Gospel, the parable of the Good Samaritan, incredibly on point. Jesus tells us that a Samaritan (someone outside the covenant) can be a greater keeper of God’s greatest commandment than those who have all the outward signs of holiness (the priest & Levite).

What does your wife think about this? [oath to raise children Catholic]

My wife & I are happy that our children will be raised to know & love God.

What is it?[if your marriage is not a Sacrament]

Natural marriage. Not all marriages are Sacramental.

I would encourage you to research this. It’s important to know the difference, especially when offering counsel on interfaith marriages.

_Angelino_;11000955:

Marriage is a covenant, not a contract. There is a tremendous difference

The “contract” bit was a figure of speech. What is marriage to you and what is it to your wife?

It’s a covenant.

_Angelino_;11000955:

Unitarians are not Christian.

Okay, I have never heard of Unitarians.

This is concerning. See below.

I’m not married, I didn’t cite a scriptural or otherwise source.

Isn’t it obvious though? how much more fulfillment in your marriage will there be when you both share in the same sacraments (holy eucharist) and share the same beleifs? when you both have resource to Christ’s body, blood, soul and divinity?

No! This is NOT sufficient foundation for your belief. Catholicism is the religion of faith AND reason. We are the religion of Aquinas & Moore! Reason, Church teaching, theology… all of these are essential tools in the communication of our faith. This ties into my final thoughts…

Please understand that this is not meant to be uncharitable, but must be firm:

This thread was created to share stories of those who are or have been a part of interfaith marriages. In your participation, you have stated both implicitly and explicitly that a marriage that is not founded on a common faith is one destined to fail, interfaith marriage should only be entered into for conversion, and you have questioned the parental wisdom in raising children with a non-Catholic spouse.

Yet, you admit that these opinions are lacking in any sufficient foundation.

You have no personal experience with marriage or children. You have not indicated any special education that would confer such knowledge (seminary, family therapy, etc.). In critiquing other religions you seem to have failed to avail yourself to a basic understanding of their beliefs (Episcopalians & Real Presence, Unitarianism & Christianity).

The greatest cause for concern, however, is your understanding of the Catholic faith as it relates to marriage. That there are two forms of marriage, that our faith cannot be reduced to solely the Eucharist, that the Church recognizes there are “rays of Truth” in other religions - these are all major issues that one must understand before speaking with any authority on the subject.

Again I do not doubt your motive was good, but I would urge you in the future to examine why you feel compelled to speak out on both sensitive issues such as this and, most importantly, whether your understanding of the issue is sufficiently informed by your experience, education, or Catholic teaching.

 

[josh987654321]

Yes. This is a fundamental difference.

You seem to be implying that a spouse’s non-belief in the Real Presence undermines the viability of a marriage. This is simply not true as evidenced by the numerous people who have posted here in happy and morally good interfaith marriages.

Well, like I said before, there are two facts you should consider.

1. If the Eucharist is true (which it is) than you wife is missing out on that enormous gift where Christ comes down and feeds us with his body, blood, soul and divinity.
2. If the Eucharist isn’t true, than we are committing idolatry.

Does it undermine the viability of your marriage? If your wife subscribes to 2) and you subscribe to 1)? You tell me.

By your reference to “completely different contradictory beliefs” I assume you refer to the Eucharist.

Yes.

To be sure, the Holy Eucharist is a tremendously important tenet of our Catholic faith. But to reduce all of Catholicism to the Eucharist is to trivialize the other sacraments, dogmas, and beliefs that Catholic’s hold dear.

The Eucharist is very important, I don’t believe I am reducing the Church by focusing on it.

The Eucharist was one example.

Moreover, the reduction of the entire Catholic faith to solely the Eucharist is to deny the clear teaching of the Church. I point to Nostra Aetate:

Do you have a link where I can read Nostra Aetate? Thank you.

“The Catholic Church rejects nothing that is true and holy in these religions. She regards with sincere reverence those ways of conduct and of life, those precepts and teachings which, though differing in many aspects from the ones she holds and sets forth, nonetheless often reflect a ray of that Truth which enlightens all men.”

True.

Viewing Catholicism properly as it’s whole, my wife and I have substantially more commonalities than differences. To list a few: We believe in one God. We believe that we are called to love God and to love our neighbor. We believe in the dignity of the human being. And we believe in our shared calling to serve the poor, feed the hungry, and clothe the naked.

And that is all great

I’m suggesting you focus on your differences and try to work through them though.

I find yesterday’s Gospel, the parable of the Good Samaritan, incredibly on point. Jesus tells us that a Samaritan (someone outside the covenant) can be a greater keeper of God’s greatest commandment than those who have all the outward signs of holiness (the priest & Levite).

True, but I think you have taken it a bit far to use it as a way of not evangelising. Should we all be Atheists just as long as we keep God’s commandments better than those who believe?

My wife & I are happy that our children will be raised to know & love God.

I just know that if the roles were reversed, I would not agree to raise my children protestant when I know that they are incorrect about a few things.

Natural marriage. Not all marriages are Sacramental.

I would encourage you to research this. It’s important to know the difference, especially when offering counsel on interfaith marriages.

It’s a covenant.

This is concerning. See below.

Okay.

No! This is NOT sufficient foundation for your belief.

The Eucharist?

Catholicism is the religion of faith AND reason. We are the religion of Aquinas & Moore! Reason, Church teaching, theology… all of these are essential tools in the communication of our faith. This ties into my final thoughts…

Please understand that this is not meant to be uncharitable, but must be firm:

This thread was created to share stories of those who are or have been a part of interfaith marriages. In your participation, you have stated both implicitly and explicitly that a marriage that is not founded on a common faith is one destined to fail, interfaith marriage should only be entered into for conversion, and you have questioned the parental wisdom in raising children with a non-Catholic spouse.

I don’t think interfaith marriages are destined to fail at all, I believe they present more difficulties though, I believe it will create strain on a marriage.

In regards to raising Children, like I said before If both your parents studied the same mathematics text book and one of your parents said 2+2=4 and the other said 2+2=5, What would you think of learning mathematics?

Division creates indifference.

What happens when your kids ask about the Eucharist? will you say “The Eucharist is the body, blood, soul and divinity of Jesus Christ” only to have you wife say “The Eucharist is just a piece of bread.”? What will your kids think? What would you think?

This is just an example of one of the many religious differences that may arise.

Please continue to next post -

 

[josh987654321]

Continued from above post -

Yet, you admit that these opinions are lacking in any sufficient foundation.

You have no personal experience with marriage or children. You have not indicated any special education that would confer such knowledge (seminary, family therapy, etc.). In critiquing other religions you seem to have failed to avail yourself to a basic understanding of their beliefs (Episcopalians & Real Presence, Unitarianism & Christianity).

The greatest cause for concern, however, is your understanding of the Catholic faith as it relates to marriage. That there are two forms of marriage, that our faith cannot be reduced to solely the Eucharist, that the Church recognizes there are “rays of Truth” in other religions - these are all major issues that one must understand before speaking with any authority on the subject.

Okay.

Again I do not doubt your motive was good, but I would urge you in the future to examine why you feel compelled to speak out on both sensitive issues such as this and, most importantly, whether your understanding of the issue is sufficiently informed by your experience, education, or Catholic teaching.

The question you should ask yourself is, why was this issue so sensitive? If I am wrong about everything, than that’s fine, but it’s interesting that you found it sensitive.

I don’t mean to offend you or anything, but I am glad you took exception to my previous posts, because that would mean that you are not content with the things I have mentioned.

When it comes to interfaith marriages, yes I do believe that they can work, but they work even better when on a united front, I believe that it’s very important to be on a united front when it comes to things as important as religion, because like I said before, division creates indifference and it’s important not to be indifferent when it comes to religion, especially for your children.

I don’t mean to downplay your marriage or anything like that, but just imagine how much more fulfilled your marriage will be when you share the same beliefs, when you both share those sacraments such as the Holy Eucharist. I’m hoping this will inspire you (not offend you) to debate religion with your wife, to discuss it with one another, to search for the truth and find it together.

Because by having religious differences, either you have or know something she doesn’t or she has or knows something you don’t.

God Bless

Thank you for reading
Josh

 

[KellyPalmer]

I’m a cradle Catholic. I dated another Catholic guy for 5 years, from age 15 to 20. We talked about marrying when we finished college. He was a great guy and we had a wonderful relationship. Then I met my husband. He was not my type at all. He was not Catholic and was raised in an anti-Catholic home. He was Christian but not practicing and not strong in faith. God sent him to me. The Holy Spirit called me to him. I finally had to stop fighting that and admit that this is what was happening. So I broke up with my Catholic love and gave this new guy a chance. We married the next year. After 7 years of marriage, he converted to Catholicism. He’s been Catholic for more than 5 years now and is very strong in his faith. He’s such a good spiritual leader for our family! We have 3 sons and hope to be blessed with more.

My Catholic ex-boyfriend is now nearing 40 and never got married. He has been cohabitating with his girlfriend for more than a decade. They have posted pictures of themselves smoking pot together on Facebook. They have no kids by choice.

I think I picked the right guy.

 

[Brandall]

This thread was created to share stories of those who are or have been a part of interfaith marriages. In your participation, you have stated both implicitly and explicitly that a marriage that is not founded on a common faith is one destined to fail, interfaith marriage should only be entered into for conversion, and you have questioned the parental wisdom in raising children with a non-Catholic spouse.

.

Not to argue the point but this thread wasn’t created to share stories of interfaith marriage. It was to discourage interfaith marriage.

Regardless, I respect your marriage and your grace when under fire from the inexperienced.

 

[maryjk]

You do have to marry someone whose integrity you trust completely. The vows of matrimony are nothing without that.

Hands down the best way to explain marriage and how to make it work.

Do you trust your spouse completely? Without question? If there is any little nagging doubt, then it won’t matter if your spouse is Catholic or from Mars, there will be problems.

 

[simple_soul]

Hands down the best way to explain marriage and how to make it work.

Do you trust your spouse completely? Without question? If there is any little nagging doubt, then it won’t matter if your spouse is Catholic or from Mars, there will be problems.

I tried to find a Catholic husband. There just always seemed to be something missing from them. What endeared me to my husband was that he was not only loving in a way that was not wanting sex out of me untill he was sure that we were both sure we would be wanting to spend the rest fo our lives with each other but also because he was man enough to stand up for what he believed in and yet open enough to allow his understanding to grow and deepen. I knew he had integrity and I wanted my children to have integrity too. From what I understood I wanted some one who had integrity verses some one who was just a yes man. Now at the time neither of us were going to Church. I eventually wanted to be and was working my way back to the Catholic Church at the time so it was trasuring in a way to find out he had been baptized in the Catholic Faith as a child but never really taught it or raised in it but he was ok with us getting our marriage blessed and raising our children in the Catholic faith. It just seemed like it was one more thing we did have in common. I have not tried to force the faith on him. We just share our understandings of our faith with each other. It is like we are learning our faith with our children. It has been a lot of growing for both of us. I was raised with a supposed understanding of the Catholic Faith and when I compare it to what I was taught and what he was not taught for some reason, while we are learning our faith together, he seems to have a more balanced understanding of our Catholic faith than I do. Go figure.

One thing I do very strongly believe is that in spite of our sinfulness God did lead us to each other and we have been helping each other through so much and I thank God for it daily/

 

[HandyAndy]

Catholic…Non Catholic…Pffft!

I wonder if Jesus were to suddenly appear and begin speaking would the Catholics quickly cordon off the area and charge all the prodo’s to get in. Prodo’s wouldn’t go to listen because it looks like a Catholic show and besides…they won’t miss you at the gate with the fees their charging. Catholics would declare the site holy and build a church whilst the Muslims rushed plans through to build a Mosque on the other side of the street. The natives would declare the grounds to be of cultural significance and Council would need to re assess rates, parking and conduct an environmental impact study and of course we’d need a union official. Everything brought to a halt until all the red tape could be sorted and everyone could agree. Which of course they never would.

I think we would all simply be humbled by his love. Love of his people…his Children.

Maybe not the union official. lol
Just joking.

Our petty worries would matter not. Catholic…Non-Catholic…simply labels.
Catholic means universal. A religion that no longer distinguishes between Gentile and Jew.

Yet…all through this thread it has been happening. We have all been touched with God’s finger print from our very moment of conception. Yes even the Prodo’s. We are all spiritual beings. All on life’s journey back to God. Yes he is there in the Eucharist and yes it is worth the effort to find him there. Marriage celebrates what already exists between two people. They will grow toward Christ in there own time, in there own way with mutual respect and love.
If you marry a dead beat…sorry…you simply married a deadbeat. He was always a dead beat. You will always be your fathers little girl and the man who intends to marry you is already being scored by your father make no mistake about it. No one cares for you more. “A fathers love”.
God brings a lot of people people together…be discerning and choose wisely with the instincts God has blessed you with…what you do after that is up to you.

 

[EasterJoy]

Catholic…Non Catholic…Pffft!

…We have all been touched with God’s finger print from our very moment of conception. Yes even the Prodo’s. We are all spiritual beings. All on life’s journey back to God. Yes he is there in the Eucharist and yes it is worth the effort to find him there. Marriage celebrates what already exists between two people. They will grow toward Christ in there own time, in there own way with mutual respect and love…

…the man who intends to marry you is already being scored by your father make no mistake about it. No one cares for you more. “A fathers love”.
God brings a lot of people people together…be discerning and choose wisely with the instincts God has blessed you with…what you do after that is up to you.

You have me totally uncertain about what you are saying. Be discerning and choose wisely based on what? On what basis would it be right to discriminate against another child of God on their journey back to God? Based on the guy your dad chooses for you? What if your dad is a “deadbeat”? Are you just out of luck? What if he forbids you to marry outside your faith, sight unseen? Is he still the expert on what is best because “no one cares for you more”?

The practical value of your post is escaping me.

 

[_Angelino]

Well, like I said before, there are two facts you should consider.

Does it undermine the viability of your marriage? If your wife subscribes to 2) and you subscribe to 1)? You tell me.

I’ve already given you an answer and supported it with evidence. Please re-read my last post if you didn’t catch it.

Do you have a link where I can read Nostra Aetate? Thank you.

It’s a document from Vatican II. I would suggest starting with vatican.va.

True.

Glad you agree that the statements in Nostra Aetate are true, especially given that the document was written by an Ecumenical Council.

True, but I think you have taken it a bit far to use it as a way of not evangelising. Should we all be Atheists just as long as we keep God’s commandments better than those who believe?

This statement is another cause for concern.

First, nothing that I wrote had to do with evangelization. It had to do with Jesus’ juxtaposition of the actions of the “good” Samaritan to the “pious” Jewish priest and Levite, as well as His indication that the former was more likely to receive salvation than the latter.

Second, your question indicates that you have don’t understand the difference between the 10 Commandments and the Greatest Commandment. I refer you to Exodus 20 and Matthew 22 if this is the case.

Third, after you understand the difference between the two, please re-read and reconsider the hypothetical you posed, as atheists would be able to keep neither the 10 Commandments nor the Greatest Commandment.

I just know that if the roles were reversed, I would not agree to raise my children protestant when I know that they are incorrect about a few things.

You seem to think that the roles can be reversed. They can’t. For reference, please see the Code of Canon Law (c. 1125).

_Angelino_;11001759:

No! This is NOT sufficient foundation for your belief.

The Eucharist?

No, not the Eucharist. Please re-read the two sentences following the sentence that you quoted.

I don’t think interfaith marriages are destined to fail at all, I believe they present more difficulties though, I believe it will create strain on a marriage.

Please cite any evidence (Church teaching, experience, or otherwise) to justify your beliefs.

If you have no evidence, please explain why these beliefs are any more valuable than if a random word generator had created them.

In regards to raising Children, like I said before If both your parents studied the same mathematics text book and one of your parents said 2+2=4 and the other said 2+2=5, What would you think of learning mathematics?

I have already responded to this incoherent analogy. Please re-read my previous post addressing this.

Division creates indifference.

Again, cite evidence or justify why your authoritative statement on this subject is valid or valuable.

The question you should ask yourself is, why was this issue so sensitive? If I am wrong about everything, than that’s fine, but it’s interesting that you found it sensitive.

Sensitivity tends to arise when one feels fit to judge a parent’s decision to marry and raise children with a non-Catholic spouse but fails to know the difference between the 10 Commandments and the Greatest Commandment, let alone what constitutes a Sacramental Marriage.

I don’t mean to offend you or anything, but I am glad you took exception to my previous posts, because that would mean that you are not content with the things I have mentioned

I take exception to your posts because the reasoning applied therein recklessly lacks a basic understanding of Catholic teaching across a broad spectrum of issues; from marriage, to the Sacraments, to the 10 Commandments.

When this is done on a Catholic message board, it looks foolish.

When this is done in public, it misrepresents the faith and embarrasses Catholics everywhere.

 

[josh987654321]

I’ve already given you an answer and supported it with evidence. Please re-read my last post if you didn’t catch it.

Do you mean these?

That would be the Catholic position. Conversely one of a different faith would not feel they were missing out on anything.
josh987654321;11002518:

That’s true, but as I said, you know that she is missing out on it. Just because she doesn’t believe in it doesn’t make it any less real or true.

You seem to be implying that a spouse’s non-belief in the Real Presence undermines the viability of a marriage. This is simply not true as evidenced by the numerous people who have posted here in happy and morally good interfaith marriages.
josh987654321;11002518:

Well, like I said before, there are two facts you should consider.

1. If the Eucharist is true (which it is) than you wife is missing out on that enormous gift where Christ comes down and feeds us with his body, blood, soul and divinity.
2. If the Eucharist isn’t true, than we are committing idolatry.

In saying these things, I don’t think it undermines the viability of your marriage and I only wish to inspire you to continue discussing religion with your wife, simply leave books out for her to read on the true presense in the Holy Eucharist or material from Scott Hahn or something (not to reach ultimatums or expect a conversion “now” so to speak) just don’t be content with “agree to disagree.”

It’s a document from Vatican II. I would suggest starting with vatican.va.

Okay.

Glad you agree that the statements in Nostra Aetate are true, especially given that the document was written by an Ecumenical Council.

Okay.

This statement is another cause for concern.

First, nothing that I wrote had to do with evangelization. It had to do with Jesus’ juxtaposition of the actions of the “good” Samaritan to the “pious” Jewish priest and Levite, as well as His indication that the former was more likely to receive salvation than the latter.

Second, your question indicates that you don’t understand the difference between the 10 Commandments and the Greatest Commandment. I refer you to Exodus 20 and Matthew 22 if this is the case.

Third, after you understand the difference between the two, please re-read and reconsider the hypothetical you posed, as atheists would be able to keep neither the 10 Commandments nor the Greatest Commandment.

Your very post feels like your trying to claim that evangelisation is irrelevant.

**John 6:52-56

52 The Jews therefore quarreled among themselves, saying, “How can this Man give us His flesh to eat?”

53 Then Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you. 54 Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. 55 For My flesh is food indeed, and My blood is drink indeed. 56 He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him.**

In relation to this passage, should we just say “look if you think he is speaking metaphorically and not literally, don’t understand it or have never read it, than that’s fine, because it’s not very relevant, just as long as you love God and love your neighbour?”

I know of a current issue being debated (same sex marriage) where people focus on those two greatest commandments yet get it disastrously wrong. If it were that simple, than the bible would be a pretty short book, I mean why did Jesus even bother with the other teachings?

This passage comes to my mind -

**2 Peter 3:16

16 Paul talks about these same things in all his letters, but part of what he says is hard to understand. Some ignorant and unsteady people even destroy themselves by twisting what he said. They do the same thing with other Scriptures too.**

This is why I say we shouldn’t settle with “agree to disagree.” This is why liberal interpretations of the bible are a bad idea, every different contradictory interpretation is not as valid as the other, when these things were written, only one interpretation was intended and that’s what I want to inspire you to try and inspire your wife to seek.

Thus, there is the truth, why not discuss it like any other issue in which you differ with your wife? to search and find the truth together, because I am not saying your marriage is in a dire state or anything, I’m just saying that there will be even more fulfillment in your marriage when you are on a united front with your beliefs, just don’t think it hopeless to get there or settle with “agree to disagree” for the rest of your life, you don’t have to reach ultimatums or expect her to convert “now” or anything, just don’t do nothing.

Please continue to next post -

 

[josh987654321]

Continued from above post -

You seem to think that the roles can be reversed. They can’t. For reference, please see the Code of Canon Law (c. 1125).

Yes, however if your wife was adament to raise your kids Unitarian Universalists and the Catholic Church didn’t have any objections, than would you ever agree to do that?

No, not the Eucharist. Please re-read the two sentences following the sentence that you quoted.

Yes, there are many different things we differ on with other religions, the Eucharist was just one example.

Please cite any evidence (Church teaching, experience, or otherwise) to justify your beliefs.

Isn’t it obvious, if your divided on issues like religion, when they come into question or under fire or put to the test, how could it not create more strain on a marriage?

If you have no evidence, please explain why these beliefs are any more valuable than if a random word generator had created them.

If a random generator produced my arguments, would it make them any less viable or valid?

I have already responded to this incoherent analogy. Please re-read my previous post addressing this.

Here?

Science and religion are not the same. They are two ways at finding truth. So I would contend that this analogy is inapplicable to the topic at hand.
josh987654321;11001113:

You can’t both be right with completely different contradictory beliefs though.

Again, cite evidence or justify why your authoritative statement on this subject is valid or valuable.

“Division creates indifference.” I think it’s pretty self explanitory, especially when educating others like children.

Sensitivity tends to arise when one feels fit to judge a parent’s decision to marry and raise children with a non-Catholic spouse but fails to know the difference between the 10 Commandments and the Greatest Commandment, let alone what constitutes a Sacramental Marriage.

All I am saying, is that I think your marriage will be even better when you are on a united front with things such as religion, I’m not trying to suggest that your marriage is in a dire state or anything like that.

I take exception to your posts because the reasoning applied therein recklessly lacks a basic understanding of Catholic teaching across a broad spectrum of issues; from marriage, to the Sacraments, to the 10 Commandments.

Okay. Could you please educate me on these things than?

When this is done on a Catholic message board, it looks foolish.

Okay.

When this is done in public, it misrepresents the faith and embarrasses Catholics everywhere.

Well I’m not saying these things in the public arena, I’m testing these theories out here as they make sense to me and thus if I am wrong, than you can simply educate me on these things. I don’t see how I have done anything wrong, people do what they know how to do and when they know better they do better, so please, show me better. Why are interfaith marriages better or equivalent to a united faith marriage?

If you remove all of the other variables and focus on the religion aspect, than I don’t see how interfaith marriages would be better or equivalent to united faith marriages and in saying that, I’m not saying that interfaith marriages are much worse off either, I’m just saying they can be even better when on a united front such as with religion.

God Bless

Thank you for reading
Josh

 

[josh987654321]

.

Don’t settle or be content with “agree to disagree” when it comes to religion, because as I said, someone is right and someone is wrong, we can’t all be right with completely different contradictory beliefs. Your marriage will be even better when on a united front with religion (not saying or suggesting it’s in a dire state now or anything like that, simply saying that there is even better).

Ultimately the goal in an interfaith marriage should be bringing your spouse to the fullness of the truth that you currently share in. I wouldn’t understand anyone in an interfaith marriage who didn’t have such a goal.

God Bless

Thank you for reading
Josh