For any Orthodox Converts: Why did you leave the Catholic Church for the Orthodox Church?

[Mickey]

“Where the bishop is, there is the Church” - at least that’s what one (probably more than one) Church Father said way back when. So you are right, there are lots of Churches within the Orthodox Church because there are lots of Bishops within the Orthodox Church.

 

[Madaglan]

Which orthodox church are you referring?

The same orthodox church that St. Paul addressed when he wrote to the church of God at Corinth, and to the church of the Thessalonians.

 

[StMarina303ad]

The same orthodox church that St. Paul addressed when he wrote to the church of God at Corinth, and to the church of the Thessalonians.

Great answer!

 

[Frank_J]

Hi

With everything that been written in this chatroom ; doesn’t come down to the reason why converts left the Roman Catholic Church.

My view of the Roman Catholic Church it just one big Ford Edsel. Just to give information to the much younger people in the chatroom; Edsel automoble that was built would turn out to be one big lemon the people who would end up buying it.

That best describes the Roman Catholic Religion I think on the nail.

All you have to do, is just look at what the Roman Catholic Church involved in the past 39+ years. I need not list them here for the convert know what I speak of. The Roman Catholic Religion just burned us out and with that we have been able to find Roman is just another left wing protestant religion of the west.

The Roman Catholic Religion has shown me that it is not the faith founded by Jesus. The One True Christian Church found by Jesus Christ is to be found in the Orthodox Church

The Orthodox Church it has never allowed error like the RC Church has allowed to fester.

Just one point I wanted to state.

Have a great day

 

[StMarina303ad]

Hi

With everything that been written in this chatroom ; doesn’t come down to the reason why converts left the Roman Catholic Church.

My view of the Roman Catholic Church it just one big Ford Edsel. Just to give information to the much younger people in the chatroom; Edsel automoble that was built would turn out to be one big lemon the people who would end up buying it.

That best describes the Roman Catholic Religion I think on the nail.

All you have to do, is just look at what the Roman Catholic Church involved in the past 39+ years. I need not list them here for the convert know what I speak of. The Roman Catholic Religion just burned us out and with that we have been able to find Roman is just another left wing protestant religion of the west.

The Roman Catholic Religion has shown me that it is not the faith founded by Jesus. The One True Christian Church found by Jesus Christ is to be found in the Orthodox Church

The Orthodox Church it has never allowed error like the RC Church has allowed to fester.

Just one point I wanted to state.

Have a great day

Thank you for sharing Frank!

 

[Frank_J]

Hi StMarina303ad

Your welcome.

Have a great day.

Frank J

 

[Madaglan]

Hi

With everything that been written in this chatroom ; doesn’t come down to the reason why converts left the Roman Catholic Church.

My view of the Roman Catholic Church it just one big Ford Edsel. Just to give information to the much younger people in the chatroom; Edsel automoble that was built would turn out to be one big lemon the people who would end up buying it.

That best describes the Roman Catholic Religion I think on the nail.

All you have to do, is just look at what the Roman Catholic Church involved in the past 39+ years. I need not list them here for the convert know what I speak of. The Roman Catholic Religion just burned us out and with that we have been able to find Roman is just another left wing protestant religion of the west.

The Roman Catholic Religion has shown me that it is not the faith founded by Jesus. The One True Christian Church found by Jesus Christ is to be found in the Orthodox Church

The Orthodox Church it has never allowed error like the RC Church has allowed to fester.

Just one point I wanted to state.

Have a great day

I truly understand your sentiments and agree with many of them. However, this said, my experience of the Latin Church has been somewhat different.

I’ve long seen the Novus Ordo Mass as “Protestantized,” but never have I seriously seen it as Protestant. For all the debacles of the past 40 years, the Catholics still hold to seven sacraments; they still venerate the saints; they still ask Mary for intercession. They do not have female priests. Homosexuality remains a problem. I, of course, do not overlook the many problems, but I think these still set the Latin Church apart from the Protestant denominations.

For me, it wasn’t so much what happened in 1970 as what happened in 1870, and many of the doctrines built up to that date which contributed to my decision. This said, I did sense a disconnect between the* Novus Ordo *and the liturgy (and theology) that came before it. When I went to the TLM, I sensed much greater continuation–at one TLM, and in one particular moment, Latin theology came together for me. I cannot guess where the ordinary form of the Mass will be in 50 years. Perhaps the Latin Church will slowly transition back to a more traditional form of the Mass.

Latin Catholicism can be very beautiful (just think of Te Adoro Devote, Stabat Mater–hymns far more heavenly than many Methodist tunes). The option of traditional Catholicism was open to me. Ultimately, however, I did not believe the filioque as expounded by Latin theology, nor did I believe in universal jurisdiction. I did believe what the Orthodox (and many Orthodox-friendly Eastern Catholics) professed.

 

[adstrinity]

Homosexuality remains a problem.

Orthodoxy doesn’t have a problem with homosexuality?

 

[Peter_J]

adstrinity,

I’ve long seen the Novus Ordo Mass as “Protestantized,” but never have I seriously seen it as Protestant. For all the debacles of the past 40 years, the Catholics still hold to seven sacraments; they still venerate the saints; they still ask Mary for intercession. They do not have female priests. Homosexuality remains a problem. I, of course, do not overlook the many problems, but I think these still set the Latin Church apart from the Protestant denominations.

I noticed that statement too. But reading it in context, I believe Madaglan is giving it as another example (like “they still ask Mary for intercession”) of how Catholics are not Protestants (many of whom don’t regard homosexuality as problematic).

 

[adstrinity]

adstrinity,

I noticed that statement too. But reading it in context, I believe Madaglan is giving it as another example (like “they still ask Mary for intercession”) of how Catholics are not Protestants (many of whom don’t regard homosexuality as problematic).

Ohhhhhhh. That’s not how I was reading it, but, I can now.

 

[StMarina303ad]

Orthodoxy doesn’t have a problem with homosexuality?

I’m not quite sure where this question is coming from.

Of course Orthodoxy has a problem with all sins, which would include homosexuality.

 

[mtr01]

btw, can you share with me where John Chrysostom, St. Athanasius, or St. Basil or the majority of the voice of the One Holy Spirit in the nonlatin speaking early Churches in Corinth, Ephesus, Phillipi, Antioch spoke of infallibility attributed to the bishop of Rome and called him the “vicar” of Christ?

You can find what you are looking for in the 3rd Ecumenical Council of Constantinople; specifically in the Letter of Pope Agatho. The letter states:

because the true confession thereof for which Peter was pronounced blessed by the Lord of all things, was revealed by the Father of heaven, for he received from the Redeemer of all himself, by three commendations, the duty of feeding the spiritual sheep of the Church; under whose protecting shield, this Apostolic Church of his has never turned away from the path of truth in any direction of error, whose authority, as that of the Prince of all the Apostles, the whole Catholic Church, and the Ecumenical Synods have faithfully embraced, and followed in all things; and all the venerable Fathers have embraced its Apostolic doctrine, through which they as the most approved luminaries of the Church of Christ have shone; and the holy orthodox doctors have venerated and followed it, while the heretics have pursued it with false criminations and with derogatory hatred.

and further states:

For this is the rule of the true faith, which this spiritual mother of your most tranquil empire, the Apostolic Church of Christ [the Roman Church], has both in prosperity and in adversity always held and defended with energy; which, it will be proved, by the grace of Almighty God, has never erred from the path of the apostolic tradition, nor has she been depraved by yielding to heretical innovations, but from the beginning she has received the Christian faith from her founders, the princes of the Apostles of Christ, and remains undefiled unto the end, according to the divine promise of the Lord and Saviour himself, which he uttered in the holy Gospels to the prince of his disciples: saying, Peter, Peter, behold, Satan has desired to have you, that he might sift you as wheat; but I have prayed for you, that (your) faith fail not. And when you are converted, strengthen your brethren. Let your tranquil Clemency therefore consider, since it is the Lord and Saviour of all, whose faith it is, that promised that Peter’s faith should not fail and exhorted him to strengthen his brethren, how it is known to all that the Apostolic pontiffs, the predecessors of my littleness, have always confidently done this very thing: of whom also our littleness, since I have received this ministry by divine designation, wishes to be the follower, although unequal to them and the least of all.

backets and emphasis mine

To which the council wrote back to Pope Agatho that

Therefore to you, as to the bishop of the first see of the Universal Church, we leave what must be done, since you willingly take for your standing ground the firm rock of the faith, as we know from having read your true confession in the letter sent by your fatherly beatitude to the most pious emperor: and we acknowledge that this letter was divinely written (perscriptas) as by the Chief of the Apostles.

The acts of the council can be found here.

 

[StMarina303ad]

You can find what you are looking for in the 3rd Ecumenical Council of Constantinople; specifically in the Letter of Pope Agatho. The letter states: “For this is the rule of the true faith, which this spiritual mother of your most tranquil empire, the Apostolic Church of Christ** [the Roman Church], **has both in prosperity and in adversity always held and defended with energy;”

and further states:To which the council wrote back to Pope Agatho thatThe acts of the council can be found here.

You’ll notice that someone added “[the Roman Church]” in the above quote so as to mislead the readers into thinking that is what the letter was refering to.

 

[Madaglan]

adstrinity,

I noticed that statement too. But reading it in context, I believe Madaglan is giving it as another example (like “they still ask Mary for intercession”) of how Catholics are not Protestants (many of whom don’t regard homosexuality as problematic).

Yes, you are correct. I first wrote “abnormal” but thought this word leaves open the interpretation of “not the norm yet equally as acceptable as the norm.” Plus, the word has harsh connotations.

I also thought about “sinful,” but with that word I would have had to distinguish between the tendency and the act.

 

[Madaglan]

Orthodoxy doesn’t have a problem with homosexuality?

Per my last post, what I meant is that in many Protestant churches homosexuality has attained to a status of acceptability, whereas in Catholicism and Orthodoxy, a person with homosexual tendencies is accepted, but the homosexual tendencies themselves are seen as a deviation from what should be. In both Catholicism and Orthodoxy, homosexual relations are seen as sinful.

So, I meant problem in the sense of acceptance of the sinfulness or misguidedness of homosexuality, not in the sense of actual occurrences.

 

[Isa_Almisry]

So who is your Pope right now?

Pope and Patriarch Theodore II of the Great City of Alexandria, Libya, the Pentapolis, Ethiopia and All Africa
Father of Fathers
Shepherd of Shepherds
Archpriest of Archpriests
The Thirteenth Apostle
Judge of the World.

I’ve always understood that the Pope is only infallible in Faith and Morals. And this infallibility is directed from the Holy Spirit. The Pope himself is NOT infallible. The Pope DOES make mistakes like the rest of us, but the Holy Spirit guides him infallibly when it comes to Faith and Morals. Thats how I understood it.

Problem is that e.g. Lumen Gentium demands assent to the pope of Rome even when he doesn’t speak ex cathedra.

 

[Isa_Almisry]

But all our answers are in the Catechism. If there comes something that is not found in there then Priests do not have the authority to make there own conclusion. If a Priest does, then yes, the Priest could be in error. In Orthodox it sounds like if this situation arises then the Priest will not be in error.

One, the CCC is not even a generation old. What about the prior centuries?

Yes, the priest is in error. And? You speak as if any question can make it up to the cathedra and the pope will issue an infallible decision, which is precisely the opposite of what we are told about infallible pronouncements.

 

[Madaglan]

You can find what you are looking for in the 3rd Ecumenical Council of Constantinople; specifically in the Letter of Pope Agatho. The letter states:

and further states:To which the council wrote back to Pope Agatho thatThe acts of the council can be found here.

The same Council anathematized Pope Honorius as a heretic.

What the Council meant when it did this was recently discussed: forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=247691

 

[Madaglan]

You’ll notice that someone added “[the Roman Church]” in the above quote so as to mislead the readers into thinking that is what the letter was refering to.

It’s interesting the language Pope Agatho uses: he mentions the Apostolic Church of Christ as spiritual mother “of your most tranquil empire.” The letter is addressed to the Emperor and the Empress.

Pope Agatho here is not claiming a motherhood over the other churches. Mother Church seems the more appropriate interpretation.

 

[adstrinity]

Per my last post, what I meant is that in many Protestant churches homosexuality has attained to a status of acceptability, whereas in Catholicism and Orthodoxy, a person with homosexual tendencies is accepted, but the homosexual tendencies themselves are seen as a deviation from what should be. In both Catholicism and Orthodoxy, homosexual relations are seen as sinful.

So, I meant problem in the sense of acceptance of the sinfulness or misguidedness of homosexuality, not in the sense of actual occurrences.

That’s not what I was getting; thank you for clearing that up! BUT, something I’d like to say, few Protestants accept homosexuality. Most of the Protestants say that a person chooses to be gay and can change…which, again, isn’t the side of the Apostolic Churches.